to think that Rainbows and Brownies should be scrapped...

[Bardette]

...and all kids can just go to Beavers and Cubs.
In our area there is a long waiting list for Beavers. My son would like to join a colony but we have been told there it will be at least a term until a space will be available.
Girls can go to Rainbows or Beavers, but boys can only go to Beavers. As girls take up half the spaces in Beavers and all the spaces in Rainbows that means three times the number of places available to girls in local clubs.
Surely it would make more sense and be fairer to have two Beaver colonies?

Mayhem: that will be a Pioneer group. There may be a historical reason why there is no Elfin group (6-9) - possibly to do with a lack of volunteers to run it. You could always restart one: I'm sure there would be support from Folk House.

I have been a leader with Girlguiding for the past 19 years - since the age of 18. I have run on the whole Guide and Senior Section units and firmly believe and have seen evidence that the girls thrive in the girl only space. For example I had taken my group of Senior Section (14-18 year olds) climbing at our local climbing wall - all of them gave it a go, pushed themselves, and tried something new. The same girls about a month later were at a mixed Guide and Scout Jamboree - again went on the climbing wall but this time, in front of the group scouts also taking part, were giggly, silly only got half way up the wall and would not challenge themselves.

This is just one example of why I think the girls only space is a great thing.

Re volunteers - I am due with my first baby in September and we have twice asked for parents to help out at the meetings from September - we need one over 18 for each week from September till Christmas just in case I can't make it - we have 24 girls and have asked twice and have a total of 2 volunteers! Classic someone else will do it attitude I have met the whole way through running four units in four different areas.

Noodle I agree!!! I had to shut my brownies group when I went on maternity as no one would help run it and without adults it cannot run. I was gutted as I started the group and ran it for 5 years. I will be going back to help run a rainbow unit in September if I cam sort childcare

People are quite prepared to slap us off but none of them will step up and get involved

Broken, do you think someone could start a Woodcraft group if they'd never been to one themselves/had children at one?

Sounds like the issue is with Beavers, either they should only take boys or there should be more helpers. There is also the Woodcraft Folk, which is unisex.
woodcraft.org.uk/

I went to Woodcraft. DD goes to Brownies and I am glad it is just for girls.

ooopse, just saw lots of other people mentioned Woodcraft too!

I do. That's how my local group restarted (there was a Venturer group but the Elfin group had wound down some time previously).

If you want an idea of how a group might run, you could always find your nearest group and ask to attend a group night. And depending on where you are, you might be able to attach yourself to a 'District' for help with management, finances etc. You could advertise in your area for interest, say it will be a cooperative and see who comes forward to help.

Again, you can ask Folk House for guidance - and you can buy 'The Elfin Handbook' with badge guidance from the website.

All the uniformed organisations need support, emcouragent and leadership. Just get involved. I have been a brownie, guide, young leader and venture scout. My DS are now I'm Beavers so I have been supporting our scout unit. I gad fabulous experiences in both guiding and scouting. We work with our "cousin" brownies and guide units. All units - scouts and guides - have their own character depending on the leaders and the children's interests. There are "outdoorsy" brownies and "arty" beavers. A good unit will balance things out and stretch, support and challenge their kids!

Agree that people need to roll up their sleeves and get involved! I come from a family of "do-ers" - we have past & present - 2x Akelas, brown owl, group scout leader, Sunday school teachers, sports coaches, chess organisers, school governors, nct chairs, youth group leaders, gp surgery representatives, be-frienders, and many more things over the years

. If your parents (and grandparents too in my case) set the example of getting involved and being an active volunteer you will too.

Make a postive difference for your community! Stop moaning and get involved, everyone has a skill and a talent and many hands make light work :)

Excuse the spelling on that - darn phone!

AND THE NON-UNIFORMED ONES!!

Mayhem my local Woodcraft group stared 5 years ago with just 1 family, now we regularly have 30 children Woodchips, Elfins & Pioneers, and another group has just started a few miles away.

There is lots of support from the central group if you wanted to start one.

Sorry broken yes ALL volunteering organisations!

Not read the thread but I feel very disillusioned with the whole thing we put our names down months ago, I am very happy to go on a waiting list but no one has even responded to tell me how their waiting list is or if they know how long others are round our way or where they are....

nothing at all....I was batted around from person to person and ended up with someone saying my list is long do you want to go on some one elses....

