To ask the MN jury to deliberate on this case?

[InTheDock]

I'll try and keep the information neutral, including gender and which side of the argument I'm on.

Background: Couple married for 12 years, two children, separated a year ago after one party's infidelity. One parent has main residency, the other has the DC eow and a couple of times a week for tea.

Eldest DC has a birthday which falls on the day that the resident parent normally has the DC. This parent asks non-resident parent to tea to watch DC open presents and do the cake etc.

After this, the resident parent drops the DCs off at their grandparent's so they can visit someone they are in an early relationship with. The NR parent then calls the R parent to speak to the DC and at this point discovers that they have been left at the grandparent's house. The NR parent is very angry about this but the R parent maintains that the DC enjoy spending time with their grandparents and wanted to stay over that night. The NR parent says that if they'd known about these plans they would have had the DC even though they already have birthday plans for the next day with the DC.

So, oh wise MN jury, considering the facts:
Was it unreasonable for the DC to be left at their grandparents' on their birthday?

If the birthday child said that spontaneously, and it wasn't strongly suggested, or imposed on them as a fun idea by the RP, I would agree with that, sashh. But if finishing off the day with a sleepover at the grandparents had always been part of the plan for the day, it seems odd that the NRP didn't know about it as he/she is obviously an involved parent and had been with the children shortly before they were "dropped off" at their grandparents'.

I can see it is not great way to handle your child's birthday. However they had birthday tea and presents with both parents. Which is wonderful. Well done parents for being able to do that.

If the child was not upset being at grandparents on birthday and in fact had a good time then there really is no problem.

"It's also interesting how many people, despite the OP neutrality, are assuming both that the NRP is the dad and also that it was this notional dad that had the affair"

It was the very fact that the OP mentioned the infidelity, in context of an otherwise neutral story, that led me to believe that OP is the RP and that the NRP is the dad and that he who had the affair.

It's incredibly hard to be totally neutral, even when relating a story on an internet forum, when you are still in the first year of rebuilding you life and all that entails.

I'm with team RP for this one.

I had some really fun sleepovers with my grandad when little.

And on one occasion my parents had gone away for the whole week that my birthday fell into. (Mum's memory can be a bit erratic.) I didn't care, and had a great birthday with the people I was staying with (aged 10).

So no, from a kids POV it's not always as simple as saying NRP gets first refusal, as if the kids are a possession to be passed around.

Once the child has gone to bed, then it's irrelevant if it's the birthday or not.

As it was the RP's 'day' I am with them and its their choice who they spend the time with in a normal week

However as it was a birthday it would of been nice had the RP offered the NRP the time

I think we are all equally interested in whether the OP is the RP or the NRP as we are in the rights and wrongs of the birthday! Good "mystery" thread, OP!

I think if the kids genuinely wanted to go to grandparents (and weren't 'steered' in that direction for the sake of RP's date) then that's fine. If sleepovers are a proper treat for them and they're happy and fully comfortable in grandparents' care, then it might've been the icing on the cake after an already lovely day. But if I were the NRP I might feel kind of gutted -- and nothing to do with jealousy of the RP's love life, either!

My guess is that RP's infidelity broke up the marriage and that OP is the NRP. Thus NRP finds it doubly galling that they don't get to live with their own kids because of RP's infidelity, and they are not considered first for an overnight when RP goes off on a date with their new fabulous partner on a significant day. I can't see any other reason to mention the infidelity.

It's also going to depend on whether the NRP is the kind of person to be fair, or if arrangements have to be inflexible because the NRP is the type to take a mile if offered an inch.

My guess is that RP's infidelity broke up the marriage and that OP is the NRP. Thus NRP finds it doubly galling that they don't get to live with their own kids because of RP's infidelity, and they are not considered first for an overnight when RP goes off on a date with their new fabulous partner on a significant day. I can't see any other reason to mention the infidelity.

I agree. This is why it is so hard on NRP in these sorts of incidents.

Agree with fair and earth, thats my interpretation of the so called 'neutral' posting here. No offence op :)

I also, in my general assuming-all-mn-posters-are-women (i know theyre not!), assume that dad is the rp (or maybe rp is also female)

It depends on loads of things- what did child want? Did they choose to see grandparents? how often does NRP see child and have they expressed they'd like more? Would RP have known that NRP would like to have child on the "wrong" (I.e out of routine) day, or did RP have reason to think this would be difficult? Did RP send the child to GPs due to thinking this was child's choice, or to spite NRP?

Tbh, I find it a little odd that NRP and RP didn't swap days (assume there was a reason that RP couldn't have the date the following day) as in the current scenario RP has no time alone with child......

