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AIBU?

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IndyRef 7

999 replies

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 08/09/2014 09:33

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OP posts:
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8
BardarbungaBardarbing · 08/09/2014 21:35

No one has been bullied off threads, you have worn me down though weatherall!

BMW6 · 08/09/2014 21:35

There's no Police Force on that list of new jobs .........

SantanaLopez · 08/09/2014 21:36

I've changed my mind, must be mains operated.

Grin
BardarbungaBardarbing · 08/09/2014 21:37

You are relentless.

Where do you collect the propaganda from?

squoosh · 08/09/2014 21:37

There'll be no need for an actual police force, there'll be electronic police-bots.

BardarbungaBardarbing · 08/09/2014 21:38

Remind me of your real life experience.

ChelsyHandy · 08/09/2014 21:39

More ponderings. I wonder about the effect it would have on England. More competition for jobs, certainly, more pressure on housing, particularly rental property.

If Scotland didn't bounce back and became pretty much a left wing no go zone, dominated by unions, having driven out many of the entrepreneurial type and the type turned off by that sort of constant rhetoric being forced down their throats (its certainly not very nice to listen to on a daily basis), I could imagine England a few years down the line enforcing EU rules on free movement of persons. ie only to members of other member states (I assume both countries would negotiate a some sort of free customs union initially and quickly).

I've always been pretty good at financial planning, at any kind of planning in fact. Looking ahead at possible pitfalls is what I do, and its always served me well. But I do wish I'd sold up and I can imagine my husband's business going under quite quickly, as it depends on English investment. I don't think they will relocate as its not yet in profit anyway. He should have no trouble getting another job outwith Scotland, neither should I. The main issue is the property we own and how to get rid of it without losing everything that we have financially worked for all our lives. But losing that would be preferable to staying in a Scotland where we were somehow forced to retrain for some strange field when we are perfectly employable in our present fields in most other countries of the world.

weatherall · 08/09/2014 21:39

Since you mentioned Iceland m.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-20936685

Gideon and Dave would sell their grannies to get 2.5% growth.

ChelsyHandy · 08/09/2014 21:40

Its a Nicola-Sturgeon bot. Unfortunately, I doubt it has an international market or even an application outwith Scotland.

StatisticallyChallenged · 08/09/2014 21:41

lower unemployment and higher employment than rU

Unemployment rate for the UK is 6.4% according to ONS. Exactly the same as in Scotland.

Employment rate Scotland is 59.7%, UK is 73%

IrnBruTheNoo · 08/09/2014 21:41

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/mps-expenses/11079707/MPs-will-get-10-per-cent-pay-rise-expenses-watchdog-says.html

Really disgusting news to hear. And then there are people who need to use food banks to feed their families.

Why on earth should they be getting a pay increase? They can't even do their jobs properly! What an utter shambles.

SantanaLopez · 08/09/2014 21:42

There's no Police Force on that list of new jobs

Duh.

Fairer society, no crime, no illness, great weather. Haven't you read the White Paper?

deeedeee · 08/09/2014 21:42

These threads have been fun and informative at times, but I can't be bothered with them anymore.

I have never denigrated anyone for how much money they have. I've never actually told you what I earn myself! I may well be richer than the lot of you. I'm not happy being stereotyped. I understand that yes/no voters on here seem to merge into one. I hope that phenomenon doesn't echo across the country.

Anyway thanks to statistically for her even handed posts, have enjoyed debating with you. And to the rest of you voting NO, good luck regardless of the results, sorry you all feel so worried and angry. And to everyone voting YES, try to listen and research and not confirm their stereotypes.

50/50 is rubbish. I personally no hope for a narrow defeat for YES, followed by something approaching devo max with the massive political re engagement continued and a surging across the UK. I'm still voting yes, my head wouldn't let me do anything else.

Bye friends x Good luck x

weatherall · 08/09/2014 21:42

Cambio- we don't need oil for independence. It is a bonus.

IrnBruTheNoo · 08/09/2014 21:43

Why on earth are Scottish tax payers funding HS2?! Can I use the service from Glasgow or Edinburgh? No. Waste of money.

BMW6 · 08/09/2014 21:43

Or Lawyers, Solicitors and Judges.....or Shop workers, Lorry Drivers, Traffic Wardens, Vets, Road Sweepers, Park Wardens, Carpenters, Stonemasons, Publicans, Sex Workers, Glamour Models, Publishing, Lifegaurds, Nursery Schools, Social Workers or Yoga Instuctors...................

