Holiday fines?

[frozen1234]

Hi.

Im after some advice.

We have been on holiday and took our son in september. We paid the fine.

We have another holiday in march and wondered what the process is? Would we get another fine or do they take you to court for the second time you do it. Out of curiosity can you keep having hols each year and paying the fine? Or will they eventually take you to court?

Thanks for any answers on the above questions..

TeenAndTween

A holiday is a holiday, regardless of where it is. To be honest, for many children in a class - a child boasting of a week playing on a beach is just as much "boasting" as a fortnight at Disney. The latter may be a once in a lifetime trip, saved up for many years at the detriment of other years' holidays for example.

I just don't think in 5+ years time we will all be seeing massively improved literacy and numeracy across the whole population do you?

Mine is year 1 and we already had a few weeks off with sickness, one holiday a few days missed here and there due to weddings and funerals.

One of top readers in class, if not no2.

Someone up thread mentioned that if you send to state school you can't pick and choose which bits ie attendance, uniform etc.

So why no fines for "incorrect uniform" or "no homework". Because we appreciate that families have issues that go beyond school and that a bit of flexibility is needed.
Same for time off in term time. There are many non exceptional ( by a given limited criteria) reasons for taking time off.

Some issues are school rules that are optional or locally applied so there is no criminal record or fine attached to them

There are sanctions, though - being taught in isolation, excluded from extracurricular events, detentions and so forth. A DC who repeatedly and deliberately ignores school rules for no exceptional reasons is likely to lose their school place eventually and the law permits the school to exclude them.

People are being ridiculous about this issue. Parents should be able to take their kids anywhere they want whenever they want. Children do not belong to the state. As long as the child's education needs are being met, that is a child welfare issue

We don't live in the UK (thank goodness), but we will take our children off school whenever we like, whether it be for 2 weeks to visit family in the States, or a week back in the UK to practice English, or a week cycling in the mountains

It is up to us because we have the responsibility of having children. Schools are prisons for children more than anything else.

We send our children to schools so that they can mix with lots of children their own age and take part in society, but most education goes on at home, a lot of studies back that up. i.e. it is the education level and engagement of parents that is the biggest factor in a child's education success, not how many hours they spend at school!

And following every rule creates sheeple. I hope we are bringing our children up to be confident individuals who do things because they feel it is the right thing to do, not because an authority told them to do it.

Schools are prisons for children more than anything else

Oh dear, oh dear ....

Just to say these laws aren't made for what I imagine is most of mn community however makes a big difference to those who live in areas of depravation and don't value school. It is for those children who have a difficult start in life whose parents need encouragement to actually send their children to school and give them the opportunity to succeed...

if that is what they achieved icklekid I would be right behind it but they don't. as far as I can tell from all the articles and research I have read, the children you are referring to, who often have less than 80% attendance, has not changed. the number of school days lost has gone down but this is because the MN community parents to which you refer, have stopped taking their kids out of school on holiday. this law makes nil to no difference to the underlying problem and actually if you read the report that started this all off, it was never really meant to. this is about creating an illusion that something is being done when it isn't.

Those in areas of deprivation do not go on holidays abroad either.

dog no they don't go on holiday they just don't go to school!!!

mummy meister all I can comment on is what i see at my school which doesn't have many foreign holiday taking parents. It is having impact. The attendance has gone from nearly failing an ofsted (on purely attendance even with teaching excellent etc) to allowing us to get an outstanding grading. I haven't seen research for across the country tgough.

I'm in Australia and if we take holidays in term time, you go to the office and fill out an exemption form so that you don't get marked absent!

The kids are usually told to do their home reader and write a journal of what they've done each day on their holiday and then hand it in to the teacher when they return.

My dd is in second grade and she currently has TWO friends off on FIVE WEEK HOLIDAYS. One is on a driving holiday along the east coast of Australia, the other has gone to the mother's birth country to visit relatives. Both were told by their teachers how lucky they were to be having such amazing experiences and to send the class postcards.
Another friend is about to head off to Fiji for 3 weeks, also visiting family.
One of these friends has taken the same amount of time off the previous two years and she still received one of the top academic awards for the grade at the end of year presentation. Both years.

We've never taken our kids out of school for holidays, but so many families do it every week.

And education certainly does not collapse

Not sure primary age children missing a few days of school a year is really going to disrupt the whole class.

