To be a bit dismayed if 4 million women visit this site,why are there so few posts on the feminism threads?

[Scarletohello]

Ok so I know there are lots of lurkers but if there are really millions of women who go on MN, why are so many threads on the feminism section consisting of so few women? It doesn't make sense to me as so many issues that
women post about on many different topics are actually feminist issues when it comes down to it...

Fwr is great. There's a lot of misunderstanding I think about feminism and I don't think that this benefits women generally. I think some of the things are hard to understand because they go against what we are used to thinking.

Also I think it is unfair that one person posts something that doesn't agree with you so therefore all posters are nasty, unfair, unreasonable, too intellectual, whatever. Much like anywhere else, there aren't a group of nasty feminists waiting to pounce on what people say with the party line, it's a group of individuals talking about what they want to. I see lots of posters who patiently spend a lot of time dispelling rape myths for example to posters who are obviously pushing buttons to get a reaction.

My dh experienced the negative aspects of sexism for the first time a couple of months ago (childcare is mum's domain type one) and he was so angry! He couldn't understand it and it seemed so arbitrary and unfair. Imagine if women got angry after every incident of sexism - we'd never get anything done :)

Because I come on here either to ask a question which isn't generally about feminism, or to find something funny to pass the time ... again, not usually much humour to be found in that section.

Basically, I agree with all the reasons everyone else has stated.

I consider myself as a feminist. I just don't feel the need to shout about it.

I may be shot down in flames for this, but some of the posts on those threads merely appear to conform to the stereotype of the intellectual, rampant, breast beating feminist. And I just can't identify with them.

Either I have been to brainwashed by a misogynist society or I am missing the point entirely on some of the threads.

HandbagCrab

I want to agree with you, but during all those site issue threads about FWR it came out that there were FB calls to go to particular threads to deal with something. Now, possibly other FB groups do this in other areas, but I've never seen that bubbled.

Also, there was a time when anyone posting an alternative view (no matter how mild) would, invariably it seemed, be decried for being an MRA troll, only concerned for the Menz etc. So of course many ordinary MNetters decided it was not for them and hid the section. And those people won't see how FWR evolves.

I read the feminist section a lot more than I post in it because, although I am a staunch feminist, i don't feel confident enough in some of the discussions. I like to read the posts of the people I respect and it's taught me a heck of a lot about how to deal with the 'I am a feminist but..' Or 'what about the menz' but I still feel like there are other people here who are much better at responding to those kinds of things.

Maybe I will try to post more. I spent lots of time arguing with someone on a guardian article about the New York harassment video last night.

I thought this thread was interesting due to the debate it stimulated. I thought the follow up TAAT was in poor taste and patronising.

If the OP really cared about increasing volume to boards like FWR, perhaps she should consider how 'welcoming' some FWR posters can be and how newbies would feel reading that TAAT she posted.

I think there's a difference between identifying as a 'feminist' and a 'Feminist'. A feminist lives their life with the view that they are equal to men and society should represent that. A Feminist, I think, is defined by their feminism above all else.

I took lectures with Jean Duncombe in my undergraduate degree. I had to write an essay on domestic violence. She was practically frothing when my essay focused on women perpetrated domestic violence against men. I felt it was an area that was underrepresented in dv discourse and still do. I felt, as an individual that it was my right to cover whatever the hell I liked as long as it fit the brief.

Essentially, my bottom line is that Feminists tell us that for centuries men have been telling women what to think, say and do. Well I'll be damned if I now let another bunch of women tell me what to think, say and do. Surely the aim should be that women are free to think, say and do whatever they want to.

Well said lougle

I don't post on there because ...

1. I like men and flame me but there always seems to be a man hating undercurrent (to me)
2. I would end up posting something very rude to some of the claptrap that is posted in there
3. because I have DDs and they are doing pretty damn well in life without me ever having to endlessly teach them how to be their own woman - they are strong and independent all on their own. I have helped them be like this by example and by not necessarily banging on about it.
4. because at times I have watched porn with my DP (and past bf's) and enjoyed it and anyone who thinks that porn should be banned is deluded. Look at medieval pictures or wall etchings from centuries ago, there was porn then.

That's it basically

I don't read the feminist boards because I'm too busy being an engineer to talk endlessly about the unfairness of life as a sociologist. Can I have a blindfold when they tie me to a stake and machine gun me?

Succinctly put lougle. I hid the topic a while ago. Couldn't be bothered with offering my point of view - often the wrong point of view, apparently - and then having patronising posts directed at me by vehement posters.