ChelsyHandy · 08/09/2014 21:44

Did you read all of that before you linked it weatherall? I scrolled won to the photo of the Magnussons, the caption which read: "The Magnussons have been left with a mortgage far larger than their original home loan".

Then I read on:

"I've been paying every month for 150 months and I owe much more than I borrowed," says IT specialist and reindeer hunter Theodor Magnusson. "I borrowed 6m Krona (£28,850) and I now owe 9.7m Krona (£46,642). And I've already paid around 5m Krona (£24,000) in these twelve-and-a-half years."

"It really makes me feel angry and sad because, you know, the country is made of people, the nation is made of people, and societies are made by people, for people. But now it seems like banks are running societies and that is horribly wrong."

In many ways Iceland is a victim of its own success. Its standards of living are still very high and in order to maintain them in a post-economic crisis world, many here have two or three jobs. Working a 60-70 hour week is not unusual.

Tax rises

Neil McMahon has been in Iceland for 38 years. He is a teacher, tour guide and translator. Even with 35 years of teaching experience, he only earns £24,000 per annum. That is not enough to afford a comfortable life in Reykjavik.

"I think for an outsider maybe just reading articles in the newspapers or watching brief coverage of Iceland on the TV, they might be fooled in thinking Icelanders have managed to extricate themselves very effectively from this crisis," Mr McMahon says.

Neil McMahon Teacher Neil McMahon says that behind the headlines many are struggling to make ends meet
"However, there are still a lot of problems, and particularly with the younger generation; people who had huge mortgages and are now trying to deal with this situation."

Polls suggest that many here are disappointed with the current coalition government which took power at the height of the crisis. And as is often the case in politics, the party which inherits the mess does not always get much credit for cleaning it up.

"We faced this large gap in the public finances, so we had to increase taxes," Iceland's Finance Minister Katrin Juliusdottir says. "We have made difficult decisions, some were good, some were not that good, but overall I think we are well on the way to becoming a very strong economy again."

The collapse of Iceland's major banks in 2008 dragged the public finances down and caused the worst economic rupture seen in Europe since WWII. The Krona fell 50% against all major currencies, unemployment, hitherto unheard of, soared to 10% and money flew out of the country at an alarming rate."

You think that sounds good?

BardarbungaBardarbing · 08/09/2014 21:44

deeedeee ! Good luck x

StatisticallyChallenged · 08/09/2014 21:44

Yup, I'm sure they'd also sell their souls for Iceland awful credit rating

www.cb.is/the-bank/government-debt-management/the-republic-of-icelands-sovereign-credit-rating/

That's a Baa3 compared to the UKs AA1.

IrnBruTheNoo · 08/09/2014 21:45

"The main issue is the property we own and how to get rid of it without losing everything that we have financially worked for all our lives"

Why do you need to lose your property though Chelsy? Have you never heard of letting out property? Think of it as an investment? It's not all as doom and gloom as you're making out.

weatherall · 08/09/2014 21:46

Statistically - this shows that the Scottish employment rate is higher than that in England.

StatisticallyChallenged · 08/09/2014 21:46

50/50 is rubbish. I personally no hope for a narrow defeat for YES, followed by something approaching devo max with the massive political re engagement continued and a surging across the UK.

I think that's probably a reasonable position to have reached Deeedeee. Mind, your vote could make that version happen though Wink. Good luck.

WildThong · 08/09/2014 21:47

Oh dear

weatherall · 08/09/2014 21:48

Irnbru- not only are we funding hs2 but it will damage the economies of Dundee and Aberdeen.

ChelsyHandy · 08/09/2014 21:49

The article also said that Iceland introduced capital controls (restriction on movement of funds out of Iceland) in response to the crisis, which are of course also banned by the EU. Its slashed spending and introduced more than 100 different taxes, and borrowed heavily from its Scandinavian neighbours.

And then it goes on to describe how savers lost their money. Iceland did of course default on its debts. It simply resolved not to pay them.

You wouldn't have thought such a small, Northerly country could have embarked on such a foolhardy spending spree of based on borrowing and hedged mortgages against rising property values just before an economic crash, would you? Its like the government stuck their fingers in their ears and went "Nah nah nah, not listening, making money is easy".

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