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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to think parents should make room for adults by getting their kids to sit on their laps.

702 replies

Bouttimeforwine · 15/08/2014 12:14

I have always done this, in waiting rooms, on buses, anywhere really. Even till they were too big really to be sitting on laps. Even now I will get them to sit on the floor at friends houses so that adults get the chairs. It's polite and the way I was brought up.

I often see children taking up a space, when it would be easy just to pop them on your knee for a short period of time. I know for a fact that some of these parents have no physical reason not to do this. They just think that their child has as much right as an adult to have that seat. True but it's not good manners is it?

AIBU?

OP posts:
ADHDNoodles · 15/08/2014 18:00

People who think it is even remotely sensible to sit children on laps to free up seats on buses need to go and look at videos of what happens in an accident when a child is travelling in a vehicle on an adults knee.

You should see what happens to adults that don't wear seat belts in vehicles. Buses aren't like normal vehicles, I think that's important to remember. They are bigger and can take and absorb more impact than a regular car could.

You can't compare a child flying through a car windshield with a child sitting safely on a parent's lap on a bus. If it were truly dangerous they wouldn't allow people to stand.

Gileswithachainsaw · 15/08/2014 18:02

We pay a child fare from age 5 round here.

So dd1 is paid for!!!!

Squtternutbaush · 15/08/2014 18:03

Bouttime see that message is a very different one from your OP.

If you'd have said you were expecting common decency for people to make space for others whether in a room or on transport then I would've agreed.

Babiecakes11 · 15/08/2014 18:05

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

cardibach · 15/08/2014 18:05

What's all this about sitting on the floor being like an animal?

ShoddyBoss · 15/08/2014 18:08

The adult return fare to city from here is £5.00. For a child (5-16) it's £3.70. You don't pay for the seat, you pay for the right to travel on the bus. That's the contract you enter into when you buy your ticket.

My children are still expected to offer their seat to someone in greater need of it. I offer my own too.

I don't see what paying for the right to travel has got to do with consideration, respect and courtesy.

elephanteraser · 15/08/2014 18:08

there seems to be alot of bad bus drivers on this thread. it's safer to drive people.

agree with op though it's just good manners.

Babiecakes11 · 15/08/2014 18:09

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

lettertoherms · 15/08/2014 18:19

My god this thread.

If a child is small enough to be on a lap, they should be on a lap. If they are old enough to stand safely, then an able-bodied child should act as an able-bodied adult; first come first served for seats, unless someone with greater need, such as those heavily pregnant, elderly, or disabled.

As it happens, if I'm sitting and have the opportunity to give my seat to a child under ten or so, I do, especially to let children sit with their parents - I have more balance, and more sense, and I only need to worry about getting myself off the train at the right stop. I've seen adults get pushed around on a crowded train or bus until they're too far from the doors to get off at their stop. It puts my heart right in my throat to think of a child being separated from their mother on a train.

It's appalling how many of you seem to believe a child is worth less than an adult. I thought that attitude was rightly out the window. You realize that a child is a person? Smaller, and often more vulnerable, and a human being with rights all the same.

The idea that all children must respect adults more than all persons should respect other persons is the same attitude of "children should be seen and not heard" and "the adult is always right", dangerous attitudes indeed.

JenniferJo you are the rudest poster I have ever come across on mumsnet, which is quite a distinction.

I'm incredibly grateful my parents raised me to know I was a person, with as much value and rights as any other person in society, worthy of the mutual respect we should all afford each other. I will always give up my seat to anyone other than an another able-bodied adult (and even then, if they have groceries or otherwise seem to need it more than I) and I credit this to the way I was raised.

slithytove · 15/08/2014 18:20

Interesting.

We never take public transport, so I will have to manufacture opportunities to teach the DC when they are older. Currently still of buggy age.

However, having rtft, it seems to have become a bit convoluted!

Surely, once you discount the obvious fact of always offering a seat to the more vulnerable (be that elderly, disabled, pregnant, or young), it becomes about a stand off as it were?

How can it be decided that all other things being equal, a ten year old should give up their seat for a thirty year old? I don't understand the logic there. Are we just teaching children that they are less important?

Should a 20 year old automatically give up their seat for a 40 year old?

I also dislike all of this openly judging that people are admitting to? I've read several posts saying "yes I would judge if an able bodied child didn't move", but as ever, appearances are deceiving.

SevenZarkSeven · 15/08/2014 18:21

I agree with your post lettertoherms Smile

slithytove · 15/08/2014 18:22

Agree completely with letter.