"To be a bit dismayed if 4 million women visit this site, why are there so few posts on the feminism threads?"

Why so few in Politics, or In The News, The Science Club or Wine? (to name but some)

People don't use the topics that much. I agree that's a pity.

I don't see one topic as more equal than others.

I find FWR useful to become more aware of societal and world-wide structures that continue to mean that woman earn less, have less rights, are far more likely to be seriously hurt or killed by their partner/ex than by anybody else, have far less self-determination etc etc than just because of my own little precious life tbh.

There is a bigger picture here and it is not good enough to say 'well, I am not affected by the patriarchy'. a. it's probably not true and b. many, many women are.

I have 4 boys, I work in a previously v male dominated profession (this has changed!), DH does his fair share in housework/child care/etc.
And still DS2(10) came out with "I am going to get married so my wife can do all the house work because women are better at that"
So, there remains work to be done. Even in my little life

Wrt there being no sense of humour and fun on FWR - that's not my experience.

I get rather bored with the whole trans* debate, not because I don't think it's not an issue, but it's not the Most Pressing Issue affecting women all over the world. I stay out of it or read and stare and rubberneck.

I am following both of these discussions with interest. I like lougie's distinction between a feminist and a Feminist. I have always wondered why Feminists are not more concerned that feminist and non-feminist women are so switched off to the whole movement, so this thread has been enlightening.

One thing I am wondering about is the different definitions of what Feminism is about. In this thread, I have seen several posters argue that it is about equality with men in all aspects of life. But in FWR, the thrust is generally that it is about liberation of women from male violence. Have we just not got round yet to discussing that aspect in this thread? Or have I just missed it?

scarevola I don't know anything about fb groups. I see fb groups being referred to in different topics of mn (I read far more than I post) so I don't know if it is just a fwr thing.

I think so much of feminism cuts through our choices and decisions that most women have to make that it's hard not to be defensive. I can say I choose to earn less than dh because I have decided to be part time and put effort into my family and my studies. And I have. But that choice wasn't made in a vacuum and I didn't have the choice that dh did after we had a child (to continue going up the career ladder) so it wasn't a level playing field and he simply took one route and I took the other.

I just realised, another reason why I don't post very much is because I get so annoyed and upset by the amount of people who misunderstand feminism or who deliberately post to rile up feminists. Not to mention the complete inability of some to understand that feminism isn't about hating all men.

I think it's really sad that the TAAT has made this thread even more forceful in expression than it might already have been. I think it's made for a very vehement backlash almost against feminism and that is very sad

I consider myself a feminist. I hope I've brought my DC up to be feminists. Do I positively identify myself first and foremost as a feminist...no because to me that is counterproductive. Feminism should exist throughout your life not as a compartmentalised identity

The board groups discussion for people who are particularly interested obsessed which is useful but doesn't mean that not frequenting it means you are less of a feminist

I don't frequent several boards. Doesn't mean that I haven't knowledge or experience in that area.

I'm so disappointed in the OP. If a troll wanted to come into MN and damage FWR they might follow her example

But that's YOU MyEmpire and not everyone. I just sometimes think men can't do right for doing wrong. Just my personal opinion. Man hating is probably too strong a term, I didn't word it right.

Long time poster (8 yrs?), albeit male, and these threads/obs come up every two-three years, don't they? And they appear to go in exactly the same way, with evidences of various 'unwelcoming' habits and attitudes (like being v heavily patronised) followed by a bit of 'regulars' defensiveness, or their total absence.
I read a lot, or even most, of FWR and it isn't a surprise that place is so relatively quite. It's not dissimilar to the days of dittany where a sense of personal/small group 'ownership' developed, which pissed off a lot of other people.

I think so much of feminism cuts through our choices and decisions that most women have to make that it's hard not to be defensive. I can say I choose to earn less than dh because I have decided to be part time and put effort into my family and my studies. And I have. But that choice wasn't made in a vacuum and I didn't have the choice that dh did after we had a child (to continue going up the career ladder) so it wasn't a level playing field and he simply took one route and I took the other.

Yy to that.
To me feminism has helped me to actually see that some of my 'choices' were not entirely (or not at all) free choices.

And as stated before, I love the men in my family, am really fond of many of my friends and am actually of the opinion that the patriarchy can be rather damaging to men as well.

Ah, but Pan, dittany was unique
I was so sorry to see her go - not because I agrees or even understood everything she said, but oh my, what perspective she gave me!

agreed