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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Follow up on last post ref Head/Holidays/Fining System etc

131 replies

twinsplus1sfb · 19/04/2015 11:11

Thanks for all your comments. My experience has obviously fired up a lot of feeling out there. I have read all your points with interest, and I have calmed down. I realise the head had no option to say what she did. I was not suggesting she give me special treatment, merely trying to find another way of her getting her SATS figures. I dont mind if the kids don't do them, what I do mind is that she tells me it will affect the rest of their school career. As I think that is just scaremongering.
I do feel the system has a lot to answer for - and it is the heads and the teachers that feel the brunt of a bad system - Education secretary please note - this system you have at the moment is causing friction. Surely there must be a more creative way to ensure everybody can go on holiday to have quality time with their children/learn about different cultures etc etc without having to pay double. Lay person suggestions: Different authorities stagger their holidays? Each child is allowed 5 days authorised leave per year? Lets make this a positive post and get creative and make suggestions to change the system we have in place at the moment.

OP posts:

Elisheva · 19/04/2015 20:29

I also agree with heels.

ilovesooty · 19/04/2015 20:31

I think there should be discretion for family events, particularly relating to bereavement where I think putting parents through the stress of possible refusal is insensitive. Also for requests relating to the welfare of children and families with disabilities. And obviously for families where the parents are not allowed to take leave during the holidays.
If the fines are going to be retained the only way to make them effective is to increase them so that it's not cheaper to take the holiday and pay the fine.

NickiFury · 19/04/2015 20:31

I find this "holidays are not a right" argument just so depressing and dour. No they're not but they're bloody great to go on and create life long memories. So let's just agree to disagree Eli and be happy in our own holiday choices.

teacherwith2kids · 19/04/2015 20:32

"No, MY real reason is have two dc with ASD who for various reasons do better when places are quieter in term time."

I do see this - but many, many places are very quiet all year round, because they aren't big holiday destinations. Would seeking one of those out, in perhaps a lesser school holiday such as Feb / Oct half term, or even Easter, be a viable alternative for you as far as your dcs are concerned? or is the point that you want to go to a major destination?

NickiFury · 19/04/2015 20:32

Serious question, does anyone on here know anyone that's actually been fined?

ilovesooty · 19/04/2015 20:33

Yes. I know a parent who has just been fined.

HelloIAmBaymax · 19/04/2015 20:34

I take my children on holiday during term time because DH cannot take time off during any of the school holidays. He also works weekends.
I take the children away by myself during school holidays, but we all need and enjoy time together as a family.
My DD's school have reported us to the EWO for the last 2 years, resulting in £120 fine each year. Our other children's schools have not reported us, so I'm not sure how it really works.

teacherwith2kids · 19/04/2015 20:36

I would say that family holidays are close to being a right - certainly I believe that any family has the right to send a few nights away from home, together, without working, at least once a year and more if possible.

I don't agree that those holidays have to be abroad or glamorous. I have extremely fond memories of hilarious family holidays spent in the most bizarre places - Lancaster as a major holiday destination, anyone?? - because being away from home, with your family, is great and is what memories are made of.

Heels99 · 19/04/2015 20:36

Ilovesooty, but those are exceptional circumstances that would be authorised most likely. Do you know anyone who has been turned down in a bereavement situation?

ilovesooty · 19/04/2015 20:38

No I don't. The person I know who's been fined took her children away during early may bank holiday and is being fined for the Tuesday to Friday she's taken them out of school.

NickiFury · 19/04/2015 20:38

What do you call a major destination? We go to the UAE regularly already because it's not particularly a holiday destination and have family there, Dubai is yes, but not other parts, so it's quite cheap. Unfortunately it's impossibly hot in the summer, up to 50 degrees so impossible to go then. In fact that applies to most holiday destinations during the summer holidays. And yes I do want my children to experience things that others do eg theme parks etc, but they can't cope when they're crowded and with massive queues so I have taken them out of school for that kind of thing. There's also centre parks as mentioned previously, which they would love and they'd be able to be encouraged to try new activities without am audience witnessing a massive anxiety leading to a meltdown.

grannytomine · 19/04/2015 20:39

For people saying teachers can't do it I know a teacher who chose to get married on last Saturday of school holidays and then took a week off for a honeymoon. I remember another teacher having a week off for her silver wedding anniversary. So teachers do manage to take holidays in term time.

