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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Aibu to think the parents of the Syria girls need to take a bit more responsibility?

374 replies

exmrs · 09/03/2015 08:19

On the news today the parents are demanding an apology from the police as the police knew apparently a friend of theirs had already gone to Syria and the police didn't contact them.
I find it strange that they don't take a bit more responsibility to the situation.

Why didn't they know what was going on in in their daughters lives?
They are the parents and they seem to blame everyone but themselves or the girls.
To blame the police is ridiculous , the girls made the choice to go

OP posts:
Whereupon · 10/03/2015 10:56

The police made a stupid mistake. The parents are entitled to make a fuss about it. If I were in their place I would be angry about it too. Are people not allowed to complain about a mistake by the police unless that is the only cause of what has happened to them?
I feel a strong undercurrent of "they're foreigners lucky to be allowed to live in our wonderful country which is so much better than where they come from and should shut up rather than complain".
And some posters are going further and strongly implying that the parents are members of IS and actively sent their daughters to Syria, while trying to fob off the UK authorities into giving them public money, which they are no doubt expected to send to IS. This is pure fantasy.

MorrisZapp · 10/03/2015 10:58

What mistake did the police make?

TheChandler · 10/03/2015 11:01

Whereupon you are making things up. There is no "mistake" that the police made. If there were, there would be grounds for sueing the police for negligence, which there aren't. All that has happened is that the parents would like the police to have done more.

I don't anyone expected this to happen. No-one can foretell the future - it is a rapidly changing situation, and the police have other duties than providing very specific care for things that might happen to the children of families who appear to be leading very normal lives.

Whereupon · 10/03/2015 11:05

Of course I'm not making things up. In my reasonable view the police made a mistake in not sending those letters to the parents. And it's not exactly difficult, from the police's point of view, to imagine that if one girl in a group of Muslim friends has gone to Syria others may be at risk. Either from the grooming that the original friend had, and/or from contact over the internet by the girl herself. It is well known that IS make good use of social media, and use girls to recruit other girls from the same country.

Whereupon · 10/03/2015 11:07

TheChandler - I don't know whether there are grounds for suing the police for negligence. More to the point, nor do you. So why make that statement?

Quangle · 10/03/2015 11:08

I was surprised that the police could interview the girls at school without prior approval from the parents. I would have thought that would be against policy if not against the law. I would be interested to know what the situation is on that.

But I'm absolutely not blaming the police and really don't think the families should either. Nobody outside the family (or even apparently inside the family) could anticipate that three apparently quite well-behaved and moderate girls would do something so utterly, utterly stupid.

I agree with what someone said upthread. The only explanation I can come up with is that if you persistently teach your children that the culture they are living in is corrupt and unworthy those children won't value what they have and then when the opportunity comes to run away to a nirvana, they will take it. I don't know if that's what happened in this case but that is a theme that runs through some of these cases.

We also don't do anywhere near enough to promote the alternative view - that this is how democracy works, that equality between men and women is fundamental to democracy, that freedom of speech, however much you dislike the message, is central. And that we will not stand for any dilution of these values and we hope that everyone who comes here will share in them and uphold them as part of their Britishness.

TheChandler · 10/03/2015 11:09

Yes, you are making things up whereupon. What you are suggesting is the duty of the courts to rule on, not for you to announce on an internet site - "it is, just because I say it is".

I am not aware that the police have a duty of care to contact directly all parents of children who may use social media who may be influenced by IS members and warn them specifically in the absence of strong intelligence that there is a direct and specific threat.

Lets not forget that the police run a fine line of being accused of racism.

MorrisZapp · 10/03/2015 11:12

Exactly. Those parents would probably be angry to receive letters telling them their daughters may be plotting behind their backs because they are Muslim.

