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AIBU?

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Original poster

Church attendance and sport

296 replies

FrootLoopy · 15/09/2014 08:21

If you are a firm believer in attending church regularly, how do you square this up with your desire for your DC to play a sport regularly, when that sport happens to fall on a Sunday morning?

DS1 loves a particular sport (DH has passed on his passion for it) which isn't as common as others, and all the clubs around here seem to do training for it on a Sunday morning. Next school year (or perhaps even birthday if they allow mid season starts) he will be old enough to start training at the clubs. Games don't actually start until he is a few years older though.

But I run Sunday club for half the month, the DC attend it with me, both DH and I are firm Christians and do lots of extra duties at church. The church is quite central to our lives in the community.

I'm finding this difficult to square up. I know there are evensong services (CofE) but they're not the same as communion services at 10 am and we don't have them at our local church so would have to go further afield anyway, the 8 am services are just too early and too 'plain' for the DC - and for me tbh.

We used to attend a cathedral, but have moved to a local parish church when our DC were old enough to understand things, so that they could be part of a church community.

There aren't a lot of other children at church, so if mine suddenly don't attend I think the Sunday school would close, tbh.

But I really want him to play this sport, and if he doesn't start training at the same age as other children, he won't ever have the chance to progress in it.

How do others deal with this?

OP posts:
Hakluyt · 15/09/2014 18:22

Frootloopy and others- when do you think a child is old enough to make this sort of decision for themselves?

Lweji · 15/09/2014 18:22

But what does he want to do, what would he rather?

Some things are essential parts of a child's education. Such as going to school.
For some parents, a religious education or life can be as essential as school, or doing sports, or learning how to swim.

Original poster
FrootLoopy · 15/09/2014 18:23

icanmakeyouicecream - fortunately, at the moment, both.

But as I have said previously, some sort of church participation is essential. It is the nature of the participation that is up for negotiation. You clearly disagree, that is your option. That's as much as I'm going to say about that.

OP posts:
MoanerLiza · 15/09/2014 18:28

OP I think you have had an unfairly hard time. There are still an astounding number of people who criticise religion, happily blaspheme as part of everyday conversation, yet expect the church to be magically available when they need a wedding/funeral/christening because it's the thing to do. There is precious little understanding, let alone appreciation, for families like yours which help preserve the Church and the traditions of this country.

Slightly off topic, sorry.

Hakluyt · 15/09/2014 18:31

That is such a silly post, moanerlisa.

Original poster
FrootLoopy · 15/09/2014 18:34

Hakluyt - When? When he's old enough to legally vote! Wink

Seriously, probably in his mid to later teens, if he's not just being swayed by what's easiest, what's cool, what he can be bothered to do if he turns into a lazy PITA. I'm not going to require him to be front row centre every week, but some attendance, at youth groups in Fridays (which are as non religious as you can get really, they're just full of fun activities) and every month or so when they are older, perhaps for the 'family' service. Definitely for the 'special' services.

When he's old enough to be self supporting (even if subsidised by me, eg uni or college etc) he can then make his decision to stay or
leave completely with a wiser head on his shoulders and a mature enough outlook to take an honest look at his beliefs and sort through them. At the very least I would hope he would retain a respectful attitude towards the church. But I know that will only happen if he feels as though he is valued as an individual within the church. Even if he takes time out from the church at that point I would hope that at some point that he would come back on his terms, much like I did.

Some people call it indoctrination, but we do that with all of our beliefs that we hold. That is why so many children end up supporting the same political party that their parents did, why they support the same sports teams, etc. I don't really think ANYONE can say that they don't, in some way, 'indoctrinate' their child.

OP posts:
Ragwort · 15/09/2014 18:35

I entirely sympathise with you, Church life is very important to me and my DS would attend regularly with me every Sunday (DH less frequently but not at all 'anti' Church). But he too became involved in a sport that takes place on Sunday morning.

I am probably 'luckier' than you in that my DH was/is available to take him to sport on Sundays but I miss the time we spent together in Church - and like you I was very involved in the children's activities (not that there were many children in our Church Grin).

It's hard, I don't know what the answer is, we now live in an area where there is a good Church Youth Club (not at the Church I attend) which my DS is involved in as well as doing his sport. I also do other Church related activities (voluntary work etc) that don't have to be done on a Sunday. I have ended up with a job that I often have to do on a Sunday as well so I can't go to Church as often as I would like to.

For me it has been a compromise - I will be interested to see if my DS (now a teenager) attends Church by his own choice when he is older - but he loves his sport, it is good 'wholesome' activity and I am grateful for that.

Original poster
FrootLoopy · 15/09/2014 18:35

TBH Moaner - I don't think I've had that much of a hard time. Was expecting worse when I realised I had ended up on AIBU!!!

OP posts:
Hakluyt · 15/09/2014 18:37

Hang on- so you are going to insist on him going to Church until he is in his mid to late teens?? How are you going to make him go if he doesn't want to?

What if he decides at, say, 10, that he does not believe?

Ragwort · 15/09/2014 18:38

Actually MoanerLiza makes a good point - in my last Parish there were five (yes FIVE) regular attenders in the congregation - yet the village was famous for it's 12 Century Church and there was uproar in the village when it was proposed that it was no longer viable to hold weekly services Confused.

