TO THINK THAT INSTEAD OF SETTING BY ABILITY...

[icymaiden]

.. schools should set by behaviour.At least in the first instance so that all the kids who can't or won't behave , can be in a class together, so that everyone else can achieve their best.Once you have separated that lot out, then the remainder could still be set by ability

Yes, that'll work!

Have you ever though of standing for Education Secretary?

So you have one class with no role models who will all be distracted and unable to learn, where you can stick all the children with social problems who haven't been shown how to behave before they reach school age.

Once in the sink class, do you really think there would be any way these children could move out of it?

You can't seriously think that's a good idea, surely.

We could have the Butter Wouldn't Melt class.
The Snooty Snitch class.
And the Ready for Youth Offenders Class.
How marvellous.
Not forgetting, the Kids With Weirdy Parents class.

Oh dear OP. I hope you have a barrel for all the biscuits you are about to receive...

We'd also need a "children who can't stop fiddling with things in their pencil case" class.

Because the 'bad' behaviour would be normalised/ expected. Teachers are (being human) as suseptible to labelling as anyone else.
Raising expectations rather than lowering them tends to be most effective.

And how many teachers would a class of teenagers who can't/won't behave need?

And by can't do you mean SN? Ie not their fault.....

It would be a brilliant idea for art, DT and textiles.

Threatening DD2 with being stuck with the 'no hope, can't be arsed' group might improve her attitude no end.

Seriously the mixed sets they have at present do not work and even very keen pupils like DD1 have real trouble finishing anything, with the constant low level disruption.

'that lot'?
What a lovely attitude to have towards small children. Why bother allowing them in school at all, they're clearly uneducable.

Sounds as if your DD1 needs to learn to manage her distractions Elephants. A very important skill in school, and in life!

Are you thinking of the class of no hopers actually learning anything OP, or do you just want them out of the way for the sake of the perfect children?

Yes, because society would be so much better if we just gave up on a proportion of children from an early age as 'too difficult'. They can spend their days failing to learn without disrupting 'nice' children, until they leave school at 16 with no qualifications and no ability to get a job.

Might as well get them used to being the underclass after all.

I wondered what Michael Gove was doing now!

Welcome to Mumsnet Michael...

PenisesAreNotPink

Hahaha yes my top set sen daughter who struggles with behaviour should definitely be forced to fail

Have a gold star

How about a 'parents post stupid shit on the internet which they know nothing about, so don't bother wasting your time' group?

Great idea, Einstein

What do you propose is done with the ghetto kids who never got to learn anything, when they leave school, functionally illiterate?

So you write off an entire section of students at an early age, giving them the very clear message that they are the future drop outs and no hopers of the country?
Lovely idea, well done.
On the other hand what about the students who have a 'dip' in behaviour but actually learn their lesson and have started the new school year with a better attitude but an awful lot of work to catch up with? (Yes YOU DS, year 8 was a shocker) what do they do?
I am so sick of seeing children being written off because they do not conform to the A* at GCSE/University material standard by the age of 11 - children mature at different ages, a fact which many people seem unable to grasp.
And what about children with SEN?
YABU.

That wouldn't work. My DD1 would need to be in both the "children who can't stop fiddling with things in their pencil case" class and the "kids with weirdy parents" class. Unless I suppose she's in one for some subjects and the other for others?

And how do we classify "bad behaviour"? Would it be the children who were too shy to speak? the children with special needs? Or just the cheeky ones?

YABU and you SHOULD know it.

since they aren't going to learn anything in the bottom set, why waste money on teaching them at all. Just tell their parents they can't come any more and must watch videos at home!!!

to give gove his due, he is now making schools teach sixth formers english/maths to GCSE C level.

There are a load of distractions in a classroom.
Perhaps each classroom should have retractable screens to make individual cubicles.
Cubicles down - teacher teaches, discussions and group work done.
Cubicle screens up (5-10 mins) - solo work, no distractions.
This would also help the introverts who don't work as well with all this group working stuff or need a bit of peace to work/think.
I'd like this in offices too. Open plan is not great!

Oh and what about the children who are going through a bad phase due to temporary disruptions such as a death in the family or a divorce?

Shove them off to fail because they're "naughty" HOw ridiculous!

Tropical that is actually a great idea. I well remember wanting a "wall" between me and my classmates at times! I think that could work. Open plan is great for those kids who are gregarious but not so much for introverts.