to be amazed at how many people are still having 4 or more children?

[JackShit]

Yikes! I'm going to get a new one ripped here, but this has been bugging me of late.

Our planet isn't in a particularly marvelous state. Overpopulation is a very real problem. We are responsible for the legacy we leave our children and surely part of loving them is to be concerned for their future quality of life on this planet.

I know there are a lot of people with larger families on MN and I need to understand why, in full knowledge of the facts, people continue to have so many children? Just read a thread on facebook where a woman was proudly stating she has 11! 11 ffs!

I don't go for the argument about some having only one or two so it cancels out and I also don't believe in replacing our ageing population problem with an even bigger one.

So what am I missing here? Do people just not really give a shit? Does biology take over?

I have 1 btw.

Coming late to this thread, but the overriding theme seems to be 'I will do what I like irrespective of the consequences for the wider world'. 'And how dare anyone challenge me?'

Jack you clearly stated in your op that you had read a thread on facebook where a poster proudly stated she had 11 kids so obviously was directed at a specific individual.

It ain't what you do but the way that you do it. Walk a mile and worry less. Don't cap how many kids you have based on what you think others might think. It only takes one person to change big things, good or bad. I stopped at two because I started at 35, had I started younger, I might have had more, I wanted to be young enough to be around hopefully for a significant part of their lives. This may or may not work.
As for their impact on the environment, get rid of you car and your tumble dryer.

I have 4 beautiful kids and no not planned but they are all equally loved. Because you have one that's your choice. Shock horror for us wanting kids but who the feck are you to start up a stupid thread like this who clearly is aimed to.a single person your silly individual. I hope you don't raise your dc to have the same quality's as you.

Thanks for that. Not aimed at a single person at all and to most reading I'm sure that's obvious...it was just an example in my op.

It is more environmentally friendly for one family to have 4dcs than 4 families to have 1dc.

My family has been small for generations. I'm giving us a well needed boost!

If you read the thread you may see that I have already taken a sufficient beating, not sure there is any need to carry on kicking.

Posts like JackieHarris are really helpful - I can really see the argument there about one large family vs. four small.

...but all the vitriol and posts about what an awful person I am don't add anything I'm afraid.

After three children, no state funding for anything whatsoever.

BOOM.

I sort of lost interest in the thread when someone compared humans to animals having litters and "there not being too many animals running around" or whatever. If that's the level of intelligence we're working with, then there's just no point.

whichever poster said that - it could indeed be an excellent parallel. If we didn't have medicine. Or if we were allowed to drown excess children we didn't want. Or if we hunted humans to keep their numbers down. Or if we didn't have access to food and water more than wild animals. Oh, and if we weren't the apex predators of our planet with nothing really preying on us.

BOOM... Is that to keep up with the pom pom waving .... Feel like I'm at a cheer comp. 1,2,3,4 big families rock thats for sure.... Waves pom poms

Coming late to this thread, but the overriding theme seems to be 'I will do what I like irrespective of the consequences for the wider world'. 'And how dare anyone challenge me?'

VirginiaTonic has it right. What people do that affects others is everyone's business. It is reasonable that we be allowed to discuss this without being abused. People here are saying just talking about the impact of large families is "rude", but, eg, taking that large family on a long haul flight to florida for a holiday affects my future and the future of my DC in the real world and so I should be allowed to talk about it.

And all those of you with big families who don't drive, eat meat, etc - you might do that now, you can't guarantee your DCs will follow in your footsteps when they are adult.

And the "tax for elderly population" thing is a red herring. You cannot know if your grownup DCs will be net taxpayers, and anyway that thinking would doom us to infinite population growth each generation.

VirginiaTonic - Yea, that seems to be about the size of it!

People used to have big families because:

a) No reliable contraception and
b) Infant mortality was so high.

We don't have these reasons any more. There's no excuse other than "I don't care and will do what I want". Which let's face it, has never been the best argument.

Most of the planet is water. Of the land available, only a portion is actually habitable. The sahara alone is almost as big as China. Not exactly somewhere people can live. To accomodate huge numbers of people we either have to completely destroy forests and other natural areas to house them, or cram every more people into cities, which leads to increase in disease and poor living conditions. Agricultural lands have to expand, which cuts into territories of other animals, and essentially wipes them out.

Or should people be allowed to completely destroy eco systems, leads other creatures to extinction simply because "I want another cwute widdle baby"

I know the lady in the original post personally and I can tell you she's an absolutely fantastic mum to each and every one of her kids. She's not on benefits, not state fueled, pays her own rent and council tax etc

Does she get tax credits? If not, fair enough. Anyone can have as many children as they like as long as they pay for it themselves.

I have 4 beautiful kids and no not planned

I have zero comprehension how anyone can have 4 unplanned children in this day and age. Does it not keep you awake at night how you will pay for school trips, uni, weddings, cars, house deposits? It keeps me awake and I have one!

Dixie the options aren't "one family with 4 DCs flying or four families with one DC each flying". The other three hypothetical families wouldn't magically cease to exist just because the fourth has more children.

I wanted three, was able to have them and so I did. I felt my family was as I wanted it to be then.

Dixie I don't think it's ok for anyone to fly to Florida unless there is a bloody good reason. I don't fly for this reason, as I cannot square my desire to have a longhaul holiday with my fervent desire to not shit up the planet.

But you are not paying attention to the maths. I am saying that many families will fly anyway, however many children they have, and the more children in each family, the bigger impact.

Archery

who decides what a bloody good reason is?

jenny, not everyone with 4 will be struggling to pay for them. As I said earlier, we have 4 but didn't start having any until late 30s as I wanted to make sure we were financially secure before having children. That might have meant I'd left it too late to be a mother but that was a risk we were willing to take. Because I actually thought through the economic impact of having children. If even 1 had been a financial struggle, I would have remained childless. So not all parents of 4 are financially feckless and plenty with 1 or 2 are.