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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to ask - if your DC go to a church school, then -

148 replies

nomdemere · 29/09/2014 09:17

  • if entry was based on church attendance, then how does your vicar know how often you go?

I'm not sure my vicar actually knows who I am, let alone notices me in the congregation every time.

Our CofE secondary has a points system based on frequency of attendance (monthly, fortnightly, 'most weeks', 'every week'). The vicar has to countersign I just can't see how our vicar will know which category I am in. He's not there every week himself!

How does it work where you are? I feel slightly embarrassed about actually asking him, it will sound rather pushy.

OP posts:
JumpJockey · 29/09/2014 17:43

DD1 is at a school attached to our church, the only faith criterion is that your child has to have been baptised, there's no time rule on when. Then it's on distance. Surrounded by CofE schools with the standard 'how often do you go?' style SIF applications. Several friends with children in DDs class admit that they don't go to mass, but their children were baptised as babies - seems fair enough to me, they might get interested in the church again through the school.

FrazzledMiddleChild2 · 29/09/2014 17:44

wow. it's like school. Soon there'll be a roll call and the congregation will be champing at the bit to shout out "an seo".

FrazzledMiddleChild2 · 29/09/2014 17:44

"here!"

flipflopsandcottonsocks · 29/09/2014 17:45

No not directed at you Annie!

Again I agree with what you have said, it is about being opposed to discrimination.

TinklyLittleLaugh · 29/09/2014 17:49

It is nonsense though, to complain about faith schools in isolation. They are just one option. It is perfectly possible to have a decent state school system with faith options alongside. Getting rid of church schools will not automatically make state provision better.

ARGHtoAHHH · 29/09/2014 17:49

Archery speaks a lot of sense. Glad she is posting, because I wouldn't be able to put it so eloquently, and frankly I can't be arsed, so thank you archery Grin

doubleshotespresso · 29/09/2014 17:49

flipflops that is shocking.... And utterly ridiculous obviously. In the Catholic schools we have been looking at, the approach was breath-takingly refreshing compared to the bloody useless education on all things sex I received at a Convent school. I would hope and pray that is now an across the board standard now. I think the whole "sex is dirty" and taboo days are I think gone, hopefully with the nutty nuns that I remember so well.

I also was impressed with the school approach to education on other faiths and tolerance, as other posters state, in todays' world an important element.

If I felt otherwise, then would be battling to send DD elsewhere, as my main reservations on Catholic schools was the poor provision on the above. Happily though, it seems vast improvements have been made upon the rotten memories I have.

I suppose we (as our parents did) are all trying our level best to get things right, I question myself on this all the time, but the school visits We made really showed The church schools to excel in many areas, not just results. I really liked the ethos and general feel of the place, it felt a happy place to be encouraged, educated and grow.

Only time will tell if we got it right I guess.....

ArcheryAnnie · 29/09/2014 17:58

It is nonsense though, to complain about faith schools in isolation. They are just one option.

Not around here's they aren't. In the borough my DS's primary was in, four of the five secondary schools were faith schools. Three of them would not even look at anyone not of the "correct" faith, and the fourth had 50% of the places reserved for their "correct" faith.

So - lots of choice for children with parents of one particular faith, but no choice at all for most other families. Hardly fair.

ArcheryAnnie · 29/09/2014 17:58

(And thank you very much, ARGH!)

buffyp · 29/09/2014 18:25

Funny how faith schools existed for years and years with no issues but only when league tables came into existence did problems start existing. It is not faith schools that are causing the problems IMO but the ridiculous assumptions that league tables and ofsted reports are all that matters. If everybody had to send their child to their local school then just maybe there would be more investment and improvement in standards in ALL schools. Incidentally to all those who want church schools banned please tell me where local councils are going to find money to buy all land owned by the church where a lot of c of e schools sit on. I notice this is a question which always gets ignored on these threads.

TinklyLittleLaugh · 29/09/2014 18:29

But just one non faith school in a borough is hardly the norm is it? There are nineteen secondaries in our borough, five are faith schools. I don't think anyone's choice is overly affected.

