To think that Islam is not the greatest threat?

[superstarheartbreaker]

Islamist extremists have given the religion a bad name. I am agnostic ( not atheist) btw and yet see religion as a deluded way of controlling the masses.
There has been some terrible Islamic extremism recently such as the recent beheadinds etc but in the past Christianity was just as violent. Northern Ireland for example.

It is religion in general rather than Islam that is a threat to reason and sanity.

A lot of it is a protest against American foreign policy in the Middle East.

There are a million books on this. And if your attention span is too short for books, academic articles. Just google an International Relations course and look for something on a reading list about the Middle East.

It has flap all to do with the Middle Ages.

It has nothing to do with "them" not being civilised.

Seriously, for starters, try reading some short stories by Ahdaf Soueif. She's an easy way in.

There are also academic texts on particular areas (for example, how American foreign policy has interfered with cycles of retrenchment and modernisation, and given rise to fundamentalist religious movements).

If you care enough about this to have an opinion (and anyone who has posted has, by definition, demonstrated that they care enough to share their opinion), then you pretty much owe it to yourself and those who have to listen to you to inform yourself.

fanatic anything is scary whether that is Islamic youths, Socialist rioters, kkk members or any kind of passionate separatists.

A whole religion should not be condemned. The extremists should be.
As a scientist I believe that religion is a load of old bollocks anyway and cannot comprehend why people go to such extremes to defend their beliefs. I just don't get why people are so concerned about what happens in a mythical afterlife when it is this life they should be concerned with [ hmm] ( too fucking short to get worked up about religious scriptures). .

I think so too, but its still a good thing if as many powerful and respected leaders speak out to condemn it as possible, to cut them adrift from their reasons and excuses.

I thought it was so peaceful (I never did, in 1988 it got on my nerves when there was all the hoo ha with Salmon Rushdie).

Banner Ad at top of this page ( on phone ) "let us help you become a Muslim now" "private chat". Bloody hell - really???

Thanks the at. I will look into it. It is complicated and fascinating ( if not very disturbing).

thecat

But they are not killing many Americans out there, they are killing minority groups, Kurds, christians and so on, how are they punishing America by slaughtering these innocents?

Well, no.

We don't have a multi-trillion dollar antiterror response to Jews, or Scientologists, or Buddhists, or Christians, or Pagans. That's just silly.

The threat is from Islam, or a version of Islam.

And I think the difference in the past was that it was about politicians/religious leaders trying to tell people what to do. We don't have that now, what we have instead is individual fanatics acting against society.

I thought this site was meant to be neutral. glad I have got old app.

Think about what happened in Yugoslavia with the the "ethnic cleansing". Look at what is happening in Gaza today. The vast majority of Muslim people are peaceful, law abiding citizens. There are always nutcases of any religion.

Other religions just quietly got on with it....

You've never heard the frothing bible thumpers in the southern states of the US bellowing for the slaughter of homosexuals then?

YABU.

You would think, for example, that given the Jewish history of persecution over centuries, culminating in the holocaust, that they would want nothing more than to live peacefully with their fellow men. Israel doesn't seem to see it like that though.

Politics and/or religion - it can never end well. I'm bowing out and shuffling off to bed.

Or maybe the Jewish people are so sick of being kicked from pillar to post and walking like lambs to the slaughter into gas chambers and ghettoes that they have decided to adopt a different approach when the likes of Iran have a stated aim of obliterating them from the planet.

Just a thought.

No. "They" (ISIS) are not killing a lot of Americans. But it is a fairly standard analysis to regard American foreign policy in the Middle East as a (hugely) significant driver in the emergence of ISIS.

This is where we need policywonk. I've read a million articles over the past few weeks, outlining the background history of funding, and the internecine struggles between various (insecure) Middle East states and also intra-necine struggles, with their disaffected populations, and how that has been facilitated (or not) by American foreign policy - and how that links to the growth of ISIS ... but can I link to any of them now? No. Not a single one.

The Jason Burke book on Al Queeda is probably v, out of date now but has a good opening section on the link between political disaffection and the move towards fundamentalist religion.

I also hate all this stuff about religion being a force for evil, per se, or a throwback to pre-modernity. "Modernity", what it is; its content; its significant features , is very political issue. Who says religion is a non-modern feature? And what do people mean by "religion"? And what idiocy to come out with some blanket statement about religion being a force for evil. It's much like a fork: you can use it in a number of ways.

Umm, I remember a certain George W Bush and a Tony Blair praying together before going on a 'crusade'. Tony Blair is now in a 'peace' quartet.

Let's ponder who has historically been (and continues to be) the greatest threat. If you bother researching, you will find its not Islam. If you align yourself with what you consider to be the civilised West being what stands for good, you will be in for a major shock when you find out what the civilised West has done to the rest of the world.

bodhranbae what by creating ghettos for the Palestinians and wiping their children out once every 2/3 years and having sickos sing about no school tomorrow in Gaza, there are no children left?

Or do you mean its ok to obliterate Palestinian children because of......Iran?!

I don't believe any of these stories about so-called 'slaughter' in Iraq.

After all that nice Mr Blair told us that if we could just get rid of Saddam it would all be wonderful there.

And now he's the Middle East Peace Envoy, so it will all be good.

You know, at the heart of a lot of religions is a fundamental sense of awe and gratitude that there is life, and an attendant desire to enfold an awareness of the preciousness of this into our acts, thoughts, and living; there is a desire to awaken the vision that we our being is lived in common with all other beings; there is a desire to awaken - through ritual, through reflection, through celebration - a cherishing of this lived commonality throughout all of what is created.

Ideally, you know this without needing religion to tell you this. Ideally you live this awareness, and express it in your life.

Sadly, many of us fall short.

And many of those practising their religion don't emphasise this aspect. Religions have a lot more going on than just this.

But I don;t think you can blame religion, per se, for a lot of bloodshed.

If you want to live a post-religious life (and many of us do) I think it is quite important to have a nuanced idea of what religion "is". It is quite a lot of things: good and bad.

Sallyingforth - Exactly.

I don't think it was a good idea to get rid of Sadaam, I know he was a tyrant but Iraq was more secular and other religions were tolerated. Tony Blair is a career politician and totally insincere. I question his 'Christian' values.

Yes, nice Mr Blair said that ''We have to liberate ourselves from the notion that "we" caused this' , when talking about ISIS.

Let's all continue pointing at those baddies from the East and listen to the goodies like Mr Tony Peace Blair from the West who are a beacon of peace for the world.

I think when any religion or group of people become intolerant of others then there is going to be trouble. You can't have tolerance on one side and intolerance on the other. There has to be a balance.