Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

to think they should charge the Syria girls

999 replies

adsy · 21/02/2015 08:14

If they are indeed with terrorists in Syria then when a small chink of sense comes back to them and they want to come home, I hope they will be charged.

OP posts:
ILovePud · 21/02/2015 19:28

I think it's harsh to suggest the parents were neglectful Countessmarkyabitch, they must be going through hell now, plunged into a media storm whilst wondering where their daughter's are now and what kind of danger they are facing. They were 15 and 16 and intelligent enough to plan this trip, it's very hard to shelter teenagers of that age from social media and they may have had no reason to suspect they were up to anything other than a day out shopping in half term.

countessmarkyabitch · 21/02/2015 19:33

Maybe you're right Pud, but its a lot less harsh than most of the other ridiculous and inane suggestions!
I find it hard to believe you couldn't have a clue, tickets to Syria are expensive, not to mention all the logistics that would have to be organised, plus the fact that they're unlikely to have hidden their interest that well.... I've never met a 15 year old who could outsmart a watchful parent that well.

26Point2Miles · 21/02/2015 19:35

Where are these fevered revenge fantasies then?

Original poster
adsy · 21/02/2015 19:37

I don't know either. Maybe the froth from my mouth is inhibiting my reading.

OP posts:
ILovePud · 21/02/2015 19:43

The parents seem sincere to me and I feel for them, I'm guessing that they had the tickets bought for them and were maybe advised on how to keep it all a secret, if the parents were involved my guess would be that they would be keeping a low profile not making press appeals for their daughters to come home.

TheGirlWhoPlayedWithFire · 21/02/2015 19:57

I have little sympathy with these women. These seemingly intelligent young women, who may have been provided with all the promises of utopia, and brainwashed to the core, however living in Bethnal Green they won't have been immune to the recent atrocities of ISIS. Paris, Copenhagen etc etc. you cannot tell me they will have been sheltered from the recent attacks of Charlie Hebdo?? Seriously, that event was on every front page of every newspaper and TV screen in this country. Even in a sheltered community (if that is true, we don't know so shouldn't speculate), they couldn't have avoided the furore that surrounded the incidents in Paris, caused by Muslim extremists.

How did these clever women not take these events into account, even if they have no idea what will face them personally in Syria - or do they condone those attacks?

If the young women (because that's what they are, they aren't girls) reach Syria, then yes they will have committed an offence by colluding with a terrorist organisation. They will be arrested should they ever be fortunate enough to return to the UK.

However I can't help but feel the biggest punishments they are going to face is going to hit them when they reach Syria and it will be largely self induced. For that I feel desperately sorry for them and the world of torment they are soon to endure. I don't agree with their political motivations at all. But I can't believe they left in full knowledge about what will happen to them in Syria, because it will not be the utopia they are expecting, and they will have to live in the knowledge that they brought it on themselves by leaving the UK.

26Point2Miles · 21/02/2015 20:12

pud have the parents made a public appeal then? Not seen anything of them

ghostland · 21/02/2015 20:13

Hopefully they'll get stuck there and be on the receiving end of some revenge courtesy of the Yazidis, Christians or Kurds.

They are absolutely no different from the Hitler Youth.

DoraGora · 21/02/2015 20:19

The Hilter Youth is an interesting comparison. My word, they were some of the fiercest fighters in Normandy. It's a wonder what a teenage brain, a couple of hours of ideology and a handgrenade can achieve!

ILovePud · 21/02/2015 20:22

The parents of the two named girls have issued statements 26.2 I do think they are in a different position to Hitler Youth ghostland as membership of that was compulsory I believe.

AuntieStella · 21/02/2015 20:26

BBC article on the families' pleas

26Point2Miles · 21/02/2015 20:31

The parents understand that they 'want to help those suffering'?? Eh? So who exactly have they gone over there to help?

SlaggyIsland · 21/02/2015 20:31

AuntieStella that's heartbreaking. Those poor families sound so distressed.

SlaggyIsland · 21/02/2015 20:32

Maybe they think they are somehow helping in the fight against Assad?

OneStepCloser · 21/02/2015 20:33

Perhaps they have to believe that 26 they are probably/possibly in shock?

countessmarkyabitch · 21/02/2015 20:36

I have little sympathy with these women. These seemingly intelligent young women,

ArmyDad · 21/02/2015 20:38

From sky news "young women are driven by several factors including outrage over perceived atrocities being carried out in Syria" who do they think are carrying out atrocities? After burning a pilot alive and beheading so many people. Assad is a choir boy in comparison

limitedperiodonly · 21/02/2015 20:42

Sorry, I was cooking the dinner and plotting the downfall of Western civilisation.

But I cobbled together these fevered posts because I was asked. It's probably more accurate to say they are wishful thinking, rather than revenge fantasies. But the wishes scare me.

The idea that posters want to invent charges against minors who have not been proven to have committed any criminal offence is terrifying.

They are stupid children and I would hate to think that any of you would be baying for blood if it was your kid who ran away.

But here we go:

The first is is my favourite because of the username, but please don't think I appreciate the others any less:

Joyfulldeathsquad Well they bought themselves a one way ticket to hell didnt they? I don't believe their parents had no clue either. I don't believe it's the governments responsibility, it's every Muslim parent, Iman and religious leaders . The Muslim community have to stand up now and protect its children as I don't think they do enough. I've seen plenty of marches against the west detesting the very country that allows them the right to march and rallies with Anjam Choudhry peacocking out side Mosques. What do people expect? We should sheild out young minds against that. I do however feel sorry for these young women as I wouldn't wish what's about to happen to them on anybody. Should they be charged on their return? Yes they should.

I am so in awe of the username that I can't say anything else.

Kellyandthecat treason seems like such an oldfashioned word but i think joining ISIS fits the definition. i'm sure ISIS have said they want to overthrow our government and i'm sure theyd like a shot at the queen! Should they be charged on their return? Yes they should.

Have they said they want to take a pot shot at the Queen, Kelly? In the 16th century you got your head chopped off for much less than that.

TheWordFactory I do feel sorry for these girls but still think they should be charged.

What with?

26Point2Miles Why is the head saying that? Stalling the authorities trying to put them off the scent.......weird. And if they aren't back in school on Monday the parents should be fined then!

Good point. He'd probably come down really hard on people who took their kid to a week at Center Parcs.

MagratsHair I can see the argument from both sides...

Forgive me for cutting you long post short but I did because you don't see the argument from both sides.

Bowlersarm Terrorist activities?

And this means?

MagratsHair Treason

See above

kellyandthecat aiding and abetting crimes against humanity?

Are you a lawyer or an avid viewer of The Wright Stuff?

adsy There's a new'ish counter terrorism law which states that IS is on a list of proscribed organisations and if you knowingly associate with them or support them financially, physically, publicly etc. then you will be charged. Going over to join them is pretty high on the scale I would say!

As above.

MagratsHair Aiding/abetting/accomplice/accessory to: Murder (not sure of the death toll but maybe genocide fits) War crimes. Crimes against Human Rights

As above.

26Point2Miles Lots of scope there then, doesn't look like they will be returning to their families anytime soon

Are you the Attorney General by any chance?

These people are 15 and 16 years old and have committed no crime.

Inkanta · 21/02/2015 20:43

'The parents understand that they 'want to help those suffering'?? Eh?'

The parents may be part of the problem then.

AuntieStella · 21/02/2015 20:45

"These people are 15 and 16 years old and have committed no crime."

So you know they have not reached Syria?

SlaggyIsland · 21/02/2015 20:47

Guilt by association then Inkanta? Or terrified, distraught parents who love their children very much?
BTW I don't disagree that Isis is beyond hideous. Of course they are. But Assad is certainly no choir boy. I've seen the pictures of the gassed children. My understanding is that his actions motivated a lot of foreign fighters to go to Syria. They could very well be referring to that.

AuntieStella · 21/02/2015 20:48

"'The parents understand that they 'want to help those suffering'?? Eh?'
The parents may be part of the problem then."

I think the parents are probably trying to convey that if the girls do not go to Syria, and come home instead, they can return to their families who want to help them and understand them, but keep them safe.

ILovePud · 21/02/2015 20:49

My guess is the parents are pretty desperate not to make their daughters feel like there's no way back for them and crafting a narrative where they are telling them, and the world, that they may have gone out with humanitarian intentions probably serves that purpose. They may even have convinced themselves of it, any decent parent in this situation would be distraught, horrified and clutching at any straws not to believe the worst of their children.

limitedperiodonly · 21/02/2015 20:51

AuntieStella It's not a crime to go to Syria or to be a stroppy 16 year old girl.

What have they done?

ghostland · 21/02/2015 20:56

I wonder if there would be so much sympathy and excuses if it was white male Christians/atheists joining the BNP or the Ku Klux Klan or some other dodgy organisation? Would a 16 year old white rapist or a teenager who talks about burning down a mosque or supports Pegida receive so much sympathy from people here on MN? Somehow I doubt it. It seems to only be Muslims that can be "radicalised" and that are "vulnerable" even though some of the most deprived communities are now white working class.