To wonder why social services put so much emphasis on a tidy home?

[superstarheartbreaker]

Have read a few threads where the poor op has been worried as ss criticise the state of a house. Assuming the house does not look like an episode from Hoarder Next Door, Aibu to believe that a tidy home is not necessarily a happy home?

Everyone who has sw involvement should have an independent advocate IMO.

I'd prefer a system like in Norway where social workers support families to stay together.

They do not remove DCs to be out up for adoption there.

If parents were less scared if this outcome it would help build a trusting relationship between service users and social workers which would benefit the children.

It probably depends on the social worker you have but I think generally they try to get a feel for whether you are coping and able to provide the child(ren) with a stable home.

I heard that the main things they look for are clean bedding and clean toilets.

Who does remove children in Norway weatherall?

Social workers support families to stay together here actually. All legislation is based on the fact that children are better off in their family providing it's safe.

There are people who even with lots of support can't make it safe - then and only then do authorities start to even consider breaking up a family.

Our SW seems vastly unconcerned with our messy house which currently features a geriatric cat with bowel issues and an ant problem I am on the case with these things and we are well past the baby/toddler stage. Really she doesn't care (dd has MH issues and my ability to manage those is all she cares about)

I have a friend whose house I am horrified at. She calls it a little messy. I don't. People's perceptions can be different. In her house the kitchen looks filthy, especially under the table. She calls it a bit of washing up. I call it days worth of dirty plates starting to mould. Last time I visited I had to clear a place on the sofa to sit down and had to shift clothes including wet training pants. You can't get in the downstairs loo for junk and the potty is filthy. There is a clear aisle about a foot wide in the lounge to walk through. Paper and toys piled up on the stairs. But this is just a bit messy.... I don't know. I have 2 under 3 and all toys are cleared every night, all washing up done every night, and downstairs floors swept of crumbs most nights although u don't always bother to do under the sofa. Different perceptions , different standards!

www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/183946/DFE-RR198.pdf

A report comparing international child protection.

The emphasis in Norway is in maintaining biological families.

Who does remove children there though, if not social workers?

Weatherall: that document clearly mentions care orders in Norway. A care order here is issued when the court agrees to a child being removed from the parents and placed in care. Is a care order something different in Norway? I can't see a country like Norway leaving children in abusive families. Even if they are not removed and placed for adoption they must be removed and placed in temporary/ long term care when it isn't safe for them to reside with their biological parents.

That document also highlights the fact that the schemes used in Norway such as child care provisions don't actually address the parenting failures, they only seek to compensate for some of the parenting inadequacies. What benefit is there in sending an abused or neglected child off to daycare for a few hours and then returning them to the same harmful conditions at the end of each day?

It goes to court and a judge will may grant a care order. The social worker will write a report which carries a lot of weight but ultimately, the decision is up to the family court to decide.

My SW mate says untidy she doesn't give a shit about

Minging, kids on floors on mattresses, no food in the fridge, no loo roll etc that rings bells

Untidy...even hugely untidy...she isn't bothered by

It looks like abused/neglected children in Norway just go into foster care permanently as being adopted would be against the birth parents' rights to them.

I read recently that in fact an overly tidy house can be looked badly upon as it means the baby isn't getting enough attention

Bollocks. For starters- what baby?

Fwiw my house was immaculate when ds1 was a baby, and i was a single parent. He absolutely was getting enough attention. Its not always true that you cant keep a lovely house whilst looking after a small baby.

Agree with that.

I think excrement is a big problem, from the posts here, and from someone I know who lost residency of a child for a short time. I could not understand how this relative of a friend was keeping the untrained dog after loosing her son. I kept saying if she rehomed the dog and got new flooring she would have the child back, it took the relatives and her a while to comprehend that was all that needed to be done and the child was returned to his home.

People should rehome pets and replace the flooring if they can't keep on top of the cleaning.

And who pays for the replacement of flooring? Mine had no excrement on it, it was 6/7 years ago now, I had no dogs, only two adolescent, litter trained cats who had a covered litter box in the yard, but I was still told I had to replace the carpet.

Even cheap carpets are not cheap if you are living hand to mouth and when your suffering from depression something like saving up and organising changing carpets can seem impossible.

If SWs need things like this changing there should be much more support offered than simply telling the client she/he needs new carpets/furniture and leaving them to figure out how the hell they're going to pay for carpets and feed their children themselves.

That sounds nonsensical, D0oin.

Those SW taking matters to extremes appear to be in the minority. But a worry all the same that they're able to behave like that at all

I know now that SWs like that are in the minority. I was replying to Cassandra who appears to believe that changing carpets is a simple thing to do when, for many, particularly those likely to be under social care, it's not always that simple.

I'd also question why the dog was the only issue. I've had untrained dogs since then, it really only takes a few days to a week to house train a normal dog. In the meantime you clean accidents as soon as they happen and it won't cause any issues to anyone.

I would hope that this lady's SW was able to find her the support she needed to learn why she was struggling to cope with this because it was about more than poorly trained dog, even with the dog gone, without extra support there still would have been issues.

SWs need to do much more than simply ask people to clean up/change things. They need to explore why these things weren't being done in the first instance and explore ways to make sure the parent manages in the future. This may mean helping the client access counselling/CBT etc.

Telling people they need to change is not enough.

I've name changed for this reply but reading the above has made me think about the state of DH's friends house and I've a few alarm bells ringing. If there was concern due to the conditions in which children are living what can I do?

If a tidy house was their only worry they'd have no worries. Where were they in the case of poor baby Peter. xxx

Do you mean to report it UnsureWhat ?
If yes then google your local Childrens services dept. If you can't find it call your local Council office, they should be able to give you it.