To think that all the people who say "fold your buggy" are being a bit daft?

[Pyjamaramadrama]

I regularly read threads on here about buggies on buses and they get quite heated.

The consensus seems to be that buggies should be folded.

Before anyone says anything I absolutely think that wheelchair users and other disabilities need to take priority for obvious reasons.

However the type of prams for newborns would be nearly impossible for a parent on their own to fold while holding a baby and possibly shopping etc. it's much easier with a toddler who can stand and a stroller which can be easily folded. But you simply cannot put a newborn in a stroller. I'm pregnant with #2 and I've searched for the most compact, easy to fold pram, but I still wouldn't fancy trying to board a bus with a floppy newborn while trying to fold pram and negotiate my bags.

Lucky for me I drive but I can remember being in the predicament with my firstborn of having to get the bus on older style buses and I simply couldn't do it, I had a lie flat pram where the pram needed to be removed to fold the chassis, packs of nappies and formula and newborn ds, I had no Internet access at the time so no online shopping and I ended up in tears once trying to board a bus and dropping everything and the driver and passengers just staring at me.

Also perhaps it is just where I live but all the new buses now have buggy and wheelchair zones so there is room for everyone most of the time.

As I'll say again wheelchair users do come first as ultimately a parent could probably walk if necessary, but why do some people seem to be so against anything which makes new parents lives easier? Maybe they've forgotten what it's like or haven't had to manage the bus alone with newborn.

Oh and my parents and grandparents reckon it was a nightmare with the old buses before buggy zones as they simply couldn't board the bus with a pram.

Its an argument that'll go on and on it seems.
I don't think I've heard anyone say they wouldn't fold or get off if a wheelchair gets on,so imo people who insist buggy users should pre emptively fold should be the ones to do it since they find it so easy,and the others of us will bodge about with the shopping trolleys till a wheelchair user gets on.

Bishops that really is awful.

My Dbs FIL is in a wheelchair (they live in bath) and most days he's driven into bath by his DW so he can go to stroke club, language lessons at college, his appointments and for socialising. However they're loathe to let him get train to London to see his DC who both live here probably due to buses etc. He may manage he may not has done it twice now. This is also when his DW who's a teacher has to be away on school trips and no one else is available to look after him (just bed and bath and morning routine). My Db has more than once drivern to bath to help out with this.

Again when they're in London on the whole they don't dare to use bus/tube etc as bad experiences. Compare when we all went to barcelona for 2 weeks 2 years ago and it's seamless everywhere there.

It really is a chore for him if people don't fold buggies as he can't go anywhere else or has to try to move in an already crowded space!

The problem is that sometimes when their is a buggy in the wheelchair space and someone in wheelchair or sn buggy at the bus stop, the bus driver says there is no room because it is the easiest option. This has happened to several of my friends with disabled children.

It's this argument that babies are like tiny disabled people that is really irksome.

Also..what lambsie said.

What lambsie said is right, not irksome

In fact I think the last time I went on a bus with ds, someone refused to fold their buggy so I had to squeeze ds's sn buggy in sideways which meant it stuck out and he was kicking and grabbing at everyone that walked past.

Op, I know where you're coming from as a regular bus user with children. It can be a nightmare. I'm in Bristol, crappy bus services but generally friendly people, esp for a city. Haven't rtft so may be repeating other's advice but:
Invest in a pram that folds easily. I found my mamas and papas Luna good. Wide when up, but easy to fold (although takes two hands)and carry with one hand. Suitable from birth and not dear (esp compared with the modern ones)
Planning helps, arrive at stop a few minutes early when possible and transfer baby into sling whilst at the stop and get you bags arranged. Rucksacks make far better changing bags than vanity shoulder bag things that are popular now.
Make eye contact and smile when getting on the bus. People are far more likely to give you a hand if you do, and if still no one offers just ask politely. Most people will jump up and help and wont refuse for fear of looking a dick.
Also, if you get a regular bus at similar times like me, people will recognise you and be more likely to help. Especially if you are kind, apologetic (if you get in the way etc) and grateful. Also striking up conversations helps. I've often had a shitty day/experience on a bus but been cheered up by nice fellow passengers. oh, and pay it forward, help out other passengers too, when able!

Oh, and where possible (not always easy m, I know!) avoid rush hour like the bloody plague!!!!

iliveinahouse why would you take a pram on the bus? Use a buggy, one that is specifially designed to fold with one hand.It is possible to hold the baby in one arm and fold the buggy with the other. I've done it many times, even carrying a small amount of shopping (not my whole weekly shop, of course).

Nab unfortunately some people have to drop off babies to childcare in rush hour.

And Fango I don't think anybody has said babies are like tiny disabled people,how could they babies don't have to get themselves from a to b.

Trying to whip up a Disabilist bunfight is a tad unnecessary.People have simply said using public transport with buggies,babies and toddlers is hard.Which it is and likely to get harder as more and more pressure is put on the transport system.

It's this argument that babies are like tiny disabled people that is really irksome.

Exactly this.

There is usually someone on the bus who will hold the baby, nothing will happen to them because you will be standing right next to them. Out shopping on floor, fold pram. Or think on when you are buying your pram and buy one that folds with one hand!

This is what Ilive said Petit so Fanjo is not trying to whip up any argument.

Yes like you say disabled people take priority. No argument but babies are just as vulnerable. They can't walk or get about either, albeit only temporarily, but never the less.

Once I was holding someond else's baby,and the bus driver drove off.
He didn't get too far with all the hollering,but the poor mums face

"Yes like you say disabled people take priority. No argument but babies are just as vulnerable. They can't walk or get about either, albeit only temporarily, but never the less.
It's the fold your buggy/ pram brigade that I blame for mothers feeling isolated and weary to go out."

theres always one on these threads.
its the won't fold the brigade that mean many disabled people end up feeling isolated and weary to go out for life

You need to focus on a lot more than a buggy being able to be folded with one hand when spending several hundred on one.The fact remains you can't base your whole buggy usage and day round 10 minute bus journeys.

Also it's not the folding with one hand but the passing of said baby,toddler and crap,finding new seats etc on a moving bus. Frankly holding a baby and toddlers,shopping bags with one hand on a bus whilst moving whilst folding and lifting a buggy is fool hardy even if you have a miracle buggy that meets all your needs alongside springing into a light foldable package with the tap of one hand.

Yes Ilive said it lePetit.

I await your apology.

In the olden days people managed, yes it could be tricky to have a DC in one arm trying to fold up a pushchair but it was doo-able. When DS1 was a baby I travelled by bus all the time and they didnt have buggy bays. It was considered the norm to fold a buggy...... so people are not being mean when they say 'fold the buggy'....Also many puschairs didnt have folded locks on them. I have been known to hand my baby to the bus driver while I got the buggy on board.

It is nice to have buggy bays though, I have used these with DS2 though some of our buses were mini bus type so still had to fold

If people want buggy spaces on all buses they should campaign for them but people don't bother because it doesn't effect them for very long.

with the likes of mother care payment plans, gum tree, free cycle, ads in paper, nearly new sales, it's now possible to have both now isn't it? Your all singing dancing buggy that cooks your dinner for you to and the cheap umbrella fold that will see you being able to use a bus or train in rush hour far more easily.
hell aldi sold them for like 20 quid at one point.

How do you think those of us who had babies before buses became accessible managed? I'm talking about the 1990s, not the dark ages

This I don't understand. Back then buggies where less complicated usually one catch at the side and they would fold so quickly you risked your fingers. all the prams I had were so easy to fold just lift the pram by handles and 2 rings one on each side of the frame and crash down it goes.

Most of the busses had large luggage racks that you don't see these days,I can remember several buggies/prams at a time fitting in. Drivers used to get out of the drivers seat and help lift as did clippies if the bus had them in genral people were far more keen to hold a baby/small child if asked,and pissed up people tended to get made to get off the bus if they were creating the type of problems that contribute towards sober travellers doing the blank stare ahead and ignore everybody else.

Granted busses these days are easier to actually get on to but they are not easier to use.

The luggage rack in our buses is now mostly taken up by the metro newspaper rack.

Umbrellas don't suit everybody.They're crap with buggy boards and a toddler and baby inside.You can't steer them,they're a nightmare to push and they have a tendency to tip back.You are then left with them all day.

Well no one said kids are easy. dealing with the inconvenience is part of it surely?

Yes I will deliberately choose an inconvenient buggy when there are better alternatives available?