Now I thought (contrary to FairPhyllis and EarthWildFire) that the OP is the RP, who has now started a new relationship with someone else following the break-up of her marriage caused by the NRP's infidelity. Not that that makes any difference to the situation being discussed...

The OP is playing her cards very close to her chest!

Also, as a step child and a stepmother, I agree that its necessary to prioritise DCs feelings- however I know that for DSD personally, she'd be equally happy if we said "on your birthday you get to do lovely things with Mummy!" or "as a special treat you're staying with Daddy an extra night!" or "you lucky girl, you get to have a sleepover at Grandma's!" So therefore if one arrangement suited the adults better it would make sense to go with that, as she would def still have a nice bday.

That would be more 'usual' saul, but the op does talk like the wronged party, however also seems to talk like the date was a bad thing...!

Come back and tell us please OP! :) also, im curious nosy as to how old the dc is? Thought that might shed some light on what they wanted to do?

Also curious again, read nosy as to the reason for not having split 50:50 custody?

I don't think it was a bad thing to let the children stay with the GPs but I think the NR parents should have been told and given the option to have them stay with him/her.

As long as the OP doesn't mind, if in the future, the NRP did the same thing.

I'd never do it though.

as a lone parent I would not have gone out on their birthday I don't think but if I was planning to I would have given their dad the option of having them over night first

Hi everyone, it's the op here. I will now summarise my arguments for final judgements .

I am the wife/RP and H is the NRP. It was indeed H who had the affair (well 8 over 12 years if I'm going to fully disclose). The birthday girl has just turned 6.

If I'm honest, I did feel a tad guilty about going on a date on my DC's birthday but it was decided at the last minute. The guy I have started seeing works shifts and is about to go away on holiday so I won't see him for several weeks. I know, I'm selfish right? This is what H is saying (along with some other choice names). We would have been visiting my parents anyway, it's just that I happened to leave them there overnight to go on a date. I left after they would have been in bed had they been staying at home.

There was no secret about it, both the DC and my H were aware we were going to my parents', it's just that I neglected to tell him that I was leaving them there to go on a date. He has only just found out that I am dating again and is not happy to say the least, going as far as threatening violence if he sees us together. In fact, the new guy has already expressed his reluctance to get involved in a situation where the ex is being difficult and I can't really blame him for feeling that way. I really like this guy but due to my ex it will probably be over soon anyway.

Our DD absolutely adores going to her grandparents (her only one as H is NC with his own parents). Given the choice, she 100% would have chosen to go there instead of her fathers. She has been spending quite a lot of time there over the holidays as my mother is providing the childcare while I work and she throws massive tantrums if she has to leave, particularly when it is to go to her father's. She often expresses disappointment at having to see him.

There were several reasons I did not offer him first refusal but I can see I was perhaps unreasonable on this front. Firstly, she would have been upset at having to go. Secondly, he is very inflexible with me. Thirdly, if he'd known I was going on a date, he would have done his damnedest to make sure I had to return early (he's ruined other nights out for me even before I was dating by doing this). Fourthly, he has to be up very early so the DC would have had to get up very early to be dropped back with me (fine for me as I was home by 11.30pm but unfair on them).

H had already told me he had a table booked at a restaurant with family for the next day. He's now saying he would have taken them on her actual birthday but I fail to see how that could have been the case. I do believe he is mostly angry that I went on a date rather than anything to do with the DC as I doubt I would have been called a dirty little slag if I'd just been at home alone. In the past we would both have taken the day off to do something on their birthdays. He made no mention of doing that this year or even of seeing her at all on her birthday, it was me that offered. I also find his stance highly hypocritical since on the day I gave birth to our DD, he went home and spent the evening with one of his OW .

So there we go, my totally biased (but factual) version of events. I'm still interested to know if IWBU to go on the date given this new information as my ex claims if the jury would like to continue its deliberations .

Thirdly, if he'd known I was going on a date, he would have done his damnedest to make sure I had to return early (he's ruined other nights out for me even before I was dating by doing this).

Yeah, it's good they went to the grandparents.

If he's being manipulative and trying to be controlling, don't put him in a position of power where he can do so.

Btw, I booked the day off work and spent the entire day with them, taking them out, bought all her presents and I am doing all the arrangements for her birthday party at the weekend. So I do feel like I discharged my birthday duties towards my DD before going in the date . .

I said before the RP was not BU and after reading that YA Defiantly NBU.

Hope the date went well

Thank you for the fresh evidence. YANBU.