to wonder if you even realise you're doing it?

[JessieMcJessie]

I have a lot of friends with toddlers. I like to catch up with them now and again, and they seem to like the idea of spending some time with me.

However most of them seem to find it completely acceptable to ask me how I am, or get me to start telling an anecdote, but then repeatedly cut me off mid-sentence to talk to the child. I'm not talking about life-threatening situations here - it's absolutely fine to ignore my story about how my brother is recovering after his hospital stay in order to administer the heimlich manoevre to a three year old. You don't even need to say "excuse me" first.

But asking the child if they want some toast or a story - not so much. I suspect that this is how they engage with their partners/other Mums and they forget how it comes across to others, and they probably think that as a close friend I won't mind as I had said I wanted to see the toddler, and he/she is cute etc. I do mind though. Last time it happened I actually felt so offended I wanted to cry - my friend clearly wasn't the slightest bit interested in what I had to say and admitted when she finally turned her attention back to me that she'd forgotten what I'd said.

So. AIBU to wonder if you even notice that you're causing offence?

[Sarsparilla]

You're right, parents probably don't fully realise they are doing it. Or they sort of realise but assume that you understand why it is necessary.

That's life with toddlers unfortunately, you can't just completely switch off and ignore them, because they might do something dangerous, or destructive, or whatever. You cannot give 100% of your attention, you have to have awareness of where your child is and what they are doing.

I do often find myself in a conversation with a childless friend, and start thinking God, why can't she see I really need to attend to my child now, why is she still talking, and I wait a bit to see if they stop talking so I can attend to the child in a natural break. But they don't notice, they just carry on talking, whereas it is so obvious to me that the child needs attention if we are to preserve any possibility of having any more conversation, and my attention starts to wander a bit because I now need to keep a closer eye on my child because the situation is escalating a bit, but I want to continue the conversation too - as you say it is rude to just break off - and maybe if I just keep a closer eye on what is going on with my child we can carry on a bit longer and I won't have to step in just yet, and then the toddler needs me NOW and I do have to just interrupt them.

I can imagine it's annoying . It's annoying for me too!

Whereas generally friends with children tend to notice too - plus they have 10% of their brain on child surveillance anyway -, and so they'll stop talking before you get that far. Or if they don't, they'll do the same thing to you 5 minutes later, so you're even.

[vdbfamily]

have not read whole thread but I know that I have a very needy friend who thinks that if I am not making constant eye contact with her then I am not listening.If I met up with her when my kids were younger, and took my eyes off her for a few seconds, she would repeatedly say my name until I looked back at her. I had to tell her so many times that if she wanted to meet me regularly,during the day whilst I had small children with me,then she would have to get used to me listening to her whilst watching the kids.I had to re-explain this EVERY time. I was not being rude,just a responsible parent. I do agree though OP that often children are given too much priority mid conversation.Mine know not to interrupt adult conversation unless essential....it does not always work but if interrupted I will ask them to wait until at least the end of a sentence/story etc.

[Jackiebrambles]

I think understanding 'please don't interrupt Mummy, I'm talking' can only realistically be used from a certain age though.

My DS is 22 months, no way would he understand and do that!!

[MrsKoala]

Also OP you say the last time your friend admitted she couldn't remember what you were saying. But is this a one off? I ask because i am quite capable of looking away and even speaking to my dc while listening to someone. As a mother of 2 small dc i am actually really good at paying attention to a few things at once. You may not feel as tho you are getting any attention from them, but is it possible that you are getting more than you realise? Or do you need the constant reassurance of eye contact to feel listened to? (not narky btw, just a question because i know some people mind more than others)

[BauerTime]

Sarsparilla you are right! I can not count the amount of times a non-parent friend of mine talks and talks and talks so you have to just walk away mid-sentence to stop DS breaking his neck or similar as they just seem completely unaware of what is going on and do not pause to allow the situation to be dealt with.

Saying that I don't think she bats an eyelid at me walking off mid-conversation as she knows that she is not my priority, even as boring fascinating as her holiday sounds.

[TheRealAmandaClarke]

The alternative is for them to not ask you about yourself. I expect they're interested in your life and just trying to chat.
I think you just need to appreciate that when you're in the company of ppl who have their toddlers with them their attention will not be 100% on you. Small children need constant supervision and lots of attention.
Once you're aware of that fact it seems a little inappropriate to whinge about the fact that your friends' attention flits to their toddlers mid conversation.
Or are we expecting a toddler to be more patient and understanding than an adult?

[TheRealAmandaClarke]

Sarsparilla excellent post.

