to think parents should make room for adults by getting their kids to sit on their laps.

[Bouttimeforwine]

I have always done this, in waiting rooms, on buses, anywhere really. Even till they were too big really to be sitting on laps. Even now I will get them to sit on the floor at friends houses so that adults get the chairs. It's polite and the way I was brought up.

I often see children taking up a space, when it would be easy just to pop them on your knee for a short period of time. I know for a fact that some of these parents have no physical reason not to do this. They just think that their child has as much right as an adult to have that seat. True but it's not good manners is it?

AIBU?

No one has said they wouldn't give up a seat for someone in greater need.

But unless someone is old frail pregnant etc then the greater need is the small child who is more likely to get hurt.

RTFT- people here think even an able bodied adult should take higher priority than a small child just because they are an adult. That's the issue.

Oh my.

Doesn't it, as ever, depend on the context? Do we have to think so rigidly? Sometimes it's reasonable for a child to have their own seat, sometimes it's more reasonable to give up that seat.... A bit of awareness, tolerance and emotional intelligence can go a long way here.

"ome MNetters seem to be in the process of rearing a generation of entitled brats with no manners."

Probably not just some mnetters... However I have encountered many adults /older people on public transport who have no manners and act selfishly .

OP yabu to thunk that children should always give way or sit on their parents lap.

I just have the image of school assemblies and how much my legs ached sat there for what seemed an eternity. I ALWAYS got pins and needles so bad my whole legs went numb and when I stood up I had to limp and almost fall until the feeling came back . I still say it's those assemblies that screwed up my knees... So much time sitting cross legged on a hard floor surely can't be good for developing knees, not to mention spines...

I'd only put my eldest (4) on my knee if there was really no other space on the bus but that doesn't happen very often round here. It did happen a couple of weeks ago and he was very uncomfortable on my knee as was I having him on my knee. It was akin to having a Great Dane sit on your knee tbh, he's so tall and gangly . I wouldn't make them sit on the floor though to give an adult a seat unless the adult was disabled/elderly. I have to sit on the floor sometimes at get togethers and that's fine, despite slightly wonky knees I'm still young and agile enough to jump back up so no worries although my back kills without support.

I loathe the way children are treat as though they don't have the same basic rights as us because they're smaller and haven't been alive as long. Harps back to the archaic thinking "I'm an adult therefore you do as I say and respect me at all times." Nah, respect is earned regardless of age. Slightly on a tangent.

Totally agree OP. Making space for others by getting a child to sit on a parents lap, is no big deal and only polite.

When I am on the bus with lots of bags, I pile them up on top of me so there is a seat spare, unless there are other empty seats available. It is uncomfortable, but I have consideration for others.

Honestly though, I do think more younger people have a sense of entitlement and basic manners are less common. Although in fairness when I was young there was a bus conductor who would have simply told a selfish parent to put a small child on their lap, so that someone didn't have to stand.

Funny, when we were in France on holiday, adults leapt out of their chairs to let my dd, 5yrs, sit down on the subway/bus... lots of strangers helped us navigate the system which never happens over here.

They clearly have more common sense over in France and treat children as actual people rather than some lesser being who isn't as deserving because they haven't become fully grown yet.

Honestly though, I do think more younger people have a sense of entitlement and basic manners are less common.

Hmm I have come across plenty of older people who believe their world owes them a favour, who shove their way through doors and are downright rude.

I don't think "entitlement" and lack of manners are restricted by age. Plenty of young people are very polite plenty of old people are plain rude.

Miss, parents putting a young child on their lap, is not treating that child as a lesser being. It is simply being considerate.

Totally agree capant thats just what I was trying to say!

Letter, others have responded. No, I don't get up for anyone standing - but my early drilling in consideration made me aware of what's going on around me.

I don't believe it makes my child a 'lesser being' to make him sit on my lap to allow someone else to sit, regardless of their circumstances or how much he objects. It's polite and thoughtful. And when he's an energetic 9-year-old, god willing, I'll expect him to stand for adults as a sign of good manners and because good manners need to be practised.

I'd like a child who is confident but without the attitude of some people in their twenties I've employed recently who have a real 'the world owes me a living' attitude. And I think it's my job to make sure he thinks of others and doesn't fall into the thinking expressed depressingly often on this thread - others are doing worse therefore I don't see why I should have to put myself out/behave well.

No one is saying that they wouldn't make space though, or put kids on their lap on a crowded bus/train.

The objection is aimed at those who seem to think that all children should vacate seats because another adult is standing regardless of whether or not they need the seat.

I have two kids. I can only sit one in my lap. Whether I stand and girls have a seat or I have one one lap and the other on a seat, that's two seats taken regardless unless it's a no enough seat they can share.

Now I put one on my lap. I also give up my seat for those who need it and I class a small child as one who needs ot.

But a small child should not have to be turfed out if a seat the second someone aged 18 or over enters the bus based purely on the fact they are an adult when I have do e everything I can to ensure they are to taking up more space than they should.

That's the objection.

Not taking

Because it is safer that thy are sat down and unless the person is on greater need then my kid should be able to remain seated.

And out if all the people on the bus why should a small child likely to get hurt be deemed the one who should when the bus is full of fit healthy people who should be getting up

I would never accept a seat of a child under the age of about 10. If I was offered one by an older child then I would judge it based on the situation. I have a bad knee so if it was bad that day I would probably take it, if it was ok I would stay standing because I know I am safe to.

I do remember the first time my dad was offered a seat on a busy bus by someone of about 14 he didn't know whether to be honoured they had offered or offended they felt he was old enough to need it!

And I would judge any mother or father who chucked their 4:5/

6/7 yr old out their seat when I

A healthy adult walked on the bus.

Giles, reading this thread there are many different objections, including those who think a 10-year-old standing for an adult is telling the 10-year-old they are 'worth less'. Which I think is utter nonsense.

Other people can do whatever they like with their own kids; I'll do what I think will impart the best values to my own kid based on the circumstances at the time.

I don't think absolutism is ever helpful - as MN demonstrates so well when a generally sensible position is torn apart gleefully by the 'but what about this specific situation that happens but rarely' approach.

So in general - when my child is old enough to stand, and it is safe for him to do so, he will stand, as I think that's what's best for him in the long run.

And when my kids are bigger

Thy will too, but it's safer for me to stand instea

Oh ffs iPhone

I will also continue to view a small child as part of the vulnerable group who need the seat more than myself.

I've not once said my children will sit their ground their whole lives just that while they are small and higher risk than adults they should be able to keep their seats and it's unfair for people to make them get up for able bodied adults.

I wouldn't expect a10 year old boy to stand for an 18 year old boy. No one I know would. I find the concept of children standing for perfectly fit and healthy young adults weird tbh.fDoesn't happen around here and I'm fine with that

Is the cut off age 18 BTW? I don't have a feel for these rules.

Yes in confused too as to whether I should be looking out for 18 badges before throwing my young kids off their seats?

I get up for old, ill, pregnant etc but should I get up for a 40 ur old who's healthy?

A lot of the secondary school kids stand but I'd still rather let one of them have the seat instead of me. I'm still stronger than an eleven yr old.

This whole small child standing on a tube so other healthy adults can sit down idea is very worrying. I can't believe people think letting a small child sit down rather than he thrown about on a train breeds entitlement is the most ridiculous thing I've heard. Of anything it teaches then that once they hit adulthood they can sit there regardless of others and a small child struggling is of no consequence because "I'm an adult"

Miss, parents putting a young child on their lap, is not treating that child as a lesser being. It is simply being considerate.

Well it knight seem considerate but as I have already stated I don't believe it is a safe thing to do. Children sitting in adults laps are at risk of being crushed in an accident or if the brakes of the bus are applied sharply. The link I posted yesterday shows that around 9000 injuries are incurred each year on British buses due to Jon collision incidents. Add on any injuries sustained due to buses (however many that might be) being involved in collisions and it isn't right to say that buses are a safe way to travel and we don't need to worry about child safety.
Should I risk my child's safety due to other people thinking that I am being an inconsiderate arse? Regardless what people think my child is my priority. I will gladly offer my own seat to a person who's need for a seat is greater than my own due to phyisical ailment or pregnancy etc but I will not risk my child's safety or make myself and child uncomfortable so some arse who thinks children are of lesser importance can have the seat.
If you are happy to put fit able strangers before your own child then you probably need to rethink your priorities.

^^non collission