....to ask what you think of white poppies (Remembrance-related)?

[PlumpingUpPartridge]

I had been dimly aware of the existence of white poppies but hadn't really given them much thought until DH mentioned them this weekend. I checked out the website and saw this:

linky

I liked this quote:

"In 1933 the first white poppies appeared on Armistice Day (called Remembrance Day after World War Two). The white poppy was not intended as an insult to those who died in the First World War - a war in which many of the white poppy supporters lost husbands, brothers, sons and lovers - but a challenge to the continuing drive to war. The following year the newly founded Peace Pledge Union began widespread distribution of the poppies and their annual promotion."

I am very happy to express my admiration and respect for those who died in wars, but I don't particularly want to see any more wars. I don't know what the alternative is, but I'd like to see more effort go into finding it.

I've been sifting through the threads and noticed some anti-white poppy feeling (along the lines of 'it's disrespectful'). I didn't grow up here so don't have childhood experience to guide me on this. Please can you tell me what you think of it and, if you think it's disrespectful, why?

I'm not a journalist by the way, just curious and trying to be impartial

I once knew an old soldier who had seen the concentration camp at Belsen a few days after it was liberated and had fought in the desert and through Italy to Monte Cassino alongside two of the doctors who had gone into the camp on the first day. They told him that what they had seen had made them vomit. He said "Although they had been able to cope with the wounds inflicted on men by war, they had not been able to deal with what had been begun in what some people would have described as peace." He went on to say that it was what he saw then that made him decide to stay in the Army after the war because every person has to decide for themselves whether there are some things that are even worse than war and whether those things should be resisted for the sake of those who come afterwards. He added that such decisions need to be made in time because "the eleventh hour is appointed for Remembrance; it is too late for decisions." It made me think again about what I came to see as the easy assumptions of some pacifism that war can always and without fail be avoided without adverse consequences. It also made me determined to honour those who had, as he had, given up six years of his life, in many cases their entire lives, so that we, and most of Europe at least, could enjoy a life free of places like Belsen. I think he would have respected people's right to wear a white poppy but would have questioned their wisdom, motives and purpose - especially as he had seen so many friends killed by reason of lack of equipment and inadequate defence spending during the 1930s. The Peace Pledge Union, which is behind white poppies, was, of course, at the forefront of the campaign for such inadequacy and the appeasement which went with it. So I shall be out rattling my tin for the RBL again this year in memory of that old soldier and the millions here and throughout the Empire (India fielded the biggest volunteer Army in history) who fought and died so that we are free to have this debate.

NickiFury but the army/government should be paying for their care - it shouldn't be reliant on the goodwill of others.

I don't know a single soldier that doesnt hope for peace. It's pretty daft to suggest that soldiers 'want' or 'glorify' war. They don't. They do as they are told, go to places they don't want to go to, and hope to bring peace and understanding there...and we do. No, we don't always achieve what we wanted, but we have gone a long way to do so. No-one joins up hoping to go to war, we just accept that we pledged an oath to do so if needed.

I don't think anyone is saying soldiers glorify war - they generally don't. But the government tends to.

That is a total cop out. Why don't we stop contributing to food banks while we are at it?

Hell keeping it classy there I see "I dare you to say it to my face" ......nice .

Respect who you want, but in mine and many others opinions, you're not respecting the armed forces by wearing a white poppy.

But the poppy isn't about the government it's about the soldiers that's the whole point.

If you want to make a political statement about war then fine, but why do you have to high jack something that has been so poignant for so many years?

Nicki, lots of people agree with your stance, and then there are lots of us who take a completely difference view.
It's called living in a democracy. People are allowed to have and express different views.

Hell pride in what? Pride that your need to make a political statement is greater than the need to be part of a national mark of respect for people who died for your freedom?

Yes, but you're lording your sanctimonious and horribly ill informed opinion of folk who wear a white poppy about on the Internet, it just amuses me how unlikely it is you'd say anything to someone a) not wearing a poppy, or b) someone wearing a white poppy.

I donate money to causes, my conscious is clean and full of peace

Well said Nicki - in fact if that is the argument of the hour well why do we have any charities? Why isn't the democratically elected Government not paying for everything we need? In fact, why does the Peace Pledge Union need money to 'educate' more people about what it does? Why does it need to fundraise?

I wear my poppy for 2 reasons.

1. To remember all those who gave their life.
2. To help raise the funds needed to support serving and ex serving soldiers and their families.

I see first hand where the money goes and how it is used to help, support and rebuild peoples lives. I also see the work RBL does with the MOD & the government in relation to better support for soldiers and their families.

Wearing a red poppy is always a choice however I find those that choose to wear a white one usually have little knowledge of what the RBL does or why the money raised is so desperately needed.

How do you know I wouldn't say anything? If it came up in conversation then I'd challenge the views of a white poppy wearer.

Luckily I'm not quite so uncouth as to barge up to someone in the street and start ranting and raving.

Thanks eve, I will look those threads up.

fluffy, I did say that I still donate to the Legion - I'm not withholding money from them.

I don't have a problem with people who choose not to wear a poppy, I have a problem with people who high jack a national symbol of rememberence to flaunt their own political agenda.

Well fluffy that sums it up doesn't it. You have the problem with other people's political choices, and how they choose to present those,- so that's your problem not theirs.
i personally would never support the RBL or wear a red poppy, but have no problem with people who do.

It's hardly high jacked by white poppies. I'd direct your efforts in ensuring the poppy doesn't become a racist symbol thanks to many awful factors.

Yes it is my problem but I'm still entitled to my opinion .

The red poppy is not nor has ever been a racist symbol. It is protected heavily and anyone using it in any way other than to remember the fallen are dealt with accordingly.

My granddad won medals in WW2 and was left permanently disabled due to 100 pieces of shrapnel embedded in one arm.

I wear a red poppy in remembrance of him and others who have fought for our country.

I do not like white poppies as the money from them is not going to the RBL.

Im an army brat and I abhor the white poppy. To me it says that the wearer is sticking two fingers up at those who put their lives on the line to protect the freedom that the wearer enjoys. I find that idea offensive.

Nobody wants war but unfortunately there are people in society who would take advantage of that and someone has to say no.

I find it difficult to understand the logic behind wearing both as to me they are saying totally opposite things.

I will wear my red poppy with pride and admiration as I pay my respects to all the souls who have lost their lives in pursuit of peace.

Charity. I have a big problem with basic stuff that people need to live decent lives being provided by charity. Be that poppies or Children in need or anything. It kind of implies that the recipient should somehow be grateful. I don't think, as a veteran, you should be grateful for getting comfortable fake legs or a manoeuvrable wheelchair, that is the least that the state should be providing you with.

I don't wear a poppy. I was brought up to believe all wars were basically a con perpetrated by evil old men. I think there's some truth in that.

Tink in an ideal world the government would provide for the soldiers hell in an ideal world there would be no war. However this is not an ideal world and without charity those in need would remain so.

I wear a red poppy to honour those who gave so much.

They are red for a reason. A white poppy is meaningless and I think less of people who wear them on Remembrance Day.

Am I the only person who has never heard of white (or purple?) poppies?

I wear a red poppy, for me it is a symbol of rememberance and respect for the thousands of innocent people, -and yes, innocent means soldiers and civillians alike- who lost their lives and their loved ones to war.

I don't wear a poppy. I was brought up to believe all wars were basically a con perpetrated by evil old men. I think there's some truth in that.

The poppy DOES NOT REPRESENT WAR! It represents the lives lost. Yu were brought up with in correct information.