AIBU to feel so terrible over this sudden lack of response?

[EmeraldPeepers]

I'll try to keep the background as short as possible.

The first few months at my current job were not easy. My direct supervisor was awful, the training was rubbish and I basically used to dread going to work. The good work that I was doing was being overlooked and I was being blamed for things I hadn't had anything to do with. Safe to say it was one of the most horrible phases of my life.

And then something amazing happened. One of my superiors from the head office (most of my tasks in the job involved working for him remotely) told me he loved my work. He went out of his way to call my direct supervisors and tell them how well I was doing- note that this was his call, I didn't ask him to do it. Given his position within the company, people suddenly sat up to take notice of my work and the bullying started to gradually stop. I sometimes feel that I may not have been able to stay in this job had he not stepped in and clarified the quality of the work that I was doing. Needless to say, I am incredibly grateful to him.


Our work relationship has been amazing. He's notoriously hard to please, but it's been such a good experience working with him. He's been happy to share his knowledge, he's encouraged my work and we also reached a comfortable stage were would chat about things outside of work.


Unfortunately, I was moved to a new product and I no longer get to work with him much. He did mention to me once that he is not very happy with the person who is handling his work instead of me now. Given my relative experience in the earlier product, i still step in from time to time to help out. Initially, he was responsive and even happy on the occasions where I would step back in. However, there have been two recent occasions where much to my confusion, he has ignored my communication when I stepped back in. The new person forgot to let him know something important and I noticed it in the system. So I just sent a message to say- hi, here is what has happened. Noticed it and thought to let you know.

I have sent similar messages in the past and he has responded and has been appreciative and thanked me for still keeping a check. But on these past two occasions he completely ignored me :( No response. Absolutely nothing.

I had also sent him a message to ask a work related question he might have had the answer to. He completely ignored that as well. I found this strange and out of character because he has always been so happy to share his knowledge in the past.


Am I overreacting?? I feel terrible that he has ignored me because even though I am not on that product anymore, I still value this professional relationship a great deal. Besides I might at some point come back to the earlier product, so keeping my contacts and relationships alive is also very important for me.

I am struggling to see what I might have done unknowingly perhaps to upset him or annoy him to the point where he would behave so out of character and ignore me

I know it sounds odd to take this so seriously, but his support gave me a sense of security within a work environment that can be quite hostile at times. I am not in a position to switch jobs at the moment, so losing that support is making me feel rather lost.

[chopinbabe]

'end things on a pleasant note' : what would that involve: would it involve meeting or writing him to say that and to offer suggestions as to how it could be achieved?

That is tempting, especially if he were to respond by saying ' Of course, I don't want to end things', which I think you might be hoping for.

However, do you think he would say that or would he be taken aback by a phrase which is usually applied to romantic relationships or, at a push, if one were leaving a company.

How would you feel if he showed how taken aback he was and asked you to stop being silly or said he had no idea what you were talking about, that he barely thought about you any more, that he was now more concerned with Anna's progress. What if he suggested that you should think about leaving or even suspected that you had personal feelings for him?

How would you feel if he told others about what you had said and they cruelly laughed?

Please do think about all the awful responses that could be made if you approach this with him.

Anyway, things haven't ended, they have evolved.

[EmeraldPeepers]

chopinbabe

Don't you think you are overreacting? Where did I say I was going to have a meeting with him and write to him and offer suggestions about "our relationship"?

And do you really think I am so stupid that I would do something like that?

This is like the other person who thought I was going to send him an angry message on Monday and ask why he was "ignoring me".

FFS.

[DownByTheRiverside]

What's the point of this thread?

AIBU
Yes you are
No I'm not
FFS

If you know you are not being unreasonable, then why are you asking?

[LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726]

Emerald... Funny. Did you PM several of us for advice?

I suspect that you did. I also suspect that it's been very consistent. Everybody is rooting for you to do the right thing and protect yourself from doing something foolish.

[EmeraldPeepers]

This should have been obvious but what I meant when I said I would have liked to end things on a pleasant note is that I wish the last communication between us hadn't left things with such a huge question mark where I don't know if I offended him or if he was just busy and a bit irritated.

[EmeraldPeepers]

Emerald... Funny. Did you PM several of us for advice?

I'm very glad you think it's funny. You sound like a lovely person who never betrays a confidence.

[EmberElftree]

Oh dear, Emerald.

Is it just me who hears the Frozen song right now?

[LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726]

I don't Emerald, not ever. I've given no details in my post.

You're studiously ignoring what people are saying because you don't want to hear it. I understand that, but it's not going to serve you well because you can't see that what you're doing is going to cause you major upset at work.