[RumbleMum]

OP, it sounds like you're being very considerate towards your friends, going to visit them and interacting with their kids.

I know exactly how frustrating this is, and there is a spectrum. People who repeatedly interrupt you for less important stuff (to comment on the wonderful things DC are doing, for example) are infuriating. However, when you have a toddler it is more or less impossible to hold an uninterrupted conversation, as you're obviously aware.

As PP posters have said, though, your friends are probably DESPERATE for adult conversation and to hear how you are, so it WBU to ask them not to talk about stuff like that. The problem is, it's very difficult to 'look' interested when you're constantly scanning for meltdowns/accidents/hazards - however much you want to hear the answer, it's hard to keep eye contact and not interrupt the flow of conversation with a toddler in tow. And I've done the forgetting-what-friend-was-talking about and it genuinely wasn't because I wasn't interested - as PP have said, it's because my brain had melted.

I do agree, though, people should be aware they're doing it - I always apologise even to my friends with similar age children.

[TheRealAmandaClarke]

Actually I have just re read your posts and I am irritated now.
"Making things worse" what? By trying to chat to you? It sounds quite needy.
Have you not understood what ppl are saying about the needs of toddlers? It seems ironic that you're complaining about ppl not listening to you and you're not grasping the issue here.
They're not being rude. That is what parents of toddlers have to do.
Get over it or hang out with someone lese.

[TheRealAmandaClarke]

Else.

[misskangaandroo2014]

These parents are essentially 'at work' parenting. This is quite intense at the toddler stage and toddlers need 'training' in social etiquette so do my older than this DD's . If you called a friend at work you'd keep it succinct and organise something in their free time. Of course the dilemma is parents of toddlers are very much 'on call' a lot of the time. The presence of friends (and ones interested enough to visit with children there) i always appreciated, but I was always on hot coals trying to chat and prevent toddler crises.

[SkudSikker]

I find it annoying too. Half way through an intersting story or something quite personal and or important and you're cut off mid sentence by the adult attending to child, not even child asking for attention.
My kids older now but i was and am still capable of fobbing my kids off a bit if a friend is talking to me!

[cherubimandseraphim]

^YABU not to empathise with your friends and realise that they would much, much rather have a proper conversation with you. They just can't.

With a toddler you constantly have to ward off meltdowns; you're also so keyed into their needs that it feels biologically impossible to switch off to them - which is as it should be, unfortunately for adult conversation.

Even if your friends tried to ignore their toddlers in your favour, it wouldn't last five minutes and would result in a great deal of stress.^

^^ This. As others have said, you pretty much need one pair of eyes watching a small toddler every single second (unless they are in an extremely safe childproof space). Your parent friends are "managing" their toddlers by talking to them, giving them attention, watching them and intervening - a small child can be about to do something very dangerous pretty much any second and you just don't have a choice but to keep monitoring and managing. My 2yo willdo things like stand up in a highchair in a restaurant and step out of it and fall to the floor if I wasn't constantly checking to see if her body language suggests she's about to stand up (no harnesses seem to stop this). They grab knives, they pick up sticks and pencils and run with them (and have no instinct to pull the stick away from their eyes if they flop over), they have sudden distressed meltdowns for no reason and then you simply have to leave. Added to all of that, you are sleep-deprived, exhausted, and overstretched (I haven't had a night's sleep longer than 6hrs for over 2 years - and the first year or so often much less - baby woke every 2 1/2-3hrs! I have a job as well and my attention is frazzled).

Thanks, I'm glad that maybe you'll now be a bit more aware of the impression that you may inadvertently be giving.

^^ This comment of your was massively rude and passive aggressive, OP. I get that you are irritated by not having your friends' full attention. I can guarantee you that in return they probably feel like you are complacent, don't understand what it's like to have a small child, and think you're self-absorbed. I recognise that I'm not so much fun these days to some people as I used to be; but then I also think that some of my child free friends are massively self-indulgent and when they are telling me about their hard day at work or their hangovers or whatever I can't really communicate how these things pale into insignificance next to the experiences I've had over the last two years - traumatic birth and all. I do try hard, but it's quite an effort for me to show a LOT of interest and concern in how they're really tired because they were out late a few nights in a row, or whatever, because I tend to think they should really get a bit of a grip. Not all of them though - some of my childless friends are lovely. Others probably need to grow up a bit and realise that people with small toddlers are not going to be able, physically, mentally or socially, to act like they don't have said toddlers.

[TheRealAmandaClarke]

Yy Cherubim
Absolutely

[fluffyraggies]

Skimmed last third of thread so sorry if i'm repeating.