And the letters didn't say that anyway. Whereupon, are you aware of what the letters said?

tiggytape · 10/03/2015 11:43

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

AuntieStella · 10/03/2015 11:56

How much coverage in the press was there at the time of the first girl leaving for Syria in December? I've tried googling, but stories of the three travelling together are crowding out all other results. I've not found anything which names the first girl, nor any articles from December. How well known was her disappearance? Would other parents at the school have known she had gone?

EmEyeFaive · 10/03/2015 12:05

Auntie

Might it be this story? scroll down a bit there was one girl stopped and the other one managed to leave.

AuntieStella · 10/03/2015 12:31

Thanks EmEyeFaive - it could be the one, but it's not specific (probably for good reasons). I was wondering if it was possible that details of which school etc were not generally known then, so unless the police actually told the families of that girl's close contacts, then the families would have no idea their DDs had radicalised contacts.

And I do think that, unless it is icw a disclosure which concerns the actions of a family member, police should always inform the parents of a minor if they wish to interview them (including when the interview is one to seek intelligence on the actions of another, and no suspicion is attached to the interviewee at the time).

I wonder what happens for drug or gang related interviews?

Yokohamajojo · 10/03/2015 13:13

I think it's very common among kids and teenagers or strict families to lead a totally secret life in school and outside the home. I have worked with women from muslim and hindu backgrounds who's parents think they are the 'good girls' they have raised who have secret boyfriends etc etc. I think it's very sad and I think it must be hard growing up feeling torn between your parents culture and the culture you are actually experience in school etc. I find the whole situation very sad but I do believe that parents especially muslim parents unfortunately do need to start having these conversations with their children, even if they are moderate and peaceful, it's not an attack on their religion, there are christian sects as well, but the debate needs to be had!

EdithWeston · 10/03/2015 14:58

The families are being interviewed by the Foreign Affairs committee, and SKY is carrying it live right now.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 10/03/2015 15:03

It's unfortunate that the first statements they've made is to blame other people

^^ This

It may well be true that the parents are lashing out due to worry and grief - then again it may not. Like everyone else I simply can't know so I can't assume anything one way or the other

In the meantime I hope the security services are looking at all possibilities that this has thrown up, no matter who it might upset ... as I've said so often, the safety of the vast majority has to stand above the feelings of a tiny few

AlPacinosHooHaa · 10/03/2015 15:12

Great Question : why are they so attracted to such barbarity.

AlPacinosHooHaa · 10/03/2015 15:14

Justin Beiber is hard to understand? I think not!

AuntieStella · 10/03/2015 15:20

I was wondering if the answer should have been: "We don't know. Because we didn't know they were close to the missing girl and some of the conversations we could have had, we never had because we didn't know they were needed, and possibly needed urgently"

One family member has just said that the school only ever said the first girl was 'missing', not in Syria (this apparently on instructions of the police)

nochocolateforlentteacake · 10/03/2015 15:22

But there would be chatter about a missing girl... Runaway, murdered, shipped abroad for marriage...

BreakingDad77 · 10/03/2015 16:00

nochocolateforlentteacake

I cant believe there was no gossip about the first girl going missing.

I find it ironic they needed to buy an epilator so much for leaving the corrupt west with its beauty ideals.

nochocolateforlentteacake · 10/03/2015 16:02

Epilator? Was that on the list? I wonder what else...

lalalonglegs · 10/03/2015 16:12

Many Muslim women remove all their body hair before marriage - it's one of the wedding preparations - hence the epilator, I'm assuming.

AlPacinosHooHaa · 10/03/2015 16:16

reallY? why? ( remove ALL body hair?)

26Point2Miles · 10/03/2015 16:22

can the police actually just rock up to any given school and ask for addresses of pupils? don't schools have confidentiality clauses and police need official documentation? this sounded like a request for an informal meeting,not likely to incur time/money getting confidential info from the LEA

also. even if the parents had the letter sent....how could anyone be certain that the girls wouldn't just carry on quietly and go anyway? how could the parents be so sure they could stop them?

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