ArcheryAnnie · 29/09/2014 18:44

Well, my choice and the choice of thousands of other parents is severely curtailed, Tinkly.

If you say my borough isn't representative, I doubt your borough is, either. This clearly isn't a problem for you, but you do seem awfully determined to establish it isn't a problem for anyone else, either. It really is.

DarkBlueEyes · 29/09/2014 18:46

Make no mistake, the vicar will know. But it wouldn't hurt to shake his hand after each service and smile sweetly at him. Wink

ArcheryAnnie · 29/09/2014 18:49

Ok, just looked it up. Around a third of state schools are tied to one particular faith - mostly Catholic or CofE, though there are other faiths which have state schools, too.

That's a significant advantage and choice offered to Catholic and practicing CofE families that isn't offered to other parents.

HamishBamish · 29/09/2014 19:08

I don't have a problem with people wanting their children to attend a faith school IF they actually practice that faith and that's their reasoning for attending that particular school. What annoys me is when people suddenly 'find' their faith just before their child is due to start school. It smacks of hypocrisy to me. If I were a Vicar it would really get on my nerves.

Thebodyloveschocolateandwine · 29/09/2014 19:13

Where we are all our first and middle schools in catchment are CofE

No choir here.

We brought up our kids to be tolerant and non judgmental

Struggle to equate that with any religion to be honest

ArcheryAnnie · 29/09/2014 19:14

Well, Hamish, I personally understand why parents are finding ways to get around a fundamentally unfair system, and I also think it hypocritical for faith people to be totally OK with discrimination against non- or other-faith people.

HamishBamish · 29/09/2014 19:19

It's my understanding that faith schools have to take a certain number of non-faith pupils Archery or is that not the case? To take a place in a school on the basis of having a certain faith when in fact this isn't the case is as bad as lying about living in a certain catchment area imo.

HamishBamish · 29/09/2014 19:20

Just for the record, my children don't attend a faith school...because we aren't Catholic.

ARGHtoAHHH · 29/09/2014 19:21

I think the vicars / priests are absolutely aware of what is going on. It gets bums on seats, and therefore money, and so I imagine they wouldn't be that annoyed.

I was brought up Catholic, was confirmed etc, but never truly believed. Always swore I would never "play the game" if I had children, but find myself here nonetheless. It kills me, but it's the choice of going back to the church and securing a good education for my son, or not going back and having my son going to the only non denominational school in the borough, which is frankly shite.

I hate myself for doing it but I know it's the right thing to do. Life is unfair and if I have to turn to hypocrisy then so be it. That's my choice. Or the choice I've been given.

Saying that, I've found going back to my parish quite therapeutic, it's a lovely church and I have reconnected with old friends.

Still despise the thought of licking priest ass though. Makes me cringe and I avoid it. Which brings me back to the original question, how on earth will they notice me if I'm not making myself seen?

Thebodyloveschocolateandwine · 29/09/2014 19:23

Lol there's a choir but no choice!

Thebodyloveschocolateandwine · 29/09/2014 19:26

ARGH it's disgraceful you have to but that's how it is in some places.

Make me cross.

ArcheryAnnie · 29/09/2014 19:29

Hamish, around here that isn't the case. The Catholic schools are 100% Catholic. I was saying upthread that 3 out of the 5 state secondaries in this borough are 100% Catholic, and the 4th is CofE, taking half-and-half. The CofE school is relatively new, though, so for a long time before that it was three out of 4 secondaries were 100% Catholic. So, choice for children of Catholic parents but no choice at all for those that aren't. Which is not fair or just.

ARGHtoAHHH · 29/09/2014 19:34

Same here, archery. Catholic schools 100% Catholic. If you aren't Catholic and don't attend weekly mass, you're fucked.

inabeautifulplace · 29/09/2014 19:37

"Still despise the thought of licking priest ass though."

That's on a whole different level to attending church once a week. I would write a strongly worded letter to your MP.

Amusingly, the local catholic school seems to have the most diverse intake. That's good for me. I don't think it's an ideal scenario by any means. But as suggested, these schools are subsidised by the church are they not? I like the idea that a certain % of intake should be decided on locality rather than faith.