to be fed up of living in a deprived neighbourhood?

[fluffymouse]

We moved neighbourhoods in London to up size. Quite simply we could only afford a place big enough for us as a family in London in a dodgy neighbourhood. By any conventional marker the area is very deprived. It has a rather notorious reputation too, and has meant some people have been reluctant to visit us.

I have tried being positive about the area (it is on the up, like all areas of London that are not already up!). I am starting to think it would be nice to just move out to a nice village now.

Pros of our area:
Good community feel
Crime rate acceptable by London standards
Feels safe for the most part
Diverse neighbourhood - good ethnic foods

Cons:
Drug dealing neighbours who have been verbally abusive and threatening
Antisocial behaviour issues
Very few of the parents at dd's preschool speak English - limiting opportunities for play dates
Local schools - most do well considering, but children starting with attainment well below average, high turnover of pupils, and lots of pupils at early stage of English language acquisition
Very poor provision for children despite there being lots of children in the area - put simply no one bothers to provide as it wouldn't be taken up for the most part. No ballet, gym etc. Even the children centres offer very little.

WIBU to move us all out to a beautiful village up north where we can get a 4 bed house for the price of a bedsit here?

Ah but York is in t'north Henny and Most Londoners shudder at the thought of living up north
(I'm still staggered at this statement. Although I now live in the East, I have lived many many years in 'the north' and I know that some areas now have running water)

Some Southerners think Northerners are thick and common.

They're probably reet

Enjoyingmycoffee how arrogant and offensive is that!

I'm a southerner, have lived in London for almost ten years (in my 20s - just not affordable unless you had a high paid job - or parental hand outs, IMHO).

I've since lived in Yorkshire, the Wirral and Cheshire. All fabulous places.

York is gorgeous and the small towns dotted around the dales are heaven. Not called God's Own Country for nothing! So are many market towns around Leeds. Derbyshire is a beauty. So much culture to be had around Manchester, Liverpool. Art galleries, cafés, community groups, music venues, fab restaurants. There is no shortage of culture up here. Chester is chocolate box too, like York, and Shrewsbury.

Breathtaking beauty to be found on trips to North Wales (Snowdonia) or Cumbria for the weekend.

I'm just astounded at the arrogance.
I really am.

I sympathise, OP. I'm not sure what I'd do in your shoes. Could you rent your London house out and then rent somewhere else to see if you liked it? I'm a Londoner who can't afford a family home there, so we're now up north and it has a lot going for it, but I do miss London.

Oh, and on the issue of EAL, it's no good being all hand wavey and PC about it, if 90% of the pupils in my child's class do not speak English (either well or at all) and require additional assistance from the teacher then it stands to reason that my child will get less time, and why on earth would I not be concerned about that? I think it's very unfair to suggest that the OP is prejudiced against 'forriners' because she is concerned about these issues. I've had first hand experience of the impact of a single non English speaking majority on educational establishments and it's not at all without problems.

Postscript - after almost ten years in London I remember standing in Sheffield holding a map scratching my head. Almost speechless when a passerby stopped and asked if I needed help. Just wasn't used to that level of spontaneous friendliness and willingness to talk to a stranger. After twelve years spent up North... I take it for granted now.

Move to Woodford Bridge, we're lovely and not antisocial at all. It's not quite as diverse as most of zone 1, but it is fairly multicultural, on the tube and still reasonably priced.

When I was addressing Christmas cards this year, I did something terribly cheeky and looked up the price many of my friends in the South paid for their houses . A good handful were over £1m. I was absolutely gobsmacked as, while they were nice homes, they weren't extraordinary- it was just the location.

I really wanted to say- don't you know what kind of amazing house that would buy in Yorkshire! What on earth is wrong with you?? I know they wouldn't earn as much here as in the City (where many work), but even with 5 or 600k you could buy a fantastic house with huge garden.

I'm not originally from the UK and I just can't understand this North/ South thing. (BTW, my husband is a Yorkshireman and would sooner die than live in that London).

There are some lovely places in Merseyside. Birkdale near Southport is brilliant and you could get a 4 bed for £300k.

Yes, but any previous threads or remarks I've made have been "shat" upon.( by the likes that have no real understanding of what really goes on and can only glen from regurgitated snippets from the guardian and Woman's Hour)
I'd like to say I live in a "unloved" area . Poverty is no excuse for fly tipping, anti social behaviour and general disregard for ones neighbours.
There are some truly "poor"areas of Britain that are clean and neighbourly.

In my opinion Henny, and I've lived all over England, there isn't so much a North/South divide, rather a London/rest of the country divide.

Derbyshire is beautiful

bluebright I sympathise completely. I have called the council lots of times to ask them to pick up discarded beds or other furniture that people see fit to litter the streets with.

Tbh my area isn't that affordable anymore either, the prices have shot up since we moved here, but the general feel is the same.

We could move out of London to a nice area, be mortgage free and in a bigger house. It seems a bit of a no brainer.

