WIBU and if so, what would you have done (if anything) - baby on the bus

[ChrissyKochanski]

I am genuinely interested as I acted out of impulse and adrenaline. I would also like to say I am the least confrontational person in the world so what happened is very unusual for me.

I got on a bus after work and a toddler, perhaps 18mo to 2yrs, was in a pram in the pram space. His mother was sat in the first two seats in front of the pram and the baby was facing her. When I got on, the boy was crying. The mother had big headphones on and wasn't looking at the baby and generally ignoring him. 5 minutes into my journey and the toddler was still crying but the distressed thrashing, face going red, struggling to breath, going to be sick crying. The mother opposite him had not acknowledged him, talked to him, touched him, tried to calm him down, nothing . I even wondered if she was with him.

A woman sat behind the mother tapped the mother on the shoulder and asked if he was her baby. The mother said he was and do the woman said "he looks a bit distressed to me". The mother just said "well he's tired" and that was that. The mother went back to ignoring him. The woman behind the mother kept muttering and saying it wasn't right.

Another 5 mins later and the bout is thrashing around bent double over in his pram, still crying and struggling to breath. I admit I got angry and upset at seeing him so got up and said to the mother that I didn't want to sound accusatory but I had been on the bus for 10 minutes and had not seen her interact with her son once and he was now struggling to breathe. Her response was that if she picks him up he headbutts her. I said my daughter used to do that but children still need interaction.

Then the bus driver turns round and says "could everyone (meaning me) sit down. He'll be off the bus soon, he's been to the hospital and is teething and has a cold. I can raise my own soon without any help but I'm driving you people home". The woman behind the mother shouts to him asking why the mother can't look after him.

I sat down then and luckily got off at the next stop. I realise the mother may have had a hard day, she could have PND but all I could see is the poor boy screaming and looking round for anyone. She said not one word to him the entire time.

Was I being a busy body and should have kept my nose out?

I would like to point out that the direction the bus came from was not from the hospital. Also I'm really angry at the father/bus driver's insinuation that we were upset about the crying as I would hate for anyone to think that. We've all been there.

What would you have done?

interfering busybody. Is it just on mn that people get so over involved in the lives of strangers? Its weird.

DS1 (3) was having an epic tantrum yesterday. He does occasionally but can usually be distracted easily. tried to pick him up and he dug his nails into my cheeks and pushed my face away :( so definitely agree that it can make it worse and that it was certainly due to over-tiredness.

No grockle unfortunately them prats are everywhere.
They know everyones child and what the child needs.

gosh when ds was having a tantrum I would often be thinking please shut the fuck up be quiet sweetie I thought that was normal

it is so so draining, this may have been one of many that day

she could have been giving him attention and he could still act the same way and it may have dragged it out we do not know

The 'he'll headbutt me' comment makes me think it was a tantrum. My dd wouldn't hit/kick/headbutt me if she was ill, distressed or in pain - but she may well do any or all of these mid tantrum.

If we work from the theory that she knows her own child, is ignoring him screaming and says if she attempts to pick him up he'll headbutt her, I think it's safe to assume he was mid tantrum and she was ignoring the behaviour because she, as his mother, knows that to try to comfort him will make him worse, to the point he headbutts her.

I don't know.

DS2 used to have horrible screaming tantrums and interacting with him in any way was like a red rag to a bull.

It got so bad at one point I thought he would need to wear a helmet because he used to bang his head all the time, and many a time he gave me a bloody nose with the head butting.

Best way to calm him was to blank him until he worked it out. Happily he has now grown out of it and is a chilled out pre-schooler these days.

I remember a nice old lady trying to be kind to him once when he was mid scream and he bit her. I did warn her, but she was trying to be kind.

I have a tantrummer too. I agree with dropping. I would never ignore my child if he were that distressed. Ok so he might not want to be hugged, but I would "check in" and reassure him that we would soon be home, just so that in the middle of it all they would hear that I do care. I think ignoring a child completely in that much distress is fuelling a huge amount of anger. Somewhere inside they need to hear that they are still loved while they feel like that, even if that is just a few words every now and then which "appear" to be ignored.

I had a tantrummer. I do know what it's like and I do know what it looks and sounds like.

Reading the OP I would take it as a child who was distressed, not tantrumming.

There is a big difference and it is a horrible thing to listen to when there is nothing you can realistically do.

But whichever one it was, I still thing the mother was wrong to so completely tune out.

Well done, OP, for trying.

Personally I'd have been apologising for the noise and explaining (if I were ignoring as the best way for him to sleep/stop tantrumming). I wouldn't expect an entire bus to ignore a crying baby! It's a pitch that does make us uncomfortable, and whether from a genuinely distressed or a drama queen toddler I'd expect people to look if a toddler is having hysterics.

I don't think blocking everybody out is really a suitable way to respond. In a way it might be easier for you to cope with the wails than others as at least you know why you're listening and that there's an end in sight!

And if they'd been really distressed I'd be doing my best to comfort them, and probably shooting apologetic looks at the other passengers.

I am a bit if a people-pleaser I admit, but I do think the mother could have made the situation less tense than it was.

YABU. Once they've hit meltdown the only thing you can do is just wait it out and make sure they don't hurt themselves in the process.

My DD is the queen of tantrums. she cried from the second she was born and at the age of 5 can turn still turn on the waterworks.

her teacher who has 15 years experience has never seen any child like her......fuck knows where she get her personality from.

Im her mother and I know best. I know when my kids are hurt, i know when they need a drink, i know when they are hungry or needed attention or just trying to winding me up.

Hmm

I feel sorry for them all. The mother sounds like she was struggling with a tantrum and had caught the bus with her dh for support. Toddler sounds overtired and unhappy.

Sounds unhappy but it also sounds like a toddler tantrum situation so no reason for strangers to be interfering and increasing the stress for the parents.

It's just so hard to know what to do for the best sometimes.

This is why I have concluded that unless I genuinely suspect harm is, or will be coming to the child in question, I it is best to just stay out of it. By "harm" I mean a level of damage that any reasonable person would view as unacceptable.

No harm would have come to that boy, going from what you describe. It sounds horrible, but you knew the mum was aware of what was going on because of the other passenger''a intervention.

To tell her that she needed to interact with her child was your opinion, an uninformed, biased and frankly ignorant one at that (ignorant because you were wholly unaware of the circumstances, not saying you're an ignorant person).

For those reasons YABU.

On the other hand it kills me to hear a small child cry, and I can totally see why you felt the way you did. On that basis, YADNBU.