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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Why does the term SAHM get so many people wound-up?

125 replies

farflungfanny · 16/02/2015 07:54

Just that really?
I am genuinely curious, it seems people are either justifying it, condemning it, ridiculing it, patronizing, or just plain angry.
Some choose it, some are forced into it. Just as some choose to work while other have too.
Everyone situation is different surely ? There is no right or wrong in how our family dynamics work.

OP posts:
LePetitMarseillais · 16/02/2015 09:21

"Lazy" "work shy" here we go.Hmm

Sahm for 7 years,now full time wm.

Being a sahm was boring,hard work,challenging at times.It was also stimulating,interesting,enjoyable,rewarding and bloody well worth it too.

Now as a full time wm in a job I love I shall also be honest about this.My dc do miss out,it brings more stress on the family as a whole and sorry I'm not a full time mum as I'm not with them. I love it though and the financial benefits and other benefits it brings makes it worth it to us all now( a few years ago it wouldn't).

So there you go.

ChristyMooreRocks · 16/02/2015 09:31

sorry I'm not a full time mum as I'm not with them.

Yes, but if you were a SAHM you wouldn't be with them for the 6.5 hours a day they are at school, so you wouldn't be a 'full time mum' then either? Confused

soverylucky · 16/02/2015 09:36

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ToffeeCaramel · 16/02/2015 09:36

You wouldn't be caring for them full time no.

Fabulassie · 16/02/2015 09:44

It's not the term that riles me up, it's the situation. I resent what it does to women financially and socially. I resent that our culture encourage the situation that makes women dependent and puts them in the position of doing all the "wife work."

I did the SAHM thing, myself. I have nothing against the actual position. I'm just angry at what it does to women, especially when I see them struggling to make a living after a divorce.

MorrisZapp · 16/02/2015 09:49

I have a full time job and I couldn't care less about the phrase full time mum. In fact I've probably used it myself.

Full time teachers, nurses and shop assistants don't work 24 hours a day. It's a well known convention to say 'full time' meaning roughly 38 hours a week.

So yes, we're all mums all the time, but when describing what we 'do', full and part time are useful and normal expressions.

flowery · 16/02/2015 09:50

I've never heard anyone getting "wound up" by the term SAHM.

It's a shame when women put down each other's choices, usually through insecurity in an attempt to reassure themselves that their own choice is "better". But that's nothing to do with what term is used.

realgonekid84 · 16/02/2015 09:50

people use the term sahp because what is the other option? O yes I am unemployed . Thank you for the reminder snow This implies sitting around doing nothing. A sahp with a preschooler and a baby is providing valueable childcare and not sat around doing nothing. I actually prefer home/family responsibilities for forms etc but it a bit of a mouthful in real life and for the keyboard on mn.

BellaCB · 16/02/2015 09:52

Couldn't give a toss about the phrase SAHM.

Full-time mum drives me up the wall though. As if WOHP of either sex are somehow not parents when they aren't with their kids Hmm

But this is all on MN. Never in RL.

And because on MN the phrase "full-time mum" is like as not followed by a comment along the lines of people "outsourcing the raising of your children"

sparechange · 16/02/2015 10:04

Bella
You are forgetting the 'I don't know why people even bother having children if they are then going to run straight back to work'
Which only ever applies to women, of course. No man has ever been criticised for running straight back to work after his child was born.

fluffyraggies · 16/02/2015 10:09

I think the Full Time Mum must surely apply to pre school age DCs? Where you are literally at home with them all day. Full time. As opposed to going to work and leaving them in someone elses care.

SAHM is more readily applied to mums with school age kids.

I also think that the simple statement - ''if i was a SAHM i'd go mad ...'' is fair enough, but is akin to the statement - ''if i went to work i'd feel guilty ...''.

Both these statements will tend call to mind an unpleasant assumption. ''You therefore must be mad'', from the first, and ''you must feel guilty for leaving your kids'' from the second.

DustyGold · 16/02/2015 10:19

Hate term SAHM for some reason.
I am not in paid work but do not define myself by my home or my children; I am just me not a twee label.
Home maker would make me scream as a label.
I have made a choice, not to do paid work, as an older Mum for a few years.
Belts have been tightened.....
Not keen on other labels either eg full time Mum. etc.
Perhaps it's a twee thing in particular with SAHM.
I don't know.... sets my teeth on edge!!

SpecificOcean · 16/02/2015 10:27

I have never heard anyone describe themselves as SAHM in RL, if I did I would think "Oh Mnetter".

Most people I know have done a mixture of everything, similar to me.
I worked full time, then had dc and took maternity leave and a bit extra, then went back to work p/time after a couple of years off and stayed that way.
Think that's more like RL tbh.

Madagascanparadise · 16/02/2015 11:50

DustyGold I'm with you all the way. I don't have a paid job, but oh god not a home maker.

I do think it's a bit disingenuous for posters to say that it doesn't ever crop up in RL. I have a friend who takes a pop at me for being at home. As someone up thread very wisely said there is a certain amount of envy on both sides. I envy her slightly as she has a good job whereas I haven't worked for years and would be completely crap at everything but she envies me being at home. There are good and bad points to both.