It is a complete no brainer Fluffy.
Just decide where to go.

We did similar years ago. We upped and moved to a random town. We couldn't afford to buy where we lived so we visited a couple of towns that were affordable and moved to one of them.

I also find it hard to believe that your dc is the ONLY native English speaker in the class. I live in a very mixed area in inner London that is 'on the up'. There are multiple languages spoken in my dd's class but only 1 can't speak any English. Many others have English as a second language but on the whole the standard of English is fine. It doesn't take long for a young child to acquire a language.

I love London and can't understand why anybody would want to live anywhere else. Yes i get peed off with the traffic, the crowds, the house prices, small houses, postage stamp gardens etc but there are so many benefits of living in London imho that the 'problems' are liveable with. The idea of going from the big buzzing city to some small town/ village/ rural community is hellish to me. And my personal experience is that there is far more drug taking in rural parts because there's nothing else for young people to do (this bears out statistically).

But you must do what's best for you and yours. Are your finances likely to change in the next few years? If they did would you still want to move away?

I love London and can't understand why anybody would want to live anywhere else.

The idea of going from the big buzzing city to some small town/ village/ rural community is hellish to me.

Mumofwildthings - again, the London-centric arrogance is just

It's not an either London or small town / rural dichotomy, you know. Have you heard of Manchester? Leeds? Liverpool?

(And before you start sneering at the latter.... It's a much MUCH changed city from the 1980s stereotype. It didn't win Capital of Culture for nothing.)

OP - I would honestly ignore the naive and frankly borderline not so borderline offensive comments from those who think civilisation stops north of Watford.

Take some family trips at the weekend beyond the north circular. Stick a pin in a map. Or follow up some of the very good suggestions here. Treat it as an adventure for the weekend and see where the road takes you and what you might find.

Frankly, after one weekend in North Yorkshire you may wonder what you've been doing all these years.

(And I say that as someone who grew up in a part of the south west of England where Londoners escape to for the weekend in droves.)

Knackers I remember a poster on a similar thread a while ago saying that she wouldn't move out of London as she didn't want to live in a village.

Why is enjoyingmycoffee being slated and accused of being arrogant? Much of the arrogance on this thread comes from non-Londoners London-bashing. Some people have said there's not so much a north-south divide but a London/ rest of country divide. So that being the case then her view is justified: nowhere else is like London.

I've lived in London for 19 years. It's a fantastic city to raise kids in. There is never a dull moment. The Science Museum, Natural History Museum, National Portrait Gallery, Transport Museum are our regular stomping grounds, the kids have seen shows in the West End, ballet, live music, they have dance classes in a world class facility, if they prove to be musical/ theatrical/sporty the opportunities are at their fingertips. They're kids of the world - streetwise but accepting and tolerant of different cultures, races and languages. Kent's on our doorstep with it's countryside and beaches. What else do they need? Houses are small but there are parks everywhere. And there are far less UKIP voters!

Chase - there is a vast difference between expressing affection and attachment to your own home and expressing disdain and ridicule about other people's homes. at 'hysterical'.

KnackersYard yes of course there are cities outside of London (I grew up in one, which has also been European City of Culture) but they feel like small towns compared to London. Mostly because they ARE much smaller.

I still don't get why it's OK for people to say they don't understand why anybody would want to live in London but not OK for a Londoner to say they don't understand why anybody would want to live anywhere BUT London. Double standards!

Mumofwildthings - oh right, so now anyone outside of London is an intolerant UKIP voter?

Who's making offensive remarks now?

Agreed that two wrongs never make a right, but I don't think I did much London bashing, (Apart from me saying London is expensive for a 20 something. Which, if you're talking about property, it kind of is - no?)

Just trying to show what the rest of the country had to offer as a counterbalance to the claims that anywhere outside of London was a cultural and moral void.

I am constantly on the blower to the council about fly tipping.
I'd estimate there are about 80 bin bags and a couple of 3 piece suites discarded across the road from me.
Three months on and nothing has been done about it.
I know who the offenders are and the council have said that they need to call for interpreters to advise them how to discard of unwanted items.
I suggested posting information in several languages as perhaps these people do not know there are agencies or whatever that can dispose or collect such waste.
Perhaps it is a case of lack of funds or not appearing to be racist?
I'm not saying it is always non British that fly tip; far from it.
From my limited experience of living here for 16 years I'd say the working immigrants are very house proud and that extends to their front yards.
The long term " scroungers" and benefit migrants are a completely different kettle of fish.
Walk a mile in my shoes.

You have coal Puzzled? We dream of coal

Not really, no - us 'ave to burn wot's left of t'Racing Paper an' t'Pig Breeder when us mam 'as finished oop wiv it in t'outside lavvy

Derbyshire is beautiful

That's what I keep trying to tell them. Biased - me?? Naaawwwww!!!!

Probably a good moment to post this: