My daughter's friend on inappropriate website, how do I broach the topic with her grandma?

[tisrainingagain]

More of a what would you do I suppose.

My dd (10) has been in a weepy confