To refuse to un-recline dd's plane seat...

[MerryMarigold]

Dh reckons I am. I reckon I am not.

So, long haul flight. Up at 3am to get to airport. 2 flights, 4 hour transit, bit of a hideous trip.

Anyways, on second flight, dd aged 5 FINALLY falls asleep. Thank God. Recline her seat so she is more comfortable and will hopefully sleep longer. 5 minutes later lady behind pokes my arm and asks me to put the chair up. Not very politely. I tell her my dd is asleep. She says she can't open her table with the chair reclined. (I have done this many times, so know it is entirely possible). I kneel on my chair and help her open table. Says she can't see TV screen. I adjust TV screen angle for her. She then proceeds to kick Dd's chair several times, whilst I get annoyed but decide to ignore.

10 mins later drinks come round and she speaks to the air steward in local language. He says to me. "Can I raise the seat?" and I tell him dd is sleeping. He says, "I'll do it gently" and just leans over me and does it. Thankfully she didn't wake up and managed to sleep in a contorted way for a lot longer.

I am usually the sort of person who doesn't stick up for myself and who doesn't like putting other people out (I didn't recline my own chair for the entire 9 hour flight as her large dh was behind me). I was very tired, I think that's why I was a bit arsey. I am also not being PFB. I have 3 children, but the others were not as tired and were fine.

Dh said it was her 'right' to have the seat up at least until the food is cleared up (this is probably at least 3 hours into the flight as it's a long flight). I said, "Says who?" Does her right to eat more comfortably trump my dd's right to sleep more comfortably?

So who is right?

Yabu and frankly you sound blinkered and entitled.

This isn't about whether seats can ever be reclined (although I am on the side of not reclining).

It is about whether a tiny person who fell asleep with her seat down and slept through it going up and down needs to have it down no matter what.

Based on your attitude my feeling is that you are exaggerating about the kicking. Didn't your husband react to the kicking? It seems surprising to say the least that he watched a stranger kick your child and yet still takes her side.

Were the drinks the ones served before dinner? Is that why the flight attendant decided the seat should be raised?

I don't think it's antisocial to recline when meals are not being served. In my experience, most people do this on long haul flights and it's fine.

Mealtimes are a different matter. I'm confused from the OP's post as to whether it was actually a mealtime or not. She has said it was only drinks, but in the OP, she also said:

Dh said it was her 'right' to have the seat up at least until the food is cleared up (this is probably at least 3 hours into the flight as it's a long flight). I said, "Says who?" Does her right to eat more comfortably trump my dd's right to sleep more comfortably?

I'm assuming this means that the food wasn't cleared up when the OP was first asked to put the seat upright, even if the lady had finished eating. Otherwise I don't see why the DH would have raised this. On that basis, she is BU.

It is inconsiderate to recline seats whilst food is being served

This. You put your seat up when food is served, and I think the cabin staff member was correct in doing so. It's not just good manners (ie considering others) but common sense.

But otherwise, I recline my seat if I need to sleep.

So you were quite rude to the woman behind you, but she was also unreasonable. The best way to deal with a reclined seat in front of you is to recline your own!

Yabu....

And it's manners to let pax behind know you are reclining....but that's just my opinion ....I think it's good manners.

YANBU. I'm a very frequent flyer, and on overnight flights (ie, back from the US where I need as much sleep as possible as theres no time to have jet lag) my seat goes back as soon as the seat belt sign goes off and stays there till we start landing approach.
On long haul day flights I may stay awake a bit longer, but not much tbh

Wow, never started such a long thread. I now see I was being unreasonable but genuinely never appreciated the depth of feeling on this. I'm a pretty laidback person generally, and despite flying long haul often it doesn't bother me when people recline even during food! I was pretty tired myself so I think that's why I dug my heels in. In future I will be much more aware that this is an issue for people, not just tall or large people. For those who say the recline makes no difference to 5 yo, I actually think it makes more difference the smaller you are. Dd was quite comfortable looking reclined but very contorted when seat was up. My other 2 children and myself did not recline for 9 hours though mr. airline etiquette dh did.

YANBU another very frequent long haul flyer here. Having the seat in front reclined is allowed (it's what they're designed for!) and is the reason the TV is adjustable. It's easy to eat/drink with a reclined seat seat in front of you but almost impossible to sleep bolt upright on a 13 hour flight - I'm guessing that those who hate reclining seats don't often fly long haul. I never ask anyone to put their seat upright on a flight - there's enough room without

All the talk about reclining on long haul or night flights only is daft. Flights go round the world... Your night could be my day, your only flight could be my third short haul of the day.

Like most folk I recline if I'm tired, not if I'm not, and I put my seat up if asked nicely.

OP, good on you for accepting that you were BU. So many don't! Hope you've all recovered from your tiring journey now! :)

Snape. it was before any food or drink. Due to the flight time, by the fine the meal is served and cleared, it is at least 3 hours info the flight. My point being dh thought I should not recline seat until after dinner, but I would have had to wait a very long time.

OK, I get it. I guess in that situation yanbu to recline for a short while, as long as you were willing to put the seat back up again when the meals were served. Personally, I'd have waited so as not to disturb dc unnecessarily.

I've also flown multiple long hauls and agree the 'night' part is irrelevant - sometimes I'm asleep just after take off and don't wake til landing - when the steward puts my seat upright, which would be massively neck-croc kingly uncomfortable if I couldn't recline!

You are most certainly and absolutely NOT unreasonable. You paid for a seat for DD, seat reclines, sleeping is better in the reclined position. Person behind is the entitled one.

I have no idea why all you folks are saying OP is unreasonable. OP, do not listen to them. You were in the right.

And before you all start on me, yes I have been in flights where the person in front has reclined and it can be a little uncomfortable, but I just recline too and find it sorts itself out.

A lot of you wouldnt do very well on a train. We regularly make 11 hour train journies and we manage to sleep perfectly well. Train seats dont recline why should plane seats be different.

trend That is a pointless comparison as train seats just don't recline so there is no other option.

Where on earth do you live that you can be on a train for 11 hours? Not the UK I suspect!

There is, of course, the compromise where you only recline the seat part way.

An overtired child on a long haul flight is a nightmare for everyone.

All of this her rights/my rights is nonsense. When you travel you know there are going to be compromises and discomfort. It can't be helped. Plane Etiquette should dictate that you compromise to try to minimise disruption to all parties. Both you and the chair kicking woman were unreasonable to the same degree TBH.

OP, you weren't being unreasonable!

I completely agree that you shouldn't have to put the seat up unless food is being served, therefore you put it up when you can clearly see (and smell) the food trolley coming round, and you put it back down as soon as the food is cleared.

If people don't want to sit behind seats doing what they are supposed to do, then they need to book bulkhead seats, or book extra leg room so that it makes no difference whether the seat in front is reclined or not.

I couldn't care less if the seat in front of me is reclined, neither could my very tall DH. But DH is particularly tall in the top half rather than in his legs, so really does need to recline if he's going to be remotely comfortable.

I don't understand why people who don't like the seat being reclined in front of them don't just recline their chair as well.

Sorry but I think YABU, mainly because you reclined the seat AFTER she had fallen asleep. And in any case a 5 year old does not require as much space as a fully grown adult, therefore it was unnecessary and inconsiderate to recline the seat.

littlewhitebag - that was my point. Why do plane seats recline when other modes of public transport don't have reclining seats?

And I do live in the uk and regularly travel from one end of the uk to the other by train. Hence why I do 11 hour train journies.

Hate seats being reclined but accept some people will do it and they're allowed to so that's that. However, I think putting it down when the person behind is still eating is beyond rude. We came back from the States recently and the prat man in front of me tipped his back as soon as the seatbelt sign went off....fair enough (she says, through gritted teeth!) but did he really have to tut and huff when I politely asked him to move it up when my food arrived??? To be fair, he did but then tipped it back as soon as he'd finished his....inconsiderate arse.

Worse tough, IMO, are the ones who recline up and down repeatedly through the flight....make your sodding minds up, one way or the other!!!

though not tough!

People like the OP are the reason I have only flown long haul once. You nightmare.