[DownByTheRiverside]

Emerald, you are communicating with complete strangers on the internet. You have no idea who we are, or if we are capable of not betraying confidences.

[CinnabarRed]

Out of interest, how many people are there in your firm?

And, of those, how many are more junior than 'Paul'? I don't mean his direct reports, I mean more junior in the widest sense, in the way that you are junior to him.

And, how many people are less senior than 'Paul' but as senior or more so than you? That is, just as entitled to hope for a business relationship with 'Paul' as you are? ('Anna', as an aside is far more entitled to expect a business relationship with 'Paul' because she actually works for him.)

Can you see, purely on numbers, why 'Paul' simply can't maintain a business relationship with all of you, particularly not on a daily or weekly basis.

[chopinbabe]

No, you didn't say you were going to meet or write to him but I wondered how you hoped to achieve: 'for us to end things on a pleasant note.'

Something about your wording suggested that you might take steps to achieve that. However, you are only wishing and are not going to take steps so I mis read and I am relieved that I did.

In that case, I wouldn't contact him again because in doing so it is possible that you are ignoring his hints to back off and he may feel he has no option but to tell you to do in no uncertain terms or, even worse, ask your boss to tell you.

As things stand, there has been no big drama, he simply doesn't want as much contact with you for any of the reasons that PP's have given. You haven't lost face but if you continue tugging on his jacket for attention, then you risk doing so.

[Ilovenicesoap]

I think you are applying emotion to the working relationship you had with him- its clear that you now no longer need to communicate with him, nor him you but you are persisting with it.

It was a working relationship, no more, no less- you are being inappropriate in still contacting him and undermining your direct manager.
I would concentrate on my own work, stop "noticing things" and using them as an excuse to contact him.
Im confused because on one hand you say you are still training this new person but describe moving into a completely new area

If it is your responsibility to train and supervise the new person then follow the correct protocols when something doesn't go right - speak to the person involved, then go to their manager when it occurs again.
If you are responsible for training the new person it will reflect badly on you if you don't highlight issues correctly and it is unfair not to allow the new person to improve their performance.

[gobbynorthernbird]

Just ask him for a shag and stop being so bloody angsty.

[EmeraldPeepers]

Im confused because on one hand you say you are still training this new person but describe moving into a completely new area

It isn't confusing at all actually, because I did mention that all the products are related. I haven't even moved teams. Just moved products. Same team, same systems, same boss, same role- just a different product.

[PomeralLights]

This has all got a bit overblown by some other posters IMHO.

Emerald obviously feels a bit personally invested - I joined a team in one of my first office jobs where I was horrendously bullied by some ladies I peivately nicknamed 'the three witches'. Someone really senior noticed my good work when I sent something directly to him and gave me unprompted feedback - the rush of gratitude I felt at someone helping & recognising me in my loneliness went a bit beyond the normal 'it's only work' emotions. So I feel I can emphasise in some way with the OP.

The only thing I can say to you Emerald is that he probably doesn't feel the work relationship has 'ended'. This guy is a lot more senior than you - per my previous post he's not always going to feel that an express 'thank you' is required. This has become more the kind of dynamic where he doesn't speak to you for two years and then one day you get promoted to a different team working for another board member he's friendly with and your new boss says 'we're glad to have you on the team, Paul speaks very highly of the work you did for him as a new joiner and your keen attitude'. Well, that's what happened to me, so it might not turn out exactly like that :) but what I'm trying to say is that non-responses don't mean the end of him thinking well of you or positively speaking of you. You just won't be aware of it on a regular basis anymore.

Hope that helps, I know how weirdly vulnerable it is being picked on when new and can totally understand where all this emotion came from.

[EmeraldPeepers]

I don't Emerald, not ever. I've given no details in my post.

Right, but announcing that I might have contacted someone via PM, assuming that I contacted everyone and then making fun of that is OK is it?

[CinnabarRed]

I'm sure this isn't exactly your scenario, but does it have parallels with your situation (I'm trying to get the context right to make sure I understand).

Suppose you work for a firm that makes pet food - and there are 4 divisions - let's say dog food, cat food, fish food and hamster food.

Paul is the managing director of the dog food division (in my analogy).

You are in, say, the finance team. You used to be responsible for delivering the monthly sales figures for the dog food division; you are now doing the same role but for the cat food division. Anna has taken over the monthly sales reporting for dog food. Both you and Anna are in the finance team, with the financial controller as your (shouty) supervisor.

Is that broadly right?

If so, then Paul will have more than enough on his hands with his own direct and indirect reports, I'm sorry to say.

[EmeraldPeepers]

Cinnabar- deliberately not responding to your posts. I cannot explain the hierarchy and structure any further than I have without revealing the sector and company I work for and I don't care to do that. I'm sure you will understand why I don't want to risk being identified.