Greater need - goes without saying for all members of society.

Equal need - well then why does it come down to age?

MostWicked · 15/08/2014 18:26

As small children, my boys would sit on my lap.
As they got bigger, I would give my seat to them. I can stand for longer, have more stamina and have better balance. They are (not obviously) disabled and I really don't see why I should have to justify to anyone, that they should be allowed to sit in a seat that I have paid for. I really don't see the relevance on how much I have paid, they need the seat more than I do, so they get it.

The full fare argument fails, because many elderly and disabled people get a reduced rate, so they may have the greatest need but pay the least (or even nothing)

Bouttimeforwine · 15/08/2014 18:29

squttern I don't think my last post differs from the op.

OP posts:
Inertia · 15/08/2014 18:30

Obviously the people absolutely in need of a seat are the infirm elderly, pregnant women, and any adult or child with a disability or any other medical issue which makes standing difficult. However, I do think it's safer for young children to sit than stand on a bus, and I couldn't care less whether people judge me because I prioritise children's safety above sniffy judgements about manners.

I've stood on buses to let small children (my own and other people's) sit. As a fit , healthy adult I'm much better able to cope with the buffeting and being thrown around, and I don't think I'm entitled to a seat purely because I passed the age of 18 (long long ago...) . Actually my fondest bus memory is 2 lovely cuddly older women on a packed bus who smilingly insisted younger DD (about 3 at the time) squish on their seat so she didn't get thrown about and I could hold on to older DD.

On a train many families generally reserve their seats so that they can sit together - in those circumstances it would be totally unreasonable for an adult who hadn't bothered to reserve a seat to expect to turf out a child.

In a doctor's waiting room there's every chance that the child is there because they are actually ill, so if standing is necessary it would make more sense for the parents to stand if they are able.

JenniferJo · 15/08/2014 18:33

JenniferJo you are the rudest poster I have ever come across on mumsnet, which is quite a distinction.

Really, lettertoherms? You must be new around here. You should stay in more.

ShelaghTurner · 15/08/2014 18:40

However, they are not full, contributing members of society...

Good God, really? That's one of the most dick-headed comments I've ever read on here, and boy has there been some competition.

parallax80 · 15/08/2014 18:43

I thought I'd solved this one just now on a moderately crowded train by parking the buggy in the bicycle bit, squeezing my 7-month-pregnant-twins self into the buggy and putting the toddler on my knee. It was brill, until I tried to get out. There would have been a live action thread, but I was too busy working out whether it was better to miss my stop, or try and get off with my hippo bum stuck in the buggy.

MostWicked · 15/08/2014 18:47

I just find it a bit rude when parents don't do their best to ensure as many adults as possible can sit down.
Why do all the adults need to be able to sit down?
The fittest, healthiest adults, should be the ones left standing surely?

ouryve · 15/08/2014 18:48

Some of those "extreme scenarios" are normal every day life for some of us.

expatinscotland · 15/08/2014 18:49

Who are all these weirdos who notice all these children sitting in seats, people reclining a seat on an aeroplane and spending precious time getting riled up about it. FFS, time's a wasting.

cardibach · 15/08/2014 18:54

No, what I meant was, why are people saying it is 'like an animal' to sit on the floor! I wasn't agreeing! Sorry if it wasn't clear. Like animals? Really? Kids go on floors a lot. I sit on the floor a lot. Nothing 'like an animal' about it. Bonkers.
YANBU OP - it's about respect. It is good manners to respect your elders and people in positions of authority. There is far too much of the idea that you don't show respect unless someone 'earns' it. Manners give the benefit of the doubt. I'm almost 50 and I still like to show respect to people older than me. Yes, I respect everyone - but sometimes you should show more respect for a particular group. There is no logical reason for this, I just feel it is right.

Gileswithachainsaw · 15/08/2014 19:54

The animals but was in reference to them sitting on the floor in waiting rooms because someone thinks they are more superior regardless of being perfectly capable

Gileswithachainsaw · 15/08/2014 19:55

Or on trains and buses.

Not about people's houses

Missunreasonable · 15/08/2014 20:02

The full fare argument fails, because many elderly and disabled people get a reduced rate, so they may have the greatest need but pay the least (or even nothing)

I said that this afternoon and got told that I was being stupid (by the rudest person on this thread).

As for the comment about cildren not being full contributing members of society (whoever made that ridiculous comment); it is worth considering that many people over the age of 18 are not full contributing members of society either. I know far too many feckless non contributing adults, perhaps we should tie them to the roof of buses as they clearly don't deserve a seat.

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