What do you think… is this an appropriate present for a 4-year-old?

[drkg]

Back-story: we work really hard to promote a gender-neutral environment at home. We’ve made a few complaints to nursery regarding this (e.g. girl-only activities for 3-year-olds). There’s only one term left.

This week: Our DD, for her 4th birthday, opened a Monster High doll. We had no idea what these were before, just saw a box, marked age 6+, inside a doll with make-up, short skirt, ridiculous body proportions, that looks both scary and yet sexy…

It was from her nursery teacher. We’re not sure if the nursery paid or if it was personal present. We were horrified with it and have stashed it away. (DD had no idea what it was and hasn’t missed it yet). DH thinks we should say nothing at all to nursery teacher. But, I feel awkward not saying thank you. DH argues that a thank-you is false and that if we say anything, we should mention we felt it was inappropriate. I can’t bring myself to do this.

I know this is minor. Don’t beat me up! But I really believe it is important to deliver positive messages to little ones and although I don’t think these dolls directly create anorexia or the like, I do find them sickly and they don’t seem to me to represent the values that I hold dear. I’d rather not have them in my house if I can help it. But I’m opening up to MN to hear other opinions. Are DH and I BU to feel uncomfortable with this present? Anyone else think it is inappropriate from a nursery teacher? And what should I do?

"Numerous threads on MN about how girls should wear boys shoes, shorts, trousers etc, why can they not just wear shoes, shorts or trousers."

Because, in general, if you want shorts that come to knee length, you will only find them in the boys' section. If you want SHORT shorts that come perilously close to sharing knicker colour with the world then, indeed, the girls' section is your oyster. And virtually no shops have a unisex section.

Case in point -- H&M (just because there's one near us, so I shop there fairly often). In the boys' section there are fifteen sets of shorts, ranging from just above knee length to just below. In the girls' section there are fourteen sets of shorts. One pair is above-the-knee (and that is shorter than any of the shorts in the boys' section, and they look quite tight). All the others are mid-thigh or shorter. In the unisex section (what I assume you mean by "just wear shorts") there are no sets of shorts, because there isn't a unisex section. Nor is there a unisex section in GAP, or Next, or Sainsbury's, or Tesco, or Asda, or Primark.

I would also thank key worker/nursery then up to u what u do with it.
personally im not keen on MH dolls, dd1 asked for them at 5 I said no only because she never plays with the barbie dolls she has and I thought they were for older children.

However dd2 (2.5) got a load of my little pony dolls and superhero figures for xmas which she loves and plays with together. this afternoon twilight sparkle and anna (frozen) were sharing the bath with iron man....

Fizzycola yes Barbie does come in different colours if you search high and low or are willing to pay a premium. Also although her colour maybe different her features are not.

OP, I think you're reading too much in to it. I sincerely doubt the teacher went out and bought the doll specifically for your daughter, knowing your gender neutral preferences and your daughter's age.

Like many parents do, (once their kids reach the age of having whole class birthday parties every other weekend) I suspect a member of the nursery staff hit Toys R Us during the sales and stocked up a cupboard with whatever was cheap and available. When your DD's birthday rolled around, she grabbed whatever toy was at the top of the pile, and job done. Say thanks and move on. You have many, many more years of shit gifts ahead of you.

But saucyjack literally no one in this thread has suggested that you can't paint your nails or conform in any other way to gender stereotypes and be a strong independent women. By the way, I also do not you'll find any example of an anti-pink campaigner saying that liking pink means that a girl or woman is stupid.

Wrt this thread in particular, a woman has said that she prefers a gender neutral environment for her child and has been attacked for it. Do you also think that it's ok to attack vegetarians on the grounds they're being disdainful towards meat eaters?

I imagine the teacher hadn't a clue what to buy your daughter and she tried hard to find something that wouldn't offend, the result being a toy which focuses on 'embracing people's differences'.

Had it been a non doll toy which aimed for these values, she'd probably have been spot on. She simply misinterpreted your point of view, nothing more. Of course you should thank her.

I think it means you've put on weight. It's because they notice the difference and the second of extra looking that causes makes it inappropriate to say nothing...so they something kind.
IMVHO.

Ha ha sorry!
Wrong thread.
Carry on carry on

That's a relief clever cos if someone buying your kid a MH doll meant you'd put on weight, then I must be Dawn bloody French

I think you're being deliberately obtuse mellowjello

It isn't possible to ban gender-stereotyped girls' toys without making a negative value judgement about traditional female interests. The latter is a natural conclusion of the former.

Unless you're suggesting that someone is banning things entirely at random. Which I don't believe is the case here.

Monster High dolls are bloody awful. Equally awful would be not having the courtesy to say thank you.

You "work hard" on gender neutral and that's fine, it's your bag. Others don't and that is actually fine too.

Personally I dont have a problem with dolls, or pink.
I think a balance is good.
But a doll that is "sexy" for a 4 yo? No. I dont htink that is a good idea.
Young children dont perceive things in the way that adults do. But the sexualisation and objectification of girls is insidious. So they dont see it as sexy, but they do learn to view the cultural stereotype of sexy as normal and rapidly live up to that expectation.

I really struggle to see why Barbie is a bad role model given that Barbie is actually an inanimate object.
Barbie TV shows and films really promote friendship, hard work, stop bullying, family values etc and always have a message. Barbie always has fun, interesting, exciting adventures with Her friends and has had a huge variety of careers. But obviously the only thing that matters is that she is skinny and blonde so she must be bad and anti feminist, obviously.

"It isn't possible to ban gender-stereotyped girls' toys without making a negative value judgement about traditional female interests."

Yes it bloody well is. It's quite possible, for example, to ban gender-stereotyped girls' toys and teach your children to cook and bake and sew and dance and do arty crafty stuff and whatever else you're classing under "traditional female interests". It's quite possible to ban gender-stereotyped toys on the basis that they are stereotyped rather than for the activity itself (so "every girl's sparkly-warkly princessy-wessy baking set with lots of pictures of girls-and-only-girls baking" would be a No, but that doesn't mean that there's anything wrong with baking. Or even with pink icing)

(Similarly, for what it's worth, "Super gross testosterone-laden science stuff for Boys" would be a no, but there's nothing wrong with a chemistry set).

Barbie's huge variety of careers has included "Computer Engineer" (yes, that's an actual page from Mattel's official Barbie "I Can Be A Computer Engineer" book)

And there was an interesting Oregon State University study last year that raised some interesting questions (Sherman A. M. & Zurbriggen, E. L. “Boys can do anything:” Effect of Barbie play on girls’ career cognitions. Sex Roles. doi: 10.1007/s11199-014-0347-y -- I don't think there's an abstract available online, although you'll find plenty of media takes on the results. In the absence of an abstract, the OSU press release at least outlines what they did although doesn't give any details on sample size etc.)

I remember the 'Computer Engineer' book. Wasn't it widely derided cause Barbie makes a mess on things and has to get her boyfriends to sort things out for her?

Desirn you're wrong. You can get all the multi-cultural Barbies on amazon. And the features are different - you just need to see one to know that. Clearly you've never seen them or you'd never have said "all white Barbies".

For anyone missing the point of Yve's post, read the text on the Barbie 'engineer' picture. It's beyond parody. As someone who writes software (scientific to boot) that one really makes me cross.

sorry op this sis a bit of a side track - photos of Asian and African American Barbies:

I would have been anti-MH when my daughter was 4.
She saw and wanted one at 5.
She's 6 now.

She's quite obsessed with bats and vampires. Loves Hallowe'en. She's a junior member of the Bat Conservation Trust. When she plays vampires at school, it's mostly with the boys as they're more interested. Last weekend she ate her lunch in our attic as "that's where bats live".
She asks me to help her google bat and vampire facts. She's really interested in clothes, and designing - but it's about costume, not looking pretty. Every outfit she has designed in her sketch book has been full length and with cape. The only low cut dress she drew, she told me it was for breast feeding

I thought she would see "pretty doll".
She actually sees something exciting and different.

I'm not saying I don't understand and share some concerns. But the interests these dolls have for her are not about pouting in sexy clothes. And I didn't predict that.

Both my DD and my DS love the dolls which have evolved from My Little Pony so they have two each. Gender equality. And my DS has an Anna and Elsa soft doll collection that my DD wasn't that keen on.

Of course you have to say thank you. Unless you want to teach your dd to be extraordinarily rude.

As others have said I suspect the nursery teacher bought a job lot of them & gives them out a presents routinely. At my sons' nursery they always had books for a birthday present because the owner could buy them in bulk cheaply.