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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think my brother does not have bipolar disorder?

147 replies

CundtBake · 30/12/2014 11:58

My brother is early 20s and lives at home with our parents.

He doesn't work, he claims ESA (I think that's what it's called?) by saying he is depressed and basically spends it all on weed.

He is so lazy. His new tactic seems to be to convince himself that he has various mental health disorders to get him out of doing anything. Nothing has ever been diagnosed (other than depression years ago).

When he doesn't have weed he is moody and can't sleep. He's now decided he needs to be tested for bipolar disorder. AIBU in thinking he's taking the puss and he's just a lazy drug addict? I'm so fed up of him minimising mental health disorders like this. Surely if he had bipolar disorder it would be noticeable?

OP posts:
crumblebumblebee · 30/12/2014 12:45

Do people really look for help on AIBU? It just sounded so judgemental with little basis. You can't see mental ill health, so how would you know?!

ILovePud · 30/12/2014 12:45

CundtBake it's hard having a mental health problem but it's hard living with someone with one too. I think lots of relatives would struggle to see a younger sibling living this way and seemingly wasting their life away. Feeling angry and frustrated is a normal response, I get the sense that you're trying to help your brother. Do you know why he's not having any treatment?

SuperMumTum · 30/12/2014 12:45

Some doctors do not require much persuasion to sign people off repeatedly for years without any in depth investigation into their problems. Its true.

Sallystyle · 30/12/2014 12:46

I hear you CundtBake

I think we are in the exact same situation but no one is going to understand it all without going into the years and years of backstory. You will be accused of being cold, not understanding, not knowing the details etc and unless you are willing to go into details of the years worth of problems not many people are going to understand.

On the face of it it can seem like we are unsupportive but if your brother is anything like my family member you have had years of hell, a huge strain has been placed on your family, right? Years of it.

Sallystyle · 30/12/2014 12:47

It is very true Supermum, despite some people here who think they know better.

Seen it with my own eyes time and time again.

FreudiansSlipper · 30/12/2014 12:50

There are lots and lots of people being signed off for depression

a short questionnaire is what many GP's use as a guidance for depression

it is not their fault there is not enough support for people with depression be it mild or severe and people get into a situation that often does not help them and their symptoms get worse

ILovePud · 30/12/2014 12:50

I'd agree with that too SuperMumTum and it can be hugely damaging for the individual, their future and their family.

Original poster
CundtBake · 30/12/2014 12:51

Yes U2 you're so right. I've been in tears writing all of this. I always get accused of being cold and hard nosed but in my family situations I've had to be because nobody else takes charge of anything.

He has had counselling and medication in the past but isn't now.

OP posts:
ILovePud · 30/12/2014 12:54

GP's should be following guidelines and offering patients antidepressants and/or talking therapies, it wouldn't be acceptable to fob off patients with other serious illnesses and mental health problems should be no different.

AnotherGirlsParadise · 30/12/2014 12:57

U2, I know what you mean about your husband's bipolar disorder - I also get the terrible, agitated 'black' manias. There are none of the fabled flights of creativity and energy, just an awful restlessness and very often psychosis.

Bipolar disorder is a nightmare.

ILovePud · 30/12/2014 12:57

There are lots of different types of antidepressants and different types of talking therapy. I don't know if you're using the term counselling generically but counselling wouldn't be recommended for severe depression. The NICE guidelines say that someone should be offered CBT (cognitive behavioural therapy) or IPT (Interpersonal Psychotherapy) alongside antidepressants in this instance.

Fairylea · 30/12/2014 12:59

The thing is op even if you're right and he doesn't have bipolar disorder or whatever other problems he thinks he has, it may be that he has generalised health anxiety. That in itself can be very debilitating. (My dh suffers from it to the extreme, he has been to the gp about 4 times in the last month convinced he has some sort of cancer - he has had every test going. Admittedly he does still keep a full time job going but it is different for everyone). It doesn't have to be about physical illness. It can also be about mental health. He does however need to accept help and medication regardless of whether it is depression or health anxiety. Once he gets into the system for long term esa they will expect him to accept and take treatment.

mytartanscarf · 30/12/2014 13:00

When my brother was addicted to prescription drugs the GP just kept prescribing them in lethal amounts Hmm way to go.

NobodyLivesHere · 30/12/2014 13:00

You sound like my ex, he refuses to believe there is anything 'wrong' with me, despite my doctor signing me off and passing multiple medicals with the dwp. 'Just' depression is a serious illness you know.