Why not just wait till the situation with the toddler is dealt with ... and then say 'as i was saying ...', draw your friend back to you and get on with answering the question?

In my opinion/experience you can easily have that in depth convo with toddlers around, but it does take longer and and needs the participants to 'hold that thought' a lot. What were we saying? Is another good phrase.

My old friend and i used to put the world deeply to rights with SIX under 5's all round our feet (3 each), all perfectly well fed, cleaned and entertained while we really picked the bones out of a subject ... but it did take all afternoon per topic

[cherubimandseraphim]

Yes, and I do understand that if you aren't responsible for a toddler you don't realise what it's like (I have friends who are really, genuinely puzzled as to why I can't do a full day's work from home whilst looking after a 2yo. I mean they really, genuinely don't understand that it's not possible). I'm absolutely sure I didn't realise, either, before I did this. Fair dos.

But the numbers of hazards are huge pretty much everywhere you go, and no-one else is responsible for keeping your tiny child alive/uninjured, only you. A moment's lapse and something awful could/CAN happen (I let my mum help my toddler up a slide ONCE and we sent up to A&E having her checked for a fractured skull for 5 hours that evening - just from her foot slipping on the slide steps). Outside? Look away and your toddler has put a mushroom/yew berry/discarded fag in her mouth. By the road? Toddler tries to run into traffic with no warning, chasing a leaf. Inside a cafe or someone's house? Someone has left a cup of hot tea on a table with the handle turned out. There is a forgotten wine glass, or a glass table with a sharp corner at eye height, or someone's pack of paracetamol, or a little Lego piece your toddler is about to choke on. I could go on....as a toddler parent you are constantly scanning the room for dangers before they happen - and that's before even getting to managing the toddler's behaviour. It's bloody EXHAUSTING and yes, I would love to be able to make eye contact and ask about someone's brother in law and listen attentively to the answer. But if we end up in A&E or DD has a tantrum it'll be ME who was in charge/responsible, not child free friend.

[fluffyraggies]

Oh and ''AIBU to wonder if you even notice that you're causing offence?''

You're not being U to wonder it, no. However YABU to realise they don't mean to cause offence,and be a little less precious about yourself.

[Boomtownsurprise]

Putting this very bluntly op, I'd drop you like a hot fucking brick.

You are an adult. But now you're competing and getting jealous of a 2yr old?

Have you noticed how your friends life has altered? Do you see her cry with frustration? Have you actually asked her how she is and listened to her answer?

Get your head out of arse op. Or the friendships doomed.

[MrsKoala]

Cherub - i have often said on mn that since having dc my imagination is just a stream of scenarios which would be right at home on the Final Destination series. In fact i reckon the writers are more than likely parents of toddlers channeling their everyday thoughts.

[Beangarda]

Cherubim, that entire post was so vivid, I found myself scanning the room for hazards, although my toddler hasn't even home!

And yes, I think that's one of the things that is difficult to imagine until you actually have a child (or work as a nanny), that it's your job, and your job only, to keep them safe from things you'd never previously considered to be dangers.

Ten seconds inattention from me, as I walked around the end of the cot to pick up a forgotten baby bottle with a bundle of laundry under my arm (which meant I hadn't refastened the stair gate as I had no free hand and was dazed with sleeplessness) allowed my newly-mobile 11 month old to toddle out of the room behind me, fall down the stairs top to bottom and need an ambulance to hospital. That's normal fir the parent of a small child, but you don't forget or entirely forgive yourself the lapse.

[Aherdofmims]

I think you have to at least stop for a moment and tell the toddler to wait because otherwise they can just keep on and on saying "Mummy!". If they are older then they should be past interrupting stage. If your friends are just turning to the toddler for no reason and asking them something then clearly YANBU.

BUT it is unrealistic to start on an interminable story when there are kids around because it ain't going to happen and they really can't wait that long. Some people just can't spit it out whether there are toddlers or not, and generally it is a bit impolite to start on a monologue when you could just get to the point (not saying you do this, but there are people who do).

My Mum is bad for just ignoring/interrupting me when my kids are about. She just turns to them if they say anything while I am trying to talk to her as though I wasn't there, so I do feel your pain. She never tells dd to wait (ds is a baby) and they are my kids, for goodness sake. I tell her to wait but them I have dm and dd in league against me. I am generally trying to ask something of immediate necessity at the time (something that concerns our usual plans).

My PIL (although lovely) is the opposite and will let dd get blue with frustration while he ignores her to talk to the adults, but to be fair he is pretty deaf!

[cherubimandseraphim]

Koala Beangarda absolutely The OP might not think it's a "life threatening situation", but the point is that part of our attention always has to be on the chilf