But yes, I understand why you think he has enough on his plate and he doesn't have the time or energy to mentor more people than is required.

I cannot help how I feel- I feel confused at being ignored and more so because based on my past interactions with him,the behaviour is very out of character.

[drudgetrudy]

I do understand how you got here Emerald. Your situation at work before he valued your work was horrible.
However the tone of your posts now does sound as if you have got things really out of proportion.
I ask you again-is your life outside work fulfilling?

[EmeraldPeepers]

No, it isn't.

[MrsJossNaylor]

Emerald - the level of emotion in your responses is quite concerning. Your way of taking things very personally and using overblown language such as "nasty" or "stupid" suggests a real childishness - the sort of childishness that I suspect would have made Paul run a mile had he got a whiff of it in your emails.

As others have said, you come across as very needy. I sympathise with Paul, tbh, and think he would be flabbergasted if he could see this thread.

I have a busy, stressful job and am fairly high up. At times I'll deal with junior colleagues from other teams and get on with them well, but when a particular piece of work ends I move on. I'm too busy with work - and family, and friends, and gym, and everything else - to do otherwise.

If a junior member of staff then tried to keep up the relationship for no apparent reason, while I was up to my eyes in work stuff, it would really irk me tbh. I haven't got the time to thank people for every email, or indulge in pointless chit chat at work. I don't think that's mean - just professional.

Don't say anything to Paul. Just let it go. Drop it, move on, become more friendly with colleagues you work with daily. Or don't - focus on friends out of work instead.

Be polite and helpful to Anna in her training and FFS don't go reporting on her to Paul again.

I hope it's also not too patronising to suggest that you start focusing on something else - running? Reading? - as you have far, far too much emotional investment in this.

[LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726]

As you have said it is possible that you may work together again more closely in the future

That's from another poster's post. I don't recall you saying this anywhere on the thread.

There's nothing wrong with you PM'ing whomever you want, I thought it was amusing that you have had such consistent advice on the thread that you've seemingly PM'd several others for the same thing. It was meant to be tongue in cheek, not a jibe at you so please don't take it to heart, Emerald.

[Kewcumber]

I've spent decades at a senior (board level) position in companies. And have been responsible for training and mentoring many staff.

Ignore everything else everyone has said and re-read your own posts.

They read like a girl who likes a boy who is ignoring her. Your emails to point out the time sensitive thing sound like ways to elicit his attention and provoke a response.

Of course you don't intend it that way but if we all read it that way then he probably does too and is therefore backing off to discourage you before (in his mind) your contact veers into totally inappropriate territory. Or it could just be what someone else said - he was away from his desk, on holiday in a meeting and the email just wasn't important enough to respond to in the context of everything else he was dealing with.

The more important thing you appear to be missing is that putting up with your replacement obviously not doing things she should. Putting up with it and sorting it out yourself is not doing her or you or your department any favours. Presumably Mr Uber-boss knows how he is supposed to be informed of this time-critical thing and if he found out from you, in his position I would be contacting the department head and complaining. What happens if you leave, move, are on holiday, ill.

What you should be doing is saying to the person - "X is time sensitive and you haven't done it, you need to do it straightaway", then check it's been done in an hour and if it hasn't you go back and say "this still hasn't been done, please do it now" if it still isn;t done then you go to your boss and say I've asked X twice to do this - would you like me to do it now rather than miss the deadline or would you like to talk to her.

"Saving" people from their own incompetence is a big mistake, they need to either learn or leave. Swooping to the rescue is a but school girlish and runs the risk of making you look unable to train or manage people well.

And stop over analysing how your ex-boss responds to the emails that you shouldn;t have sent him - concentrate on yours own actions.

[EmeraldPeepers]

FFS don't go reporting on her to Paul again.

I object to the 'again'. I never told on her in the first place.

Please also understand that the way I post on mumsnet (especially when I am a bit upset and overwrought) is not indicative of how I send emails at work or how I interact with anyone in the office. I do realise it is a professional environment and at no point have I sent any email to Paul which was unprofessional or inappropriately put.

[CinnabarRed]

No worries, Emerald - completely understand why you don't want to post actual detail. It's hard to advise out of context so I was hoping to draw an analogy - I certainly wasn't fishing for RL information.

One final thought, and then I'll leVe you in peace. Have you ever watched a toddler desperately trying to master a new skill? And you know how frustrating it is because you know you could do it straight off and make the child happy? Except it wouldn't - it would make the toddler scream and mean he hadn't mastered the skill next time he wants to do it. Anna is the toddler here - she has to learn by her own mistakes.