To think that the society we live in is no less misogynist than it ever was?

[lottieandmias]

I have had the misfortune to come across several accounts on Twitter whose only purpose seems to be to belittle women, say that women are all 'hoes' all deserve to be cheated on and disliked and used for sex. These accounts have in some cases, hundreds of thousands of followers.

Where do these views come from? It just makes me very sad as I have 3 dds. I hear an increasing number of much younger men expressing these kinds of views. It's a general problem I think. And I fear for what the future holds for my dds in relationships ð???

What can we do about this? Do parents not feel a responsibility to instil in their sons or indeed in their children generally that this sort of thing is not ok. In the same way that racism is not ok...

I put the mysogynists in the 5 % of people who generally hate anyone who isn't them, are anti-social and have either a neurological or behavioural issue that makes them this way. The vast majority of people don't realise they are being sexist, but probably are to some extent due to our current cultural view on gender eg. girls play with this, boys with that, throwing like a girl, big girl's blouse etc etc. We will always have that 5 % of people who are quite happy disliking everyone who isn't them.

Well another example is dating sites. Personally, I have found that hatred is only bubbling slightly below the surface. On various occasions a man has messaged me and if I don't reply, I suddenly get another message saying 'oh well, you look like a total slut anyway'. This has happened more times than you would think.

Bumbley I know what I said, I was the person who said it. And yes, that does happen.

Now, please, yes or no answers to the questions I asked.

Although, I won't hold my breath because past experience tells me you just want to derail the thread.

I'll answer questions how I want to thanks Saskia. :) I can read what you wrote and I stand by my opinion that it's a very negative view to have. Backtrack all you like with your "oh but it can happen."

Popalot - I do agree to some extent. Most people I know who are nasty misogynists also tend to be racists and devoid of any kind of empathy for anyone.

But my 11 year old daughter has a massive issue with gender stereotyped clothes and toys. This is not really due to me banging on about it at home - it's her own view which she often expresses. She also complains when her classmates snigger at the Mandarin teacher's accent. So if she's capable of taking these things on board then any adult can as well and if they refuse to then it's because they don't want to.

I didn't can, I said does. And yes, you can answer a question any way you like, but if you appear to be prevaricating, then I reserve the right to think you aren't genuine and may have an agenda.

However, to make it easier for you, I'll rephrase the question: According to the Ministry of Justice, approximately 85,000 women are raped each year in the UK. Do you think that happened to them because they were women, or do you think that happened for some other reason?

www.rapecrisis.org.uk/Statistics2.php

What may be said online to you now under the cloak of anonymity would have been said to your face at work in the 70s.

Unless you were growing up then you can have no idea how much better things are now.

Sure there's a hell if a way to go but there's no comparison. Far far better now.

I guess they are raped/murdered 'because they exist' in the sense that people who don't exist can't be raped or murdered can they? Men can only be raped and murdered too if they exist.

"approximately 85,000 women are raped each year in the UK. Do you think that happened to them because they were women, or do you think that happened for some other reason?"

What an odd question. Do you think men who are raped by other men are raped because they were men or for some other reason?

I would say that yes, men who are raped are targeted because the rapist has a deep loathing of them and considers them to be in some way lesser. Why do you think rape happens?

"I guess they are raped/murdered 'because they exist' in the sense that people who don't exist can't be raped or murdered can they? Men can only be raped and murdered too if they exist."

There you go prevaricating and being disingenuous. You know exactly what I mean when I say exist, please don't pretend otherwise.

Surely then the argument should be that people are raped because the rapist thinks that person is lesser than them and that they are some how 'entitled' to do what they want to that person rather than saying it happens because they are a particular sex?

Or murdered...

"So that means that a group that is overwhelmingly male (rapists) sees a group that is overwhelmingly female (rape victims) as less than them. That's misogyny.

If it wasn't gendered we'd have equal numbers of male/female victims."

This ^ And I think when men are raped it is likely to be a way of othering them.

We can agree to disagree if you like :)

lottieandmias

Sorry ManofSpiel, I think you're talking nonsense. And prejudice directed at men (not that I would agree with that either!) cannot be compared because women are at the biggest disadvantage from the outset - women have been subjected to oppressive treatment since the dawn of time. Men have always had the upper hand. And they still earn more.

Why is it nonsense? You're claiming that sexism is often misogyny and I disagree.

Prejudice is prejudice, irrespective of gender. It is merely an opinion, a preconceived judgement. It doesn't have greater weight coming from a man, just because of events that took place since the dawn of time.

How do you propose to measure it anyway in order to validate your claim?

The original question was whether misogyny is any different than it used to be. Personally I think not, that the title is inflamatory and is insulting to all the positive work that's been done over the years.

There have been a fair few posts since I logged on this morning and I can't believe that bumbleymummy has been completely taken out of context.

I don't think anyone is disputing that there are men out there that genuinely hate women (as there are probably women that hate men) I would just disagree with the premise that so many men hate women just for existing.

Sorry I can't comment on whether bumbley hates women or not. I've not read through her past posts on other threads but on this one alone I can't say I draw the same conclusion.

Anyway, I don't see what the government is doing that promotes a society wide hatred of women. Naturally I cannot speak from a woman's perspective but as a man I don't get the messages, subliminal or otherwise, that promote the systematic discrimination of women.

If they are sending them out then they're going straight over my head (along with many other men). Therefore I'm not playing the game and would refuse to in any case.

You really can't see that women are disadvantaged compared to men in any way? Not at all?

Where on earth did you conclude that from my posts? Of course I can see.

But to be honest we don't get to choose what we benefit from in society do we? The best that can be expected is that we're mindful of whatever cards are handed to us and do our best not to impose on others.

What would you have me do?

?Misogyny means hatred of women, it's not synonymous with lack of women's rights or status?.

I think women have more rights and status than in the past, but this has not been accompanied by a decrease in misogyny.
Possibly men hate us even more now that we are not so far beneath them??