To think was a a bit wrong.

[Canthisonebeused]

Not sure why but this doesn't sit right with me, what are others thoughts. It's not a big deal but did bother me a bit.

7 and 8 year old girls doing handstands and cartwheels in the playground at school. Boys being silly laughing at their pants and did not die down after being told not to by playground staff. Therefore girls are sent in to put PE shorts on under their dresses.

I just think they are little girls FFS who care if their pants are showing and the boys should have been delt with. I just don't think it's a good message to sent to girls.

Can I just ask, for those people saying that seeing a child's knickers is wrong, what do you think female children should wear in a swimming pool?

What's the difference between a pair of knickers and a bikini bottom? Or even a one-piece swimming suit?

I am generally flummoxed about how one sort of fabric is fine, and the other sort of fabric is not fit for human eyes.

If the boys are laughing at them, then they should wear shorts over their swimming costumes.

(Not really)

but at the swimming pool they are all dressed the same ie they are all wearing swimming costumes or trunks. At school - the boys don't show their pants - why should the girls?

I'm all for the boys being able to choose to wear dresses and do handstands in them. While they can't, it doesn't mean the girls shouldn't be allowed to.

Why are mothers of boys so backward about feminism? No wonder boys grow up sexist. Wake up and smell the fucking coffee, ladies.

In the latter part of the twentieth century and the first part of this century it was fine for primary school girls to tuck their dresses in their knickers and do handstands. Now we have gone backwards as some blithering idiots tell them to wear PE shorts.

I do find some of the language used on here distasteful "flashing their pants" ughhhhh."modesty" shorts under a dress "more appropriate".... What are we teaching our girls?

The OP said that the boys were laughing and wouldn't stop, so the girls were sent to change. How is that not making girls responsible for boy's behaviour? Yes, it shouldn't happen the other way round either- but the point is that it woundn't And we don't live in a society where men are routinely expected to modify their behaviour to suit the needs of women, but we do live in on where women are expected to modify theirs to accommodate the needs of men.

And the lessons we learn young stick "Oh,I know it's a pain in the neck, girls, but the boys are being silly- you know what they're like. Just pop in and put your PE shorts on, then they'll go away, it'll be easier that way"

And us mothers of boys should be taking this stuff incredibly seriously. We have a big job to do. Probably one of the most important jobs in society at present- the bringing up the next generation of men. Because we sure as hell need to make a better job of it than many of our foremothers did.

hakluyt -agreed. the whole reason dd wears shorts is because some of the boys made such a big deal about it. it was too much hassle for her so she now wears shorts. how on earth have primary school age boys come to think that they can do this?

mum2bubble - you make no sense. your dd wears shorts so she's ready for the beach after school? but surely all the other kids are wearing their swimming stuff? and apparently swimming stuff is fine......

Hatsy- never thought much about it, and no I don't. I don't even know why it seemed relevant for her to wear at school, has made me think.

katkins I'm with you - we do need to think about this because it's part of a bigger issue that will affect our daughters as they grow up. If they're more restricted than we were age 6 then that's not progress is it?

you only have to look at the news reports from the states for the last year to realise the importance of these kind of messages. i think actually OP is "BU"
only in saying it is not a big deal...it is.

It's not, no. I agree. I had just honestly never even thought. She does say she'd rather not sometimes, and if I can find her shorts I say fine. But I'm disorganised :D

'People seem so concerned about the rights of girls, that they are failing to see that this is turning into a bit of a witchhunt against boys.

As the mother of sons I find that disturbing!'

No witchhunt against boys at all. Do you not read the papers? Women still have a lousy time and it's not going to get any better while people say nonsense like this. As a mother of sons, it's our job to teach them to behave properly and with respect and not see girls as something to look at and lech over. Men/boys need to know how to control themselves and be responsible for their own actions. Women are not property. I find that disturbing, quite frankly.

Oh, and before you ask, I have sons and daughters.

Could you talk about the witch hunt against boys you perceive?

Who? Me?

I don't think there is one. I was quoting another poster.

I was in our playground today and saw a number of boys and girls of different ages doing hand stands and cart wheels; those wearing summer dresses also wore cycle shorts.

I will try to explain my reasoning but I would only ask that any replies are not littered with swear words or insults; that is, something you would not say to me if we were chatting face-to-face. This is an important debate and it would be a shame to reduce it to mere name-calling and insults.

I suppose it is about context. A school is an environment were a formal uniform is worn and certain standards of dress observed. Certain standards of behaviour are also expected both within the classroom and playground.

Again, I will repeat that any children (boys and girls) laughing or teasing someone who had shown their underwear by accident when playing would not be tolerated. This is a form of bullying and intimidation particularly when it is several children teasing one child and totally not acceptable. Such behaviour when witnessed would be dealt with by members of the management team immediately.

It is not about boys bad behaviour causing girls to modify their dress: there are two different issues here; bullying behaviour and appropriate dress at school.

A beach or swimming pool context is different again; and still certain standards of clothing are expected from children and adults.

I could add too the context of going to the supermarket for shopping; it would be generally expected that people would visit the supermarket dressed appropriately in 'outside' clothes (for example; wearing shoes, and not wearing pyjamas) but it isn't always the case nowadays.

Hope that clarifies things a bit.

"It is not about boys bad behaviour causing girls to modify their dress: there are two different issues here; bullying behaviour and appropriate dress at school."

It is in this particular context. You could argue that the girls should wear cloths that do not show their underwear. But in this case and at this time there was no requirement for them so to do. So the girls were behaving as they had always done. And were asked to change their behaviour because the boys refused to change theirs. That is the important point.

There is a discussion to be had about school uniform. But in this case, the girls were wearing the uniform they were expected to wear, and behaving like 7 year old children. So, arguably, were the boys- pants are funny. But the key thing is that the group who were not behaving "badly" were told to modify their behaviour - the group that were behaving "badly" weren't. And, as is usually in our society, the group asked to modify were the girls.........

It sounds like this incident was not handled appropriately, Hakluyt. It is a shame that the boys laughing and teasing behaviour was not dealt with properly at the time.

"It sounds like this incident was not handled appropriately, Hakluyt. It is a shame that the boys laughing and teasing behaviour was not dealt with properly at the time."

So......why do you think it isn't about the girls being asked to modify their dress because of the boys?

Tabby, I agree, (and its good that we can disagree with each other without resorting to hurling insults). After all, we are all adults.
Maybe we have all turned a corner on MN.
Here's hoping.

But dd wears her appropriate and exact school uniform, as I imagine these girls were.

Who decided to introduce cycling shorts into the equation? She is not cycling. These are not part of the uniform.

So should my daughter not be allowed to play freely in the playground because she wears the schools own uniform?

I am totally blown away - and really quite depressed - by the thought that any sane person would find any issue in a glimpse of girls' knickers when they are messing about. I seriously did not think people thought like that. They are children ffs! I think it's frankly ridiculous to make girls wear shorts under skirts to 'protect their modesty'.

Hakloyt, I am wondering whether the OPs experience and mine have got intertwined and it has led to confusion. I'm scratching my head wondering how to clarify no, it's not nits, honestly!

losingmybelt, here's hoping .

John, just thinking of practicalities, at least the parents at my school are.

What are the practicalities though? wearing cycling shorts on a warm day couldn't be further from practical, could it?

You get this a lot with bullying behaviour though.

How many times has a child been told to 'keep away' from bullies rather than the bullies being dealt with? It's usually the victim that has to modify their behaviour. It shouldn't be though.