SoupDragon · 16/02/2015 11:55

I am a Full Time Lady of Leisure and On Call Mother. (FTLOLAOCM)

olgaga · 16/02/2015 15:12

SAHM is a ridiculous term for what is essentially an unpaid, full time, live in nanny/housekeeper.

Who could earn £450/500 pw if they worked for any family other than their own.

It's the implication that the work has no value which is so insulting.

hijk · 16/02/2015 15:14

we are all unpaid live in nanny/housekeepers Olgaga, it is called family life!

olgaga · 16/02/2015 15:30

That's demonstrably not true. working parents pay for childcare. some can afford a cleaner too. others pay for laundry and ironing.

The very well paid can outsource the entire job.

My point is, the work involved has value, whether or not you are a parent.

SnowWhiteAteTheApple · 16/02/2015 15:40

Olgaga, I don't pay for childcare not do I have a cleaner or pay for laundry and still manage to work Hmm I don't class myself as having two jobs just because I clean the house and looking after your own children is just what parents do. It's not childcare but being a parent.

I don't put a value on housework as it has none. It's just something adulys do if they want a clean and tidy home.

Given most SAHPs on MN don't do much housework as its supposed to be split between them and the working partner it's not seen as "work" to many at all.

MuttersDarkly · 16/02/2015 15:52

It only happens on MN. In RL no one cares.

It happens on plenty of online forums, blogs and social media thingies. There was a whole debate board devoted to the topic on iVillage back in the 90s. It is not MN specific. Not much is MN specific. Except maybe the biscuits and the unusually chatty/informal relationship between site admin/owners and users.

If people didn't care (or have much of an opinion either way) IRL they wouldn't bellyache so much about it when online and feeling more free from the constraints of socially acceptable limits on what you say to other people.

SoupDragon · 16/02/2015 16:11

looking after your own children is just what parents do. It's not childcare but being a parent.

Not when the parents are at work it isn't. It becomes the job of someone else.

notsogoldenoldie · 16/02/2015 16:23

Exactly, soup. It has a value because if someone else did it, it would cost you.

olgaga · 16/02/2015 16:28

Well you're very lucky if you can work without having to pay for childcare!

My point is that this unpaid work has value, both intrinsic and financial. After all, if you want someone to do it for you, you would normally expect to have to pay them.

It's rather sad that both those who have no choice, or those who choose to do it (for whayever reason) should be the subject of scorn or jealousy, particularly on a website dedicated to parenting.

TheGirlInTheGlass · 16/02/2015 16:30

I don't get why everyone's so precious.

If you asked what I did, and I said I was a SAHM, I'd be pointing out I'm at home with the kids - Come over for coffee, invite us to the park, call me if you need a sitter for your doctor's appt.
I would in no way be insinuating that you didn't care enough to stay at home if you weren't.

If I had to describe myself and I said I was a Full Time Mum, I'd mean that I look after the kids every day - Again, come over for coffee, invite us out, etc.
I would certainly not be insinuating that you weren't if you worked.

If you asked and I said I was a WAHM, that's me telling you I work from home. It doesn't tell you whether my kids are there when I do, or not, so I wouldn't expect you to judge me, because I certainly wouldn't be judging you. I'm not using it to tell you that I prioritise school runs over a commute, or that you shouldn't expect a childminder to pick up your kids.

If I'm responding to a post online, and as part of my background information I happen at any point to mention the phrase "I'm lucky enough that I don't have to work", it means I am truly grateful that I do not have to work. It means that I'm free for coffee, park dates, as above. It does not mean that my life's better than yours, or my husband has a stellar job, or that we're minted. Just that I don't work, and that I don't want to brag, so I point out that I'm grateful.

Now, if anyone wants to ask such a personal question of someone they hardly know, and finds the respondent kind enough to offer one of the above instead of telling them to mind their own business?
Take it at face value. As a factual answer.
E.g Don't read into it, assign it any wistfulness you feel that you can't be with your kids because you need the money, project your guilt for choosing the career even though you don't need it, poke them with your jealousy stick, or otherwise insult their answer by assuming the worst about them.

You don't know if they chose it, or were forced into it, so you don't get to judge their choices or jump to the defensive.
They don't get to lord over you that they're in that position, and most times, they're won't.

Believe me, if they did, you'd know about it, and then you could take your ball, go home, and reserve the right not to make friends with them because they were being rude. And that's just fine.

But you don't get to assume that everyone who answers your question, or volunteers their information, has some sort of agenda to make people feel bad. Especially because tone of voice can't be read in text, most of the time.

For example, I typed this is a slightly sad, disappointed, low-volume 'voice' - but I bet a lot of people read it as a top-level rant in an angry, sarcastic, affronted tone. It's far too easy to project our own emotions onto someone else's words, which is a shame for communication all round.

MummyBeerest · 16/02/2015 16:33

If SAHM is like anything I read about, them I'm a SHAM of a SAHM.

I'm a SIBM. {Stay In Bed Mum}