to be amazed at how many people are still having 4 or more children?

[JackShit]

Yikes! I'm going to get a new one ripped here, but this has been bugging me of late.

Our planet isn't in a particularly marvelous state. Overpopulation is a very real problem. We are responsible for the legacy we leave our children and surely part of loving them is to be concerned for their future quality of life on this planet.

I know there are a lot of people with larger families on MN and I need to understand why, in full knowledge of the facts, people continue to have so many children? Just read a thread on facebook where a woman was proudly stating she has 11! 11 ffs!

I don't go for the argument about some having only one or two so it cancels out and I also don't believe in replacing our ageing population problem with an even bigger one.

So what am I missing here? Do people just not really give a shit? Does biology take over?

I have 1 btw.

Agreed Squoosh. The OP conceded ages ago that her original premise was wrong and born out of guilt at not being able to give her child a sibling. Why are people still putting the boot in?

I have four.
Perfectly happy with my choices

That's pretty out of order towards the OP, fredfred.

And of course, while you may be a "lentil munching, Eco warrior superwoman", you have no idea what your children will grow up to do, either to the environment or for the environment.

I adore my 4DC - two of whom are twins. What a terribly judgemental and ignorant post OP. I think you're carrying a rather large chip on your shoulder. Funnily enough we are a lot more aware of our environmental footprint than some of our acquaintances with fewer children..... Work that one out.

I grew up 'technically' as an only. (I do have siblings, but not one whole one, and went through the care system, so never grew up with them)

I had an interesting childhood and always knew I wanted a big family.

I have five.

I have no regrets, and I refuse to justify it.

You can be as "aware" of your environmental footprint as you like, raspberry, but if you get annoyed at people like the OP even raising this as a discussion, then you are still part of the problem. Of course it's "judgemental" - it's important to exercise good judgement on this, as with all things that affect the world around us, and it can be very helpful to discover what that good judgement might be for each of us by exploring all the options and decisions open to us, and the wants and needs that lead us to these decisions.

(And I don't know why you declare that you adore your DCs. What's that got to do with it? Are you expecting anybody to declare they don't, and that they will smother them forthwith for the sake of the environment?)

ArcheryAnnie: you ask me why I declare that I adore my DCs as if it's irrelevant to the OP's original question. What I guess I'm trying to convey is the fact that the OP is talking about actual, living breathing human beings who are already on the planet! They are not statistics - they are people. I just find the OP insensitive in her condemnation of the choices other people make. She actually says 'Do people just not really give a shit?'. What simplistic reasoning. Of course it's fine to have this sort of argument but the OP and yourself should realise that people can't always plan for the amount of children they have - some people have multiple births, some have a contraception failure and don't choose to have a termination. Life is complex and I just find people like the OP and yourself rather patronising.

I adore mine. So what?

And it's because our DCs are living breathing people, and I would like them to continue to live and breathe as long as possible, that I think honest conversations about what we are and aren't willing to do to protect the environment are necessary.

I haven't read the whole thread because - well, you know. Nearly 600 posts. So probably someone has already said this - but if not, here goes...

From a societal point of view the best way to support our ageing population is by having more children, and thus creating a bigger "young" population to pay taxes and National Insurance and to support us in our old age.

Oak other people have said that, and the counter-argument is that dooms us to an ever-larger population every generation, to pay for the one before, which just isn't sustainable.

Not necessarily, though. You don't need an expanding population, just a stable one - one without a bulge at the top.

Also, when you think of it, some people choose to have big families, some people choose to have no children. In this country it pretty much balances at the moment.