In UK i see a different problem so many people see school as some sort of free daycare that the state is obliged to provide. Shortest holidays, very early starts, and oh the outrage if teachers have training days or a strike.

VERY well said, Rufus

Entitlement culture again, you see ...

Mine is year 1 and we already had a few weeks off with sickness, one holiday a few days missed here and there due to weddings and funerals. One of top readers in class, if not no2.

That kind of anecdotal evidence is on a par with someone saying, "I've smoked 40 a day for 60 years and never had cancer". It doesn't prove anything. Indeed, it doesn't even prove that there has been no adverse effect on your child. There is no way of telling how your child would be doing if there had been no absence.

Not sure primary age children missing a few days of school a year is really going to disrupt the whole class.

There are 30 children in a class. Imagine each of them has 5 days off school in term time each year. That would mean that pretty much all the time there would be at least one child catching up on stuff that was covered while they were away. Many teachers hate the disruption caused by children taking term time holidays, although many won't admit it to parents.

as far as I can tell from all the articles and research I have read, the children you are referring to, who often have less than 80% attendance, has not changed

The change in policy came into effect last year. We don't yet have a full year's statistics. However, we do have statistics for the Autumn and Spring terms. These show that, compared with the previous year, overall absence fell from 5.3% to 4.4%. The percentage of pupils classed as persistent absentees fell from 4.9% to 4.1%. The most common cause of absence is illness (or alleged illness). This fell significantly. There has been a dramatic decrease in authorised family holidays and an increase in unauthorised holidays. Overall there has been a 25% reduction in the proportion of sessions missed due to family holidays. The absence rate for children entitled to FSM remains higher than the absence rate for non-FSM pupils. However, both overall absence rate and persistent absences for FSM pupils have fallen and the gap with non-FSM pupils has narrowed.

It is, of course, possible these improvements will not be sustained. But the statistics currently available suggest that the tightening up of policy has had the desired effect.

Can I ask why people keep saying teachers hate term time holidays and think it is bad?

Amongst all of my teacher friends (and I know a lot) most are not opposed at all, and do not find it detrimental.

This is not the survey I was looking for, but it more or less makes the same points.

www.itv.com/news/story/2014-02-24/family-holiday-price-parliament-debate/

There are other surveys which make the same point.

I'm on my phone now. I'll try and find the other survey later.

prh47bridge - do you honestly think that the change in the law will lead to a measurable increase in standards? Lecherrs is right the majority of the teachers I know and the people in local Govt LEA never saw term time holidays as THE major challenge to educating children in this country. Just wait until the Government sees how much money it is in losing in tax with the effect on tourism businesses. Visit England report a drop of 15% in overnight stays outside school holidays. How will family friendly businesses make up the shortfall? By hiking the prices in school holidays of course.

I have asked it before but thought I might ask again. If you are a MNetter who had a holiday last year, put in the details of the identical holiday for this year. has it gone up? I know ours has. That's what made me search for the Visit England figures. they didn't announce those in a blaze of publicity. I wonder what this means in money terms to the treasury .

Most children of any age do very little in the last two weeks of term time so take them then and tell the schoolto get stuffed.Its ridiculous-unles the child is really behind in standard achievement two week does no harm at all.Its all another scheme to promote the headmasters to being little hitlers -they just love it

PR oodles of kids are having more than the equivalent of a week off each year and schools seem to cope.My DS being one.If you count up G&T courses,music lessons, sporting fixtures,rehearsals it adds up a lot.

DS had over a week of authorised absences on his last report- but that's ok.

I do not understand why a child having a holiday in term time a year is suddenly such an issue. It's stupid in any age group until about year 9 to suggest its a major educational issue.

By dictating to parents this way it actively encourages rule breaking. It suggests teachers can't teach. That schools cannot manage their business. That parents are mindless simpletons. It makes the whole thing appear incredibly difficult to take remotely seriously.

The saying used to be "treat people like monkeys you get peanuts". Seems to me this situation proves it.

I for one would back any education minister that removed it.

Mummymeister. Yes. £800 first two weeks sept eurocamp/France.

£2.5k in August.

For a fucking caravan!

Most children of any age do very little in the last two weeks of term time so take them then and tell the school to get stuffed

Bingo

It was only a matter of time ...

Boomtownsurprise. yep. if a lot of people can bother to check they will find a huge hike in prices next year. even more than last. still its all worth it - our kids are suddenly going to soar academically because we cant take them out of school!!!