PausingFlatly · 30/12/2014 13:00

A person will only have had a back-to-work interview if they're put in the less seriously ill group (Work Related Activity Group) after the ATOS medical. People are put in the WRAG if they are at a certain disability level, even if their condition is degenerative and they are not expected ever to be able to work again.

If someone's put in the group for more seriously ill people (Support Group), then they won't have a back to work interview while in that group. Though they will if their condition improves and they are moved to the WRAG.

U2, I have seen posters on MN claiming to be mental health professionals, saying they don't believe in diagnosing specific mental illnesses, because "there may not be a difference between them and anyway it doesn't matter".

This attitude is, um, interesting and it's certainly not an approach they'd get away with to measurable attributes like having a temperature ("it doesn't matter whether your temperature is caused by pneumonia or measles, we'll just treat the temperature").

I hadn't realised it also leads onlookers to say, "You don't have a diagnosis, therefore you're not ill." Hmm

Original poster
CundtBake · 30/12/2014 13:00

Yes I used the term counselling generally. He has had several lots of CBT

OP posts:
Sallystyle · 30/12/2014 13:01

I would leave this thread OP.

Without the backstory people won't get it, well not many.

I am not at all uneducated on mental health issues, how I wish I was sometimes! I care for a person with a severe mental illness, I am going to uni to train to be a MH nurse and I have a mental disorder myself. I am very active in raising awareness of mental illnesses etc.

When I say my family member does everything they can to never take responsibility for their life, which includes making up these mental illnesses then I mean it. It is not me being hard or uneducated, I just know this person inside out. They are troubled for sure, lack self confidence and have some anxiety issues but seeking out another diagnosis of years of doing so to be told repeatedly that they don't have a mental disorder is yet another way for this person to avoid responsibility. I would never say that about someone I don't know, but in this case I know this is the truth and it is frustrating to watch.

You have to be troubled to live life that way for sure but one one doctors has ever be able to give a diagnosis and they all came to the same conclusion.

ilovechristmas1 · 30/12/2014 13:03

after the 3months the DWP take over the decision making on who is fit for work

that was one of the reasons ESA was introduced as to many GP's were fooled into signing them of longterm

for years the GP was the main port of call where sickness benefit (incapacity benefit) was concerned,now its the DWP

Original poster
CundtBake · 30/12/2014 13:05

U2 how would you advise me to support him from here? He's tried medication and counselling, I don't think he's open to trying again. He won't give up the drugs. He just wants to be left alone to live life on benefits playing xbox and smoking weed. I know deep down this isn't what he wants but any kind of help is accepted half heartedly and he gives up in the end. Where do we go from here?

OP posts:
SaucyJack · 30/12/2014 13:06

Thing is..... even if he wasn't depressed to start with, sitting about the house all day smoking skunk will frequently make you depressed anyway.

I do agree it sounds as tho he isn't being helped to help himself.

Sallystyle · 30/12/2014 13:06

And yes, I know you can be mentally unwell without having a diagnosis but I get the impression that the OP's brother is similar to my family member.

It is so hard to explain it all without going into years of history. Like I said, if I don't know the person I would never assume they didn't have a mental illness just because they didn't have a diagnosis yet, but sometimes when you really know someone and have been through all of it with them you know what is really happening.

Sallystyle · 30/12/2014 13:08

Honestly CundtBake, I have kind of given up now.

I know my hands are tied, I can't do more and I have just had to try to emotionally detach somewhat.

After years and years of it I have had to learn I am powerless to help and all I can do is be there if they ask for my help.

ILovePud · 30/12/2014 13:10

I'm sorry to hear the CBT hasn't helped your brother, sometimes it's a case of it not being the right time or the right person to help but talking therapies don't help everyone. There's lots of other things out there that might help your brother if he's open to him. Organisations like MIND often provide helpful services or can be useful in terms of sign posting to other community resources that might help.

Hoppinggreen · 30/12/2014 13:15

I hVe family members with Bipolar disorder and believe I occasionally exhibit the symptoms myself.
However, I believe that a few people do claim mental health issues as an excuse to get out of work or other situations.
Someone I know who has just been convicted of an offence tried to use being Bi polar to reduce their prison sentence - never had any symptoms or diagnosis before.
If you do want to just sit around on your arse and smoke weed I suppose claiming to have MH issues is as good a way as any to justify it.

FreudiansSlipper · 30/12/2014 13:20

your brother may have a huge amount of resistance to change, he seems to for taking responsibility for himself and therapy can often take time to work just working through the resistance people put up even if they are not aware can take time

also at times people do not want to make the effort to change but they want to be in a different place, it is very hard working with people who are in this situation as your brother may be its so frustrating for family members they need support too it can really drag those around down

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