Follow up on last post ref Head/Holidays/Fining System etc

[twinsplus1sfb]

Thanks for all your comments. My experience has obviously fired up a lot of feeling out there. I have read all your points with interest, and I have calmed down. I realise the head had no option to say what she did. I was not suggesting she give me special treatment, merely trying to find another way of her getting her SATS figures. I dont mind if the kids don't do them, what I do mind is that she tells me it will affect the rest of their school career. As I think that is just scaremongering.
I do feel the system has a lot to answer for - and it is the heads and the teachers that feel the brunt of a bad system - Education secretary please note - this system you have at the moment is causing friction. Surely there must be a more creative way to ensure everybody can go on holiday to have quality time with their children/learn about different cultures etc etc without having to pay double. Lay person suggestions: Different authorities stagger their holidays? Each child is allowed 5 days authorised leave per year? Lets make this a positive post and get creative and make suggestions to change the system we have in place at the moment.

LAs, and VA schools have always been able to choose when they set their holidays. And Academies can do so too.

By and large, they don't vary by more than a day or so (except around Easter if it falls very early or very late).

This is because it would be an utter nightmare for people who have children at different schools (or teachers whose children go to different schools). The overlapping weeks would be even busier (and more expensive) than the current situation.

I'm not sure what the answer is, and my children will not miss school, but I agree there is a problem so interesting post.

Different authorities stagger their holidays?

This can create big childcare problems if you have children at schools with different holidays. Terrible if both parents work or have a single working parent.

You can't go on a half term break if all your children do not share the same holidays.

This does happen where I live, school where my DD teaches breaks up a week earlier in July than GCs school and goes back a week earlier. Another school has two weeks for October half term which is very popular, I know some parents there and they say they can get a decent week by going the week before most schools are off and it is even possible to get a good price for the fortnight.

I think that they should be able to authorise 10 days holiday a year at their discretion. They can judge each case on it's merits as to whether they authorise a request or not. Get rid of the stupid fine.

Which is what used to happen until rather than a request it became a right and rather than 10 days it became 12, then 15!

Now, in the main things are much simpler. Holidays are not reasons for authorised absence, if you want to take one in term time, all well and good but beware of the possibility of a fine.

the secondary school here makes it even harder for parents to book a summer holiday. They have to go to school on Monday 20th July and return on Thursday 3rd September. So the first week of the holiday cannot be booked to go away because of one day, and the Bank Holiday week because of 2 days. It leaves 5 whole weeks which can be used. What on earth are pupils going to do for 1 Monday.

I have taken my children out for the odd week but that was a long time ago as mine are teenagers. There is a lot of pressure on heads now, it's all about stats and league tables.

Why are you making it a school problem? Surely the issue you have is with the travel companies and it is they who need to change their policies.

I think schools not authorising holidays except in very special circumstances is right.

That doesn't mean people can't go during term time, but that they can't expect the school to be happy with extra, unnecessary time of school.

If LAs vary their holidays it leads to problems for families with children in two or for parents who work in schools in one and have children in another. I live on the border of two counties and usually holidays are the same apart from one or two days INSET etc. However, this Easter there was a difference of a week which meant that everyone was only off together for just over a week.
This was not as bad as one year when they had different half terms in October.

My daughters are at different schools in the same county and I've worked at a third - I am pleased that their schools don't set their own holidays.

Person all I would like to see a return to the old way. Ht allowed to authorise 10 days holiday as long as general attendance is high. All the HTs I know preferred it too.

Or, how about you have a holiday in this country, or day trips out during the actual school holidays (and there are plenty of them!) like millions of children have done before.

Or, lobby the holiday firms to reduce their prices.

During term time children should be in school and learning. And yes, what they learn at a young age is important for later on.

if your kids secondary school uses sats to predit GCSE results it will be a pain in the arse for all of you for the next 5 years. I can tell you that

I don't think anything should be up to the school's discretion, that's just asking for trouble. I can imagine the threads here if heads let one child have 10 days off and not another! There would have to be very clear guidelines, e.g. a child with 98%+ attendance (or some other threshold) can have 10 days off at non-critical periods, and one with 95-97.9% can have five days. You get the picture.

So if a child get chicken pox after the holiday has been booked making their attendance drop should it be disallowed?

What about children with chronic health conditions? Surely a system like that would penalise them?

Isn't there a distinction between absence for illness and absence for no good reason?

Anyway the numbers are a red herring, the thresholds would obviously have to be carefully thought out and justified. My point is there must be very clear guidelines for heads to make their decision on and it should not be discretionary.

The only other reason would be unauthorised absenses, and if children already have unauthorised absenses then their parents are unlikely to be that bothered about more.

The current system of only allowing in specific circumstances makes most sense to me still.

The current system of only allowing in specific circumstances makes most sense to me still.

That's the system I'm suggesting! Just that the "specific circumstances" need to be clearly defined so there's no scope for the head saying yes to one family because they like them, and no to another family because they don't, or another silly reason.

They are pretty well defined, a head certainly wouldn't get away with giving permission just because they like them.

You must have been informed about the dates of SATs week(s) since the beginning of the school year, particularly Key Stage 1 and asked not to keep children away during that time.
Has your school not held meetings, sent information home, about SATs, put dates up on school website?
If they have not, there is something to discuss with the Head.
I suggest you find out the date for the SATS at the beginning of each school year and keep it free, as you clearly do not think there is anything wrong in children missing school for holidays.
Believe me, it really does affect their performance.

different absence codes for ill health

I'm taking my child out for a two week holiday during term time. I will happily accept the fine. Dd's attendance is good and her punctuality excellent, she has never once been late since starting school four years ago. She also has autism as does my other child. This affects when and where we can go on holiday and in order to have the holiday opportunities that others have in the locations we want to go to then we need to go during term time. I think there's exceptions to every rule and I will take her out in term time as I see fit as I have the sense and awareness to know and judge what works for my own child. I believe these laws will be reversed at some point and it can not come soon enough for me.

But you might find your absence WOULD be authorised as you have an excellent reason why a holiday during term time is necessary. Ditto for children with parents in the armed forces and other occupations where holiday times are STRICTLY limited. That's the sole discretion Heads have now for holiday absebces.

It won't be, they'll request a doctors note, which I think should not be a problem (well I would wouldn't i?) but I doubt my doctor will give me one. Going to try that route though.