to start yet another Indyref thread?

[FannyFifer]

Round 3 folks.

We should arrange an Indyref meet up at this stage.

[weatherall]

Yes councils are often seen as training grounds for the next bunch of wannabe msps.

I've met some good ones and some 'who on earth voted for you' ones.

I think there's a democratic deficit in the lack of knowledge or understanding about our councils. We need to become a more participatory society. Hopefully the referendum will have a long term effect on voter turnout especially at local elections.

[StatisticallyChallenged]

Jesus, I need to go on a diet! Your makeup looks great though OOAOML! That white pasty look really works for you! Which one of us got dipped in irn bru?

[WildThong]

Bagsy me the black frock, so slimming compared to the pink.

[weatherall]

Those who protest too much...

It's ironic how well you are proving my point about some no posters being nasty mud slinging bullies.

What insults are you going to throw at us tonight?

That yes supporters are thick- no you did that yesterday, today must be the day to call us feckless scroungers.

[OOAOML]

I actually imagine the good councillors either move on to Holyrood or get worn down. But you're right, until I was involved in a campaign that went to the council I had no idea how they worked. Or that a motion for "urgent action" didn't actually mean they were going to do anything.

[ChelsyHandy]

Then theres the strange business of legalised brothels saunas money laundering businesses in Edinburgh. I've heard murmurings of paedophile rings involving members of the "Establishment". But there seems no way of bringing City of Edinburgh Council under any form of control. Certainly the Scottish Government isn't in the slightest bit interested. Perhaps they could give lessons to the mafia...perhaps they already do.

[wearenotinkansas]

squoosh - excellent!

[OOAOML]

Statistically I'm Scottish - white pasty is my natural colour unless I've been outside for 15 minutes in summer

Weatherall I think tonight's thread has been fairly devoid of insults, from either side.

[ChelsyHandy]

CofE Council are masters in the art at avoiding FOI requests. Again, you would think the Scottish Government would have provided a FOI system that is perfect, as part of their stated ambition to produce a more just and fair society.

[OldLadyKnowsSomething]

If it's any consolation to Edinburghers (I lived there for 20 years, and was subject to one of their "compulsory repair" schemes, using their "approved contractors"), Glasgow City Council has as many complaints about cronyism etc.

In the event of a No vote, a Labour gvt at WM would seek to remove powers from Holyrood and pass them to local councils; they call it "local accountability" or some such.

Just saying...

[StatisticallyChallenged]

I don't think anyone has thrown insults tonight, although you seem to be trying to start it.

Pah OOAOML, I'll see you're white and raise you practicaly blue, but can turn pink easily in the sun. Then go back to white. Again.

[OOAOML]

Statistically thank goodness they didn't get a photo of us doing that ritual where we burnt the white paper.

[wearenotinkansas]

we are getting the same bobbins from GCC about overcrowding in schools here - and nurseries - being due to the rising birth rate (which they presumably knew about when it started rising sometime ago). And they are also cutting partnership funding in private nurseries. I don't see how an independent Scotland would be able to reverse this and provide near universal free childcare, while at the same time cutting corporation tax.

[ChelsyHandy]

Has anyone else noticed the property market slowing down? Is it on hold until after the Referendum?

[squoosh]

I'll post the photo I've got with involving a naked Alistair Darling on the altar.

[squoosh]

Chelsy I was talking to a colleague today about how it seems the property market, where I am anyway, seems to be getting more and more brisk.

[WildThong]

squoosh don't you dare!

[OOAOML]

In the event of a No vote, a Labour gvt at WM would seek to remove powers from Holyrood and pass them to local councils; they call it "local accountability" or some such.

Tell you what, I am so altruistic I am willing to accept it. Plus in an independent Scotland they'd probably try and get that through Holyrood anyway.

Plus I might be moving to Fife, after Fanny made it sound so good.

[OldLadyKnowsSomething]

Squoosh, do it! Do it! Do it!

And I see you mere blue people, and claim grey, with instaburn and peel...

[weatherall]

wearenotinkansas it is expected that the extra income tax paid by working mothers especially including the long term benefit of not having a career break as well as a lower spend in benefits to out of work families would more than compensate for the cost of childcare.

I read (way before the independence debate started) that the value of female employment was worth more to norway's economy than their oil.

[AFewFallenLeaves]

OOAOML I recognise the baffled and blaming tone of council education departments!

Ordinary people and their inconvenient habit of having families when they move into, you know, family homes. Who would think it! Do they not realise the local plan involves no-one downsizing after their grown-up kids leave home ever..

[OldLadyKnowsSomething]

Fife can be lovely, OOAOML, my mum, sister, BIL and 3 nephews live there. :)

[OOAOML]

What jobs will all these mothers (actually I'd prefer to say parents, I don't like the way child are is presented as an issue for women) do? Looking after other children? How will the provision be put in place? What hours will it cover? I read today on the Yes website (daughter is doing referendum homework exercise) a proposal to have childcare equivalent to school hours, which isn't ideal for a lot of jobs. And the current Scottish Government record on meeting childcare pledges isn't great.

[StatisticallyChallenged]

it is expected that the extra income tax paid by working mothers especially including the long term benefit of not having a career break as well as a lower spend in benefits to out of work families would more than compensate for the cost of childcare

That seems...unlikely, at least in the current climate. The lower cost of benefits assumes that there are more jobs for those women who are not currently working to occupy. At the moment, that's not really the case. In the very very long term there would possibly be a balance, but the cost of providing childcare would not be directly offset by income tax for all but the very highest earners. Unless we're planning on some seriously sub standard childcare.

[OOAOML]

I still snigger at the "one bedroom flats don't generate many children" announcement we were treated to (puerile mind). It was followed by their woefully low projection of how many primary school age children would be in the 2 and 3 bedroom flats.