It all comes back to people and time always.

I joined Girlguiding prior to having my DCs. At 3 and 1, they come with me, no other childcare arrangements are viable long-term. DH will sometimes have to adjust his work arrangements if our activity is impractical for one or both children. They love it, and the girls love them being there- they're seen as a cute baby and toddler rather than peers encroaching into their female only space. Girlguiding accepts children of volunteers under their insurance, and my DCs have accompanied us on camp and pack holidays as well as trips.

The activities a pack offers is down to the pack. We are an active pack with a good, young and lively leadership team, which has allowed us to extend our capacity. We run a waiting list when other units in our district have spaces, because our unit is the active, interesting one. In the last 12 months, we've had camping, area sleep overs, county pack holidays, unit pack holidays, night activities outside, walks, visitors, trips to living museums... occasionally we squeeze in some crafts and cooking.

Other units in our area struggle with leaders and crises usually end up being filled by other leaders stretching themselves thin, rather than parents getting involved. I got hooked in by my friend talking about this brilliant pack holiday to the seaside that she was planning...

any owls can you help me, I feel like I have stumbled into this strange world of silence and darkness.

I know nothing about brownies or rainbow I thought it was a reasonably priced way to get my DD involved in some interesting things...

I just cant work out what it what and where is where....its like the mason...

How do I find out what pack does what...

Iamslave pm me and I will help as much as I can!

IamSlave - I must admit that I also found the hardest bit of signing my DCs up for Brownies and Beavers was tracking down who ran which packs on which days and at which venues...and then getting a phone number for them.

In the end I shamelessly asked all the school mums if they knew any children already going, and then got phone numbers from them. It is the only time I've used this sort of networking, but in this case it was the only way.

It is difficult because it is all volunteers- they have limited time so if they are running groups they haven't time to keep information, contact details etc clear and up to date.

IamSlave I'd like to know that too!
My Dd is 4. I have had her name down at a couple of rainbow groups -my nearest for about a year but I found the new system on the girl guiding website very unhelpful.it's very vague as to which group is located where. I don't know how you find which group would suit your child, other than randomly (as we have done) put her name at a few and see where you get a place! Typical waiting lists here are over 2 years, there is a good chance dd won't get a rainbows place until she is 6. And I don't Know anyone whose children go to these groups to ask.. Although I have heard of a good Beavers group nearby that I need to look into..
Having previously been a Brownie leader for 8+ years it feels a little disloyal to be looking at Beavers!

A lot of the 'secrecy' is due to the need for child protection and not publicising information about places and times etc.

Within Girlguiding if you use the Join Us system from the website it does give you a bit more information about when and where meetings are as you go through the process to add a girl to a waiting list.

These details are then passed on to volunteers who are told they should reply within 21 days - if they haven't another volunteer is supposed to follow it up.

On the email you should have got from using Join Us it will have a number for our main headquarters who you can phone who will then also chase the request.

Please be aware on the whole the organisation has about 200 paid employees in the main headquarters/local region offices and the maybe one or two part timers for each county - although the one I am in has no paid employees.

These people support 550,000 people - girls and volunteer leaders.

There doesn't seem to be a woodcraft folk anywhere near me, as in not in my county!

I love the idea though.

I would love to join Woodcraft, with the DC, but I don't understand the website at all and can't fathom how you would join

Iamslave, you can't find out what each pack does, because it will be decided by the girls each term.

and my Guides frequently take me by surprise

The GG website is a bit lacking but they are working on it.
Phoning the County office is always an option of Join Us isn't working as it should.

I've read the full thread, and won't bang my head on the wall (much as I'd like to). I just have to accept that some people just won't listen/are too thick to understand simple concepts.

But, there are three simple facts that I wish some people would take on board:

Scouts and Guides are two separate organisations.
Scouts CHOSE to take girls- no one made them.
Our leaders are volunteers, so please give them a break.

My three DDs have thrived in Girlguiding, and so have I as a leader. I have friends all over the world and have met some truly amazing people.
I now have two in Senior Section and the youngest is in Guides.

My eldest climbed Mount Kenya last year as part of her Queen's Guide award.

But there are people who steadfastly insist I sit and teach girls knitting and say dib dib dib, no matter how often I put them right.