NickiFury · 19/04/2015 20:40

I don't know anyone who has been fined though do know a few that holiday in term time. I fully expect I will be this year but I accept that and will pay happily.

beginnerrunner · 19/04/2015 20:41

Not in the majority of schools granny. My school is very understanding but there is no way leave would be granted in term time. I have a lot of teacher friends and none have taken leave in term time or would be allowed to.

ilovesooty · 19/04/2015 20:42

In 23 years of teaching I never came across a teacher having time off for anything like that except on one occasion. The teacher married her terminally ill partner. No honeymoon as he wasn't well enough to travel. She married at short notice on a Friday as his condition worsened dramatically and she had to take the day unpaid.

teacherwith2kids · 19/04/2015 20:44

Nicki,

Since our idea of exotic holiday is self-drive self-catering in non-tourist bits of rural France, 'normal' holiday is rural Scotland or the wilder bits of Pembrokeshire, and my teenage children are deprived creatures who have never been to a theme park, I would think of those as major destinations, yes ... but having lived in Dubai when the oil crisis caused my dad's unemployment in the 1970s, i do know what you mean about the heat!

NickiFury · 19/04/2015 20:46

Nightmare isn't it? We went in August once, thinking "how bad can it be?" Turns out very bad indeed, so bad that we couldn't leave the hotel bad.

I'm also a lone parent so that has an impact on holiday choices as I need to be able to manage alone.

teacherwith2kids · 19/04/2015 20:49

We moved out in the summer holidays when I was a young child. I remember walking out onto the tarmac, thinking the heat was from the airplane engines (never flown before) before realising that was just how hot it was....

1970s air con made few inroads on the genral inside temperature, either.

grannytomine · 19/04/2015 20:54

I agree it isn't usual, I know of those two cases and I'm in my 60s but the point I was making was that it can happen.

My DDs school always break up early for the summer, about a week before other schools I know, sometimes its not a full week early as they always break up on a Friday and sometimes the other schools break up the following Wednesday for example. The last week of the school year is when they do all the school holidays except for skiing obviously. The kids who don't go off to France or Italy or to an activity centre somewhere like Cornwall do activities at school, days out, fun activities at school etc. If people really want to go away for a cheaper fortnight they could miss the fun/trip week so kids not missing educational stuff and get cheaper holidays. My DD always goes away on the first Saturday of school holiday, if she has been on a school trip she gets home on the Friday evening and goes away on the Saturday. It is considerable cheaper just going that one week early. Although after a week with a group of teenagers she is on her last legs.

echt · 19/04/2015 21:14

In Au it's quite usual for teachers to take holidays in term-time, though it has to be approved. I've done it three times.

ilovesooty · 19/04/2015 21:41

Quite a lot of the holidays taken in term time are quite expensive ones where parents are simply booking then to save cash. I think there was a thread a few months back about a 5K holiday to Cyprus. That isn't the holiday of a parent who can't afford to take their children away for family time.

Parents booking holidays in term time just to save money might be discouraged if the fine represented more than the potential saving. I think that's what should happen and any sanction should be applied with absolute consistency. Perhaps then parents genuinely submitting exceptional circumstances would have fewer hoops to jump through.

FiveGoMadInDorset · 19/04/2015 21:50

We can't take holidays in school holidays as a family, we also don't do expensive holidays usually going to sat with friends in Ireland. I take time off work in the summer and I do day trips with dc but never as a family as DH can't get away. We are lucky that we can go to the beach in the evenings but again that depends on guests.

UpNorthAgain · 19/04/2015 21:59

echt where are you?

dixiechick1975 · 19/04/2015 22:16

I think we need to return to a system of regional variation.

In my area of Lancashire until 10 years or so they still had the traditional wakes week - finishing early July. Then back to school mid August and another week off September. Very popular - 2 chances for a holiday outside the peak summer weeks.

There are variations now which allow some chance for a cheaper break. My DD is still off school on Easter hols until Tuesday - all catholic primary and secondary schools around here are a week out of step with the local authority Easter hols. Plus DD gets 2 weeks in October. Her friends school is having an inset week at the end of June - all random training days in one go but a chance for a cheaper holiday. If this works why can't more variation.

Childcare will develop to meet demand in the area. Plus with notice parents can book annual leave - there is no childcare for first week of DD's October break but no one else wants it as hardly any other schools off.

We can't function as a country with everyone only being able to take leave in the same 13 week period. I had a major operation cancelled at Easter as there was no anaesthetic cover at a London Hospital. No coincidence it was school holidays.

What is also glossed over is the fines system only applies to state school.

Private schools have longer holidays so chance to travel outside peak dates. DD's school also have a policy of publishing exam week etc well in advance as a date to avoid for holidays but otherwise as long as attendance/work good authorising sensible absences without fuss. A day or two tagged on before a half term for example will be authorised.

Farahilda · 19/04/2015 23:52

Paying £9-33k per child per annum in private school fees to save a few thousand off a holiday seems a bit of a false economy.

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