MoanerLiza · 15/09/2014 18:39

And what exactly is silly about it? I could illustrate it with dozens of examples if you like.

Original poster
FrootLoopy · 15/09/2014 18:40

Yes I will insist. What will I do? I don't know, I hope it won't come to that. But I certainly won't just be shrugging my shoulders and saying 'That's alright love, if you don't want to go that's just fine with me'.

OP posts:
Hakluyt · 15/09/2014 18:43

So even if they stop believing they still have to go to Church?

MoanerLiza · 15/09/2014 18:47

I don't believe that Creme de la Mer works, but I still keep going to the Harrods counter.

Now, admittedly, this may well be a silly post.

MoanerLiza · 15/09/2014 18:56

On a serious note, I think it is important that family members support each other in their activities. So just as I turn up to watch PFB playing in excruciatingly awful violin concerts, and the rest of the family indulge me in my love of an unmentionable-on-Mumsnet chain of restaurants, even though they all hate it, and we all traipse up the same muddy hill every Boxing Day to please the ILs, I think it is a reasonable expectation for children in Christian families to attend church if that's what their parents do, irrespective of their own beliefs. Belief and church-going are surprising unrelated anyway. Churches are full of agnostics who enjoy the social side, the fellowship, and the hymn-singing, and the feeling of being part of some great and wondrous tradition.

morethanpotatoprints · 15/09/2014 18:58

FrootLoopy

My friend has 6 children, the eldest mid thirties the youngest one is 12.
All except one of them still go to church and they do so as a family.
there have been times for all of them as individuals that their faith has been questioned and my friend like you insisted they went every week.
I think when faith is so ingrained in your being it takes a lot to make children and young people lose their faith.
I haven't read the thread, but so sorry you have had some bad responses, as I hear above.
If it was me I would look for a time that suited your ds and work with this for as long as it takes.

TinklyLittleLaugh · 15/09/2014 19:03

We have this issue at the moment, complicated by the fact that I help run the children's Sunday Club at church, and we need DS to have a decent level of church attendance to get into our High School of choice. DS(8), does really enjoy church but he is also getting a massive amount out of his sport.

We have compromised on church once a month. There are 11 kids in his 7 a side football team so they play by rotation anyway and lots of others have church commitments. I'm sure we will work it out.

As regards attendance, I tell my kids they get the choice to stop going when they go to High School. My eldest ones have been 13/14 when they stopped and have carried on going to church youth groups/cafe worship for longer. Many of their mates are from churchgoing families so it is seen as pretty natural. Now the eldest ones are 18/20 they are still happy to come at Easter, Christmas and special occasions, and say they will send their own kids.

daisychicken · 15/09/2014 19:11

OP: Could you run Sunday School twice a month and then twice a month ds goes to hockey plus if DH is home, he perhaps could go to hockey more often? I'm just wondering if it could possibly be a compromise rather than one or the other?

Hakluyt · 15/09/2014 19:15

There's a bit of a difference between a a Boxing Day walk up a hill tradition and worshipping a God you do!'t believe in because your parents do....................

Artus · 15/09/2014 19:26

I loved Sunday School as a small child. From about 8 years I stopped wanting to go and for the next ten years I was forced to go. I hated it, was disruptive and rude to the well meaning people taking the services and running the youth groups. The more resentful I became the more I questioned the beliefs of the well meaning people, whose idea of lovely family Sundays was not my idea of a good time.

I was allowed to stop at 17 when I left home, and apart from weddings and funerals have not attended a service since, and have no relligious belief at all. But my mother believes that I will spend eternity burning in hell (literally) so I guess she felt she had to try!

Original poster
FrootLoopy · 15/09/2014 19:32

Well given that they go to Christian based schools and there is an element of religious observation until they leave - whether to employment or further education, that's their lot in life I'm afraid Hakluyt. You seem to think it's incredibly harsh. I don't. I believe I'm giving them a very balanced view in life.

They get an input in what happens in their life, but in the end the final decision has to be mine until they are old enough to be wholly responsible for themselves.

OP posts:
Original poster
FrootLoopy · 15/09/2014 19:34

Sigh... and I said I wasn't going to go down the path of this discussion.....

OP posts:
owlborn · 15/09/2014 19:37

No advice on the specifics but re - kids resenting a religious upbringing when they are older - my DH's aunt converted to evangelical Christianity and married into a v large family (I think eight kids) who are all super Christian. Every Sunday the entire family goes to church and then has a massive extended curry lunch with a lot of prayer and Christian music etc. I thought I was going to burst into flame the first time I went there. But it makes them happy and very few of the kids have left that lifestyle and most of them bring their kids along now.

Bowlersarm · 15/09/2014 19:37

OP, can you delay him taking hockey to a more serious level for the time being? Give him a longer start of Sunday morning services in his life.

I'm basing that suggestion on discounting the fact you think if he doesn't start playing regularly now he won't progress I.e. I don't think that's correct.

Have you said what your DH thinks? (Sorry if I've missed it)

HelenaQC · 15/09/2014 19:53

What are you going to do, OP, if he gets to 12 and makes it clear that he does not share your beliefs, refuses to pretend to pray, would prefer not to be a hypocrite and pay lip service to things he considers nonsense and resents your insistence that he play acts once a week?

There's nothing "balanced" about "You'll go where I say you'll go, like it or lump it".

He is not a Christian just because you are.