help with the practical positives and negatives of formula feeding

[KnackeredMerrily]

I'm currently breastfeeding my week old but we are struggling with putting weight on and jaundice.

I've been here before with my first son, and the first months of his life with feeding him 20 times a day and expressing top up feeds. The idea of doing it again makes me want to curl up into a ball and weep.

But, I've never gone through the practicalities of formula feeding either. What is it like? How do you make feeds up in advance? Is it a fiddle travelling with bottles and keeping them warm and wondering how much they've had? Is one formula better than another?

I am well aware of the benefits of breastfeeding so I don't need to hear that slant. I'm just wondering what the day to day life is like when FF

Wow just looked at the tommee tippee perfect prep!

I will definitely be purchasing one of these!

This is really interesting. DP (SAHD) is making up FFs as he goes along ... perhaps we're being too cautious in not making up the bottles in advance?

We often have a the-kettle-water-hasn't-cooled-down enough-and-DS-is-kicking-off-all-over-the-place crisis!

Is it really okay to pre prepare formula (we use Aptamil).

princess outdated

Mmm change to fashionable and I would agree with you. If I had a pound for every time advice changes over feeding and sleeping etc I would me rich indeed.

You need to be reasonably careful but not ott unless your baby is compromised.

Spent lots of time in the 80s making up formula feeds for babies. You can make them up before hand and store.

Just be sensible. The worst thing is people fussing unnecessarily. Most British homes are clean enough with good fridges.

Don't get obsessive just sensible.

80s was in a paediatric ward btw.

Mine were born later.

Of course it is wish

Everyone did in the 80s:90s and I did with my last baby in 2000.

Trouble is there's some research and everything changes.

We were told to out babies in their tummies with my first never on their backs. My dm used to worry but we pesisted as that was the advice.

It was fucking dangerous and based on dodgy research. My dm was right and I thought she was outdated!

Just do what feels right for you and yours. By all means look at the current guidelines but apply sense.

Thanks boody. I've been thinking along these lines for a while, but DP is a first time dad and pretty cautious.

I may be able to work on him now.

Now I've actually read the whole thread though, I think we'll need to clean our fridge out first

Firstly op congratulations!

The only problems I encountered with formula feeding was a bit of guilt at first, I never even considered formula feeding but due to a medical issue I did not produce any bm. The guilt did start to go away once I noticed that ds was happy and thriving on formula.

I found it great that dh could make up and share the feeds with me, we took it in turns during the night for the first few weeks.

I made up milk with boiling water and left it in a bowl of cold water to cool down, then I put it right in the back of the fridge. I discarded milk after 24 hours.

Going out I would use cartons with a sterelised bottle.I was lucky enough when out and about that ds would drink room temp milk, but friends of mine had travel warmers. Later on I did use the powder pots and pre cooled boiled water and didn't have any problems.

I did find it easier to wash up each bottle as I used it if I could, as occasionaly I did find it a bit of a chore washing all the bottles up at the end of the day, it also made going out easier if you had plenty of bottles to hand.

Oh sorry to waffle on! But with night feeds, if budget/space allow then a mini fridge and bottle warmer in your room/the nursery are very handy!

Can I offer an alternative here - this is not me pushing breastfeeding at all or mentioning the benefits, but I'm just wondering whether with some support in getting the latch right if you could continue breastfeeding? Most of all breastfeeding issues are down to the latch needing a bit of fine tuning. I don't know if there are any breastfeeding groups or not near you?

The advice to make up powdered feeds fresh with water of above 70 degrees didn't change on a whim, but in response to a spate of cases of meningitis and salmonella in Europe (resulting in the deaths of a small number of babies) caused by contaminated formula.

The World Health Organisation recommendations are that all vulnerable babies (compromised babies, preterm babies and term babies under 8 weeks) should now be fed ready made formula as a first choice, or powdered formula made up with water of over 70 degrees, and that this group shouldn't have preprepared and stored formula feeds made up from powdered formula.

"There's lots of conflicting advice as per how to prep and store milk etc"

Actually there isn't conflicting advice from official sources - NHS choices: here Unicef: here

Yes for compromised babies as I said in my post. Or premmies.

Most arnt and it's fine.

That is exactly my point about research and guidelines. The wholesale putting babies in their tummies arose from prem babies seemingly doing better that way. It was applied across the board and that was wrong even as we now know dangerous.

Sweeping catch all guidelines are stupid and cause parents huge anxiety and needless worry.

Most British homes and fridges are clean enough and you do not need to make up feeds as you go along unless you choose to.

Commem sense.

Wish your fridge will sparkle

It also might take some pressure off as if you weren't expressing and storing DP/other (sorry dont know if you have) can feed them and you get some rest.

I think many men, myself included enjoyed feeding the child.

Though its purely anecdotal I feel my 14th month son acts way more positively to me and seeks me out compared to friends son of the same age who was exclusively BF by mother.

Yes think we are all aware of the latest advice however it's always worth considering,

Advice is written to catch the most educationally challenged. So it's easy to say make up as you go along. Just incase people make up a few days supply.

Secondly we are a risk averse society and the ff companies don't want to get sued so it's easier to supply this basic advice.

A reasonably intelligent person would throw away unused milk after a day and are clean enough in the preparation.

Advice needs to be assimilated and applied sensibly and resdonably.

It's absolutely fine for the op to make up
And store milk.

If she had a premmie or ill baby or she was of low intelligence and ability or didn't have a fridge then the make up as you go would be sensible.

It's not set in stone. Parenting isn't.

I use Dr Brown's Bottles (££ but worth it) (second baby who has had them) - see below for tip for how to stop them leaking! (you will always hear people say this)

Formula - use Aptamil powder, but will always have a supply of ready made in for those times I haven't got round to making milk (happens frequently!) and for when we're out and about.

Out and About - get a Tommy Tippee flask. A lot of shops/restaurants now eg Costa) will not give you hot water to warm up your milk (good old Health and Safety) so you must take your own. One good exception that will though is good old M&S . Take a sterilised bottle with you and the ready to go pour stuff.

At home - I pre make up mostly.

Top tip for those with Dr Brown bottles - make up the feed in tommy tippee bottles with lids. Shake them to your hearts content. Pour boiling water in, let stand for 15 mins ish, add the powder then flash cool immediately. Then dump into the fridge.

When you want the milk, take out, whack the tommy tippee bottle in the microwave (shock), quick 40 secs, Done. Pour into a sterilised Dr Browns bottle and you're good to go.

Both of these methods are much much safer than what my friend did (imo) who took out cool boiled water to add to powder and then shook it up to mix whilst she was out. Quite where she got the idea from that so long as the water had been boiled, it would make the feed safe I have no idea.

The reason you use just boiled water is to kill bugs in the powder.

However, what you could do, is take boiling water out with you (in the tommy tippee flask), put cool boiled water into a Dr Brown bottle. Pour say 3 oz of hot water into a tommy tippee shaker, add 3 scoops of powder, shake and then add the remaining 3 oz of cool water to mix. Then put all back into the Dr Browns bottle. This is another good way to make a safe feed whilst you are out.

Making as you go isn't set in stone, as the official guidelines explain the making in advance option. But making with boiled and still very hot water to kill the bacteria in the formula is standard. I get very grumpy when I see the wee pots of powder being mixed with cold water

My HV gave me a copy of this booklet on formula feeding and it has a section on making feeds in advance:

www.nhs.uk/start4life/documents/pdfs/start4life_guide_to_bottle_feeding.pdf

I usually make up 5 bottles in advance

• Boil water in kettle
• wash up bottles
• sterilise bottles in microwave steam steriliser (6 minutes)
• 30 minutes after the kettle has boiled, pour the water into the bottles, add the formula milk powder
• Shake well
• cool under tap
• store in back of fridge
• when feed is needed, heat up bottle in a bowl of boiling hot water for about 5 minutes

In advance to the bottles and steriliser, I'd advise getting a Tommee Tippee flask so you can heat up bottles when you're out and about (saves asking for hot water), and also getting an insulated bag to transport the bottles to keep them cold outside of the fridge.

The main benefits of formula feeding for me are that other people can feed the baby and I can see how much milk the baby is having.

We have a Perfect Prep machine and it is great - we used to bring it upstairs at night! We also have the Mam self-sterilising bottles (hard to explain but basically they come apart and can be sterilised in the microwave by themselves) so have never needed a steriliser - I'd thoroughly recommend them.

You can warm bottles in the microwave too - you just have to shake them well and test the temperature (friend that was a SCBU nurse told me not to bother faffing around with jugs of hot water).

We used to make up around 4 to 6 bottles as chips recommends.

Big plus is that other people can give your baby a bottle too - DS1 loved feeding his little brother (as did DH, mum and MIL).

HV recommended making a note of when the baby got hungry - we soon realised that both of them went straight into a nice 4 hr cycle, so DH could give a bottle at 11pm, I could do the 3am and DH do the 7am, meaning we all got a decent run of sleep.

We used a microwave steriliser at home, and sterilizing tablets if away.

Both of ours did well on SMA Gold.

Theboobythatrocked you are giving out advice that could make someone's baby ill. Do you feel comfortable about that? Advice changes because a) research gives us better information and b) products change. Formula powder is not sterile, it's not about how someone's fridge is. Why not follow guidelines re making up formula correctly if it means your baby won't get salmonella etc? Not too much extra effort surely. The guidelines are there because babies got ill and some died.

Op, posts by rootandbranch stand out for relevant up to date info on safely making up formula.

Jeezo, I've been formula feeding confidently since 5month old DD was a week old and even I'm feeling overwhelmed reading this thread!
Another vote for the Tommee tippee perfect prep machine - no hassle at all, takes literally 2 mins and ready to go. If we're out and about I take a sterilised bottle and a ready made aptamil bottle (80p a pop so a bit on the expensive side) - good for 2hrs once poured and DD will take at room temp so no heating up needed.
Read the NHS guidelines, gives you a breakdown of how to make a bottle up.

Also I'm really not sure on a Pp advice to take out 2 pre made up bottles - as far as I understand it they should be thrown away after 2hrs. I've never pre made and kept in the fridge though, so I don't know about what happens once you take them out of the fridge. I'm not comfortable pre-making so not sure on the ins and outs of those who do, but taking them out the fridge for any length of time before serving seems wrong.

I bought ready made. Couldn't be doing with the powdery faffing.

"Yes think we are all aware of the latest advice however it's always worth considering,

Advice is written to catch the most educationally challenged."

Actually huge numbers of people DON'T understand the advice and aren't following it. The last big infant feeding survey done by the government in 2010 showed that fewer than half of all women with newborn babies were following the three most important recommendations on making up feeds and according to this survey,"Mothers from Black and Asian ethnic groups (72% and 64% respectively), those who had
never worked (64%), those aged under 20 (63%) and those living in the most deprived IMD quintile (57%) were the most likely to follow all three recommendations on preparing powdered formula.

And having a degree from Oxford won't stop your baby getting ill if the powder you make their feed up with is infected with salmonella or e-sakazakii and you've not used water hot enough to kill it off.

"It's absolutely fine for the op to make up
And store milk."

Yes OP - just ignore NHS advice on safe feeding.

"We were told to out babies in their tummies with my first never on their backs. My dm used to worry but we pesisted as that was the advice.

It was fucking dangerous and based on dodgy research. "

It wasn't based on any research at all.

Current recommendations on safe sleeping are.

As are current recommendations on safe formula feeding.

I mix feed my 4 month old. We use Hipp which I've always found better on their tummies (I have two DC) and it's cheaper. Follow on milk is an advertising ploy so you don't have to buy into it.

We make the bottles up in advance, cool quickly and store in the fridge until needed. We then re heat as needed. The water needs to be hot to kill any bacteria in the powder. I used to use a microwave steriliser but now we use a Milton tank and it's just so much less of a faff. The bottles are always there ready, breast pump bits, whatever. You just change the water every 24 hours. We use Tommee Tippee bottles.