To think that the society we live in is no less misogynist than it ever was?

[lottieandmias]

I have had the misfortune to come across several accounts on Twitter whose only purpose seems to be to belittle women, say that women are all 'hoes' all deserve to be cheated on and disliked and used for sex. These accounts have in some cases, hundreds of thousands of followers.

Where do these views come from? It just makes me very sad as I have 3 dds. I hear an increasing number of much younger men expressing these kinds of views. It's a general problem I think. And I fear for what the future holds for my dds in relationships ð???

What can we do about this? Do parents not feel a responsibility to instil in their sons or indeed in their children generally that this sort of thing is not ok. In the same way that racism is not ok...

But misogyny to me is part of the same process - there is a template of actions that all women can take that are OK (allowing the misogynist to say of course they don't hate women), and any step beyond that line is punished not because of the individual but because they have moved outside the acceptable female template. Extreme misogyny just means the acceptable actions are incredibly limited (quiet breathing, cleaning, low self-esteem) and may change without warning. Other levels will mean that actions like going out at night, being an averagely poor manager, gaining weight will be punished in some way. The difference to the woman involved is the level of punishment the sexist/misogynist metes out - the silent treatment at home, derogatory comments on Twitter, or violence?

Suspended because he 'threw a punch at a man'.

Surely he was suspended because he threw a punch at a producer. Their gender is irrelevant. JC is able to be a twat to all genders if he puts his little mind to it.

Meditrina - yes I agree with what you say but what concerns me is not so much what we're legally entitled to do, but a growing sense that women are all 'whores', are to be despised and treat men badly. They aren't worth having relationships with because they all have nasty intentions. And the only think they're good for is sex. And as others have said, it's in the media every day.

A girl I went to school with is now quite a high profile feminist. Whenever she speaks publicly about issues that affect women she gets abuse in the form of people threatening to rape her.

"There are do some women out there who really really hate men too. "

There might well be, the difference is that hatred doesn't translate into groups of women threatening to rape and murder men for the crime of, well, existing.

Or standing outside hospitals attempting to deny men access to legal medical procedures.

"but a growing sense that women are all 'whores', are to be despised and treat men badly. "

Where do you live? I haven't noticed a growing sense of that at all.

"women threatening to rape and murder men for the crime of, well, existing. "

For existing? Really? You don't think you might be putting a slightly negative spin on this at all?

No, I don't. You can be as dismissive and patronising as you like Bumbley, it really doesn't bother me because it's coming from someone who doesn't believe women should have autonomy over their own bodies.

Yes, Saskia. Not surprisingly, many people who identify themselves as feminists don't agree with a woman having total autonomy over her body either.

Regardless, I think it is a bit negative to think that women are threatened with rape and murder simply because they exist. You are, of course, entitled to think otherwise.

I live in a very middle class area of the UK and I hear it from teenage boys, men in their early 20s and upwards. And yes even women collude in it as well. But if you choose not to notice it then of course you won't be aware of it. If I had a son I would consider it my responsibility to try to instil a more healthy attitude.

It's not negative - it's a fact.

I don't choose not to notice it. I genuinely haven't noticed it. I don't think I know any man who thinks women are whores, despise and think they're only good for sex.

I don't think it's a fact at all.

Poppy -

It would have been around 1988-ish, at a book signing in Cambridge. I was there with my male partner.
Wandered into a book shop without realising the odious little creep was there promoting one of his 'books' (maybe they were just setting / packing up for the day?).

One of 'his people' sidled up to me and said: 'Jeffrey likes pretty things in red'. I just looked at this man, wondering what he could possibly be talking about. He gestured to the red silk suit I was wearing. I still stood there like a numpty, so he said: 'Would you like to have your picture taken with Mr Archer, the famous author?'. I said: 'no, thank you'. And the creepy aide said: 'well, he'd like his picture taken with you...'.

I spotted the odious one making a beeline for me and hopped it, sharpish!

You know the scene in the Harry Potter film where the vain Professor
is doing a book signing in a bookshop in Diagon Alley and he grabs HP for the publicity and then dumps him back in the crowd? It is what JA intended (not that I'm famous but I was young blonde and 'nubile' at that point)

Never could understand how the 'fragrant Mary' could stomach him, tbh.

Having typed it out,
I suppose 'what that creep Jeffrey Archer said to me' is a bit misleading, sorry! But the whole 'pretty thing in red' was sleazy and I have no doubt this was not just a case of a slightly sleazy aide, it was clearly a method of behaving towards women that Jeffrey approved of.
I have no doubt he would have said vile things if I hadn't hotfooted it though!

I do believe that there is a huge undercurrent (that bubbles up to the surface on a daily basis) of aggression against women.

Yes, laws have been changed and rights improved since the 1970's.

But have they not just taken away Legal Aid for women trying to divorce?

And goodness knows what Farage would do if he got a sniff of power.

I actually think it's worse.

"Not surprisingly, many people who identify themselves as feminists don't agree with a woman having total autonomy over her body either. "

If they believe that then they aren't feminists no matter how they identify. Last time I checked, bodily autonomy was pretty integral to the whole concept of feminism.

And yes, I do think negatively about rape and murder. I really can't see how anyone could put a positive spin on either. Oh, and if you don't believe those things happen, I suggest you spend less time obsessing about what women do with their reproductive organs and pay a bit more attention to what is happening in the world.

Quite, Saskia.

Really? You wrote the rule book for being a feminist did you?

I haven't said anywhere that I think rape and murder don't happen. It was the because they exist part that I thought was negative as I'm sure you are well aware.

I went on another forum and posted something and it was 'shut up you dopey woman, are you even good looking'? LOL.

It's kind of daft thing to say anyway really. You couldn't be raped and/or murdered if you didn't exist. I guess men get murdered because they exist as well then?

interestingly that prostitute that Jeffrey paid off even though he had not slept with her, died in a road traffic accident.

Bloody hell, Sunny, do you think it was not a co-incidence?
didn't know about that story?
Ugh!

Do you have a link?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monica_Coghlan

I have no idea dopeydawg.

Bumbley So you genuinely don't believe that women are ever attacked solely because they are women?

You believe that every time such a crime is reported it's just made up negativity?

Oh, yes/no answers will suffice.

I didn't say that but then neither did you. You said "hatred doesn't translate into groups of women threatening to rape and murder men for the crime of, well, existing. "