To refuse to un-recline dd's plane seat...

[MerryMarigold]

Dh reckons I am. I reckon I am not.

So, long haul flight. Up at 3am to get to airport. 2 flights, 4 hour transit, bit of a hideous trip.

Anyways, on second flight, dd aged 5 FINALLY falls asleep. Thank God. Recline her seat so she is more comfortable and will hopefully sleep longer. 5 minutes later lady behind pokes my arm and asks me to put the chair up. Not very politely. I tell her my dd is asleep. She says she can't open her table with the chair reclined. (I have done this many times, so know it is entirely possible). I kneel on my chair and help her open table. Says she can't see TV screen. I adjust TV screen angle for her. She then proceeds to kick Dd's chair several times, whilst I get annoyed but decide to ignore.

10 mins later drinks come round and she speaks to the air steward in local language. He says to me. "Can I raise the seat?" and I tell him dd is sleeping. He says, "I'll do it gently" and just leans over me and does it. Thankfully she didn't wake up and managed to sleep in a contorted way for a lot longer.

I am usually the sort of person who doesn't stick up for myself and who doesn't like putting other people out (I didn't recline my own chair for the entire 9 hour flight as her large dh was behind me). I was very tired, I think that's why I was a bit arsey. I am also not being PFB. I have 3 children, but the others were not as tired and were fine.

Dh said it was her 'right' to have the seat up at least until the food is cleared up (this is probably at least 3 hours into the flight as it's a long flight). I said, "Says who?" Does her right to eat more comfortably trump my dd's right to sleep more comfortably?

So who is right?

None of my babies have every been crushed by recliners, even when sitting on my 'of German stock' DH's lap!

10 hours might be medium haul. 5 hours might be short.

But they are just small parts for most of a much longer journey that involved disrupted or cut-short sleep.

wow indigo, I have never experienced that on an internet forum, someone who has nothing to add to the discussion so just make personal insults and speculations about posters instead. How totally unusual and out there for the internet.

If there was a "like" button, Tea and Flippyflops would be hitting it repeatedly.

starlight, of course no babies have been crushed, the anti-recliners just need something to add dramatic effect

SlowRed
'Speculation' ok hold my hand up
'Personal insults' hmm, no don't think so!
Will leave you to it; things to do!

BRACE BRACE

Can we please have a bit of peace and love on this thread?

And seats in an upright position...

I have never screamed at anyone during a flight, SRC, my you do have a vivid imagination and histrionic turn of speech.

BringTea does sound rather nice. Exactly the kind of person I'd like in front of me on a plane.

Bracing...

Thanks to this thread, I shall never feel a modicum of remorse for reclining my seat. If the person in back starts grabbing the headrest or kicking the seat I shall turn round and maniacally laugh in their faces.

:o expat

I have never screamed at anyone during a flight, SRC, my you do have a vivid imagination and histrionic turn of speech.

why then Flipflops did you state on
Wed 13-Aug-14 at 12:01:57, on this very thread:

"I have never kicked a sleeping child's seat but I have death-stared children kicking my seat and I once screamed out loud at an arrogant fecker who was set to recline all the way to the ground."

you tell us you scream at a passenger

then you say that you never have screamed at anyone during a flight

and you call me histrionic.

LOL talk about open goal !

Oh my, this thread is just going to run and run...?!

There sure is some cognitive dissonance going on, whereby the non-recliners genuinely seem to believe they're the 'nice' ones. Whereas, by their very own admission, they seethe, angst, glare/death-stare, scream, yank and kick on flights.

I haven't seen a single recliner own up to anything like such anti-social behaviour. A spot of reclining from a weary traveller really does start to pale in comparison to the litany of toddler-esque tantrums above.

And I'm sure you'll correct me if I'm wrong, but I haven't seen a single recliner say they actively recline during meals. One may have said they would recline back against a baby sitting in a knee, but again, I don't think the vast majority would do this - certainly, they haven't said they do.

It's all here on the thread in black and white, for everyone to read.

expat, how do you pronounce 'maniacally'? My Mum says 'man -EYE -uckly'. It sounds wrong, but I don't know how else you'd say it...

I also wonder how you can be considerate of others whilst expecting them not to recline.

Personally I think I am the most considerate (I am aware of the irony )

I don't mind people reclining on me even during meal service
Often I don't recline myself (particularly if there is an obvious issue with the person behind and almost certainly if asked).

But you mess with my over tired 5yo when I am also overtired and for no good reason...

OK SlowRedCar.

We were flying very low, about to land. Arrogant Fecker had been reclining all the way on a 1.5 hour flight, quite domestic, definitely not multi-leg. Also stayed reclined through refreshments so I had to use DH's table. He was the only recliner on the plane.

Instructions were given as usual 10 minutes from landing. Ignored by AF. Stewardess had also asked him twice to straighten up as she made her way to position. He'd ignored her. I shouted (not sure how loud as the engines were screaming and my ears weren't working) "straighten up!!". As the noise was coming from an unexpected source, he finally complied when we were about treetop-grazing level.

Assuming this meets the reasonable screaming rules as AF was compromising basic safety. So not really anything for you to crow about.

IT'S MY RIIIIIIIIGHT, GODDAMN YOU!!!!!!!

Also an atheist non-recliner btw, so don't like the Jehovah's Witness tag

"One may have said they would recline back against a baby sitting in a knee, but again, I don't think the vast majority would do this - certainly, they haven't said they do".

JapaneseMargaret, I could have missed it, but I haven't read a single post that anyone would or ever has reclined on a mother & baby. One poster upthread said it happened to her, then the same poster later wrongly accused me in hysterics of doing it to others, then a few jumped on the baby crushing bandwagon, but as far as I have read it's all just hysterics based on something that happened to someone once. Not something said on this thread.

The hysterical reaction I got came from me saying baby issues could be solved by either buying a seat for your baby, or getting your husband to sit in front of you instead of beside you (communal you). That was retaliated to with the usual histrionics of "oh so Red thinks it's ok to crush babies" and others just ran with that, because they we're the reasonable ones who don't scream at fellow passengers and are considerate of others didn't have much else to run with, lol.

Cool pic, Scarlett. I am resigned to this parallel universe now :)

SRC - you have now been invited by two separate posters to leave the thread!!!

How strange, is this a new trend in Mumsnet/internet forums? Perhaps shortly before Godwin's law is invoked?

I'd like to ask the non-recliners - whilst you clearly aren't tilters yourselves, would you go as far as the woman in the OP and request that the person in front raised their seatback?

(no reason, just wondering how far you'd go)

Has anyone else noticed (in the last year or so) that when the chair in front of you reclines, you actually get more leg room?

(Etihad in this case but I believe others do the same now too) Yes the seat back/screen is closer to your face (screen has to be adjusted if you're watching).

The seats work on a sort of slide and tilt basis. You anti recliners may end up begging the person in front to recline away from your long femurs in future.

PersonOfInterest - I know, lol. It's the new PA trend. If I invited them to jump of a bridge, I assume they wouldn't do it. Right? So I won’t let the anti-recliners hound me off just to make their life easier.

besides, everyone knows, inviting someone to leave a thread is just the passive aggressive way of saying fuck off

and the self-proclaimed “we’re the considerate one’s here” can’t be seen to do that, it would clash with their self-image and cause all those cognitive dissonance problems japansemargaret mentioned.

p.s.

It seems Godwin’s law now has a revision, it’s called Fodwin’s law and it precedes Godwin’s. And means at some point someone in an internet discussion is going to start accusing posters of crushing babies!

If they thought you'd be more comfortable maybe they would jump off a bridge? They're so damned considerate.

I was surprised once when someone asked if it was ok if he reclined his seat. I'm quite short, admittedly, but it's never bothered me. Neither DH who is 6' 2" and all legs.

I don't generally recline but have recently fo

Premature. Recently found that I have barely ever flown l

FFS! Barely flown long haul.

Oh I get it Flipflops, your screaming at a passenger for reclining was actually a safety issue. How convenient. And how inconveniently suspect you didn’t just add the two words “during landing” in the first place.

I thought it had more to do with the beginning pages of the thread being very YABU to the OP, and you being mouthy and bolshy fitted in perfectly at that point. Then as the thread became more YANBU towards the OP, and you adopted the “I am considerate – recliners are selfish bastards” stance, so a safety issue has to be squeezed in to justify your screaming at passengers.

Next you’ll be telling us when you got air rage at the passenger in the window row who pulled the blind down, denying the children a view of that alps, that that too was a safety issue.

I honestly understand, though thousands wouldn’t, that your child no doubt acts as "wingman-in-economy" for the captain and flight deck. And your child has to look out the window, covering the flight crews’ blind spot, to check no one is on the outside lane so the captain can overtake safely. So when the passenger (who paid extra for a window seat) closed the blind, you got justified air rage purely out of altruistic safety reasons. Yes, makes perfect sense!

If anyone has any long-lost multimillionaire dead-relatives inheritances, just sitting waiting in a bank in Nigeria, and all they need is $2,500 fees to access those millions, today would be a good day to tap me for them, because I am on a believing any old shite spree today.

personofinterest, they are, yes, totally. And such silent martyrs they are too.

binkybix, thanks for highlighting a polite recliner, and another one (two) who aren’t bothered by recline.

My original comment included something like "all the way to the ground", CBA to find exact phrase, you didn't include it when you quoted.

I'm feeling a little sorry for you now.

PS, meant internet rage - obviously - not air rage. I am a self contained person.

Also, OP mentioned windows herself, later on.