I don't like your attitude

[Paddleslowly]

Ds and I are on holiday the trip of a lifetime staying with family as a very generous present. Ds doesn't want to go home but I politely said to him that we have to go home as things are not that simple. He replies back " well they never are with you" I was fuming and got up to go into the kitchen and he said " night" in such a nasty tone whilst he sat there still on the sofa. Is it me or is this him pushing his luck he has upset me with his shit attitude!

When you do talk to him about it, be explicit about what behaviour is not acceptable. This is especially true if he has some problems with social skills, reading nonverbal cues, etc. I suspect I'm somewhere on the autism spectrum, and it was INCREDIBLY frustrating to me as a teenager to be told things like "I don't like your attitude," or "I don't like your tone," with no concrete steps to take to make things better. You might tell him that it is not appropriate for him to comment on your appearance, for example.

You might also want to talk about how we don't talk the same way with parents as we do with friends, or how it might be funny when kids do things on TV but it isn't OK in real life. He might be trying to be funny in a way that kids or others on a TV show are, but it might not be working. You might need to tell him that it's not working. These things aren't always obvious to those of us who can't read nonverbal cues.

Try to talk with him at a time when neither of you is angry, stressed, or in a hurry. A fight probably isn't going to help.

One thing you might try when he says something like "it never is with you," is to ask him, in as neutral a tone as possible, what he means by that. His answer to a line of questioning like that might tell you whether he's intentionally being disrespectful or just socially clueless.

He is picking up on the fact that you don't want to make a sence in front of the relatives and using it to his advantage.

He is picking up on your embarrassment of his behaviour and doing it more.

Turn the tables OP. Go NUCLEAR. Put him in his place and embarrass the shit out of him.

Do it while the holiday is still happening, when he doesn't expect it.

He might wise up.

Is there someone in your family who he respects who could speak to him, one-to-one, about the way he's behaving? He could say he'd overheard the way your son was talking to you.

I'd be looking at boarding schools, tbh; I couldn't live with a child who treated me like shit.

"well they never are with you"

I would be secretly amused and pleased at the inner feisty in him.

Seems normal to me.

"well they never are with you"

Why would he say that though?

it suggests to me that OP tells him far too much.

Send him away?

Humiliate him?

Poor kid!

Think I'm missing something, what he said was nothing?

And the incident at the door was a bit rude but he was probably showing off!

Now the Not Read The OP Properly Crew have turned up. What is pleasing and secretly feisty about telling your mum she looks ugly, or sulking because holidays last forever?

*can't last forever

Wow, he is 12. People are suggesting he gets a job and pays for himself, cooks his own meals, does his own washing? Honestly? OP I think you've had some downright stupid advice. The last thing you want to do is push him away and widen the already growing distance between you. Hes made a few out of order remarks, tell him off there and then... and move on. Be proportionate. He hasnt stolen, been aggressive or anything like that. Minor things really.

If a person I was on holiday with lectured me on the mundane demands of jobs/school/day to day life if I remarked I was enjoying myself and didnt want to go home, I'd think they were a right misery. Who needs to be reminded that life isnt simple and all that unless he was literally refusing to physically leave when it was time to go? Seems like an odd response. It probably wound him up so he snapped at you, which I agree is wrong but does not warrant the horror that seems to have been generated on here.

As for someone saying they'd knock their child into next week? Disgusting comment.

God don't pander to him. Tell him how its going to be and the consequences if not and stick with it. Give him an inch and he'll take a mile.

Well we don't know that OP did lecture him!

If it was just a general grumble on his part I don't really know why OP felt the need to say anything other than that it's sad but holidays end or that she also wished that it didn't have to end.

It is simple.

Holidays end!

First thing the next morning I made him bring me his iPad and iPhone and I took it from him. I explained that it wasn't very nice to speak to me in that way and it is unacceptable to hurt my feelings. I am your mother and that he will not disrespect me ever. He said sorry it's just that he's a child and sometimes doesn't understand things!
I stuck to not letting him have his gadgets back and have told him no to the present he wanted. He threw a bit of a sulk but that's his problem.

Well done, OP, let him sulk and once he is out of it see if you can do something else fun together. Practice the cold, calm, steely look in the mirror and if he tries it again, give him the warning glare. Can you raise one eyebrow, that would be cool. My dd can do it as she spent several weeks practising

Well done OP, stick to your guns.

"He said sorry it's just that he's a child and sometimes doesn't understand things!"
Wow, that's quite a manipulative thing to come out of the mouth of a twelve-year-old. I'd watch out for that, sometimes it can slip under your radar.

You need to be CONSISTENT with him, so that he learns no amount of sulking/arguing/manipulation will work; and when he realises they won't work, they stop being worth the effort. It might take a while, but consistency always wins in the end.

The answer to that is "You are right, you are a child but don't worry, I am not a child and, as your parent, it is my responsibility to guide you and correct you so I will let you know if you are out of line and, if it continues, I will give you some consequences to help you learn so that when you are no longer a child, you will be a responsible adult who can be respected in society".

Or something like that

You have done the right thing. Let him sulk. A good sulk never did any child any harm. Just don't give in and buy him the present now that you have said you won't. It might be possible once back home that you could see how his behaviour goes and if all is well then order it online as a surprise birthday or Christmas present.

Let this be a reality check for him. Keep being consistent too. At his age you are first and foremost his parent, and sometimes that can mean that you do not always feel like friends. With sensible boundaries though, they do usually learn and it does get better. The pre-teen and teenage years are hard and frustrating, but you will get there. All parents and kids to through it to one degree or another.

You can't make him just appreciate the holiday. You can expect him not to call you boring or lame to your face, and to not comment on your appearance. Work on stuff he controls, like what he says to you, first. He might find it harder to control his feelings or his facial expressions. But the stuff he says, that is 100% under his control (unless he has Tourette's syndrome or something of that nature).

You don't comment negatively on his appearance or anything like that to his face, do you? "Do as I say, not as I do" has a very poor track record for changing behaviour, especially with teenagers.

I find it astounding that you found your son's comment about having to go home more thread-worthy than all the other stuff. The OP just sounds typical of a pre-teen expressing his disappointment at having to go home from a lovely holiday. Personally, I would have felt exactly the same, and said "oh I know how you feel, I wish we could stay too, it's a bummer, isn't it? I like this/that part of the holiday best, what was your favourite bit?"

Sometimes they just want to express their disappointment and to have someone close acknowledge their feelings. Opening up to your mum about how sad you are to be going home only to be cut off by her saying something along the lines of "well we have to, so suck it up" is actually quite dismissive.

The other stuff you've told us about is the opposite of that - totally out of order and you've been given some good advice in telling you to deal with it now before he gets really bad.

I remember my mum being a big fan of sayig "how would YOU feel if I treated YOU like that/said that to you?" Always used to make me stop and think about things from her point of view and I used to feel bad and apologise if I'd said something hurtful as a teenager. Have you tried that? Not in the heat of the argument but later if you went to his room, explained calmly that his behaviour won't be tolerated, and asked him to think about the things from your point of view.

I would agree with getting the relatives on board, particularly a male. They could gently put him in his place a bit.

I can't believe that so many posters think you should accept this behaviour or even Andrewfogg expect it to get worse. My son is now a man and never once growing up did he make any such rude or dismissive comment or gesture to me. You do not have to see this behaviour as inevitable.

Ds has asked about the toy thing he wanted. I said " I have told you no you are not having it due to your behaviour" " your actions have consequences" he kept pushing it and said " well it's my pocket money, I can do what I want with it" I calmly walked away as it felt like he wanted to test my last nerve. Ffs I'm not going to argue with a 12 year old throwing his toys out the pram. This would be the second time of explaining why he isn't having it

Don't give him the pocket money. If he already has it then confiscate it.

You said no to the toy already. Don't let him have the means to circumvent you. No means just that. No. No toy.

I think walking away is good if he is not listening to you.

Opinions are fine and to be expected. But being blatantly rude and making sneery personal remarks needs to be challenged.

They need cutting down to size in a very pointed but still calm manner. The next time they need a lift somewhere or want to borrow £5 simply don't agree or be available. Don't get heated about it, just say that because of their previous attitude you don't feel inclined to help them out.

Then just calmly ignore all their sulking and posturing that this will cause. Them being irritated and throwing a strop because you won't give them a lift to their friend's house really isn't your problem. But them feeling they can verbally insult you and be breathtakingly rude to you is your problem.

About the toy - repeat

'The toy is not up for discussion. I have made my decision and you are not having it. That is final'

And if he goes against you and buys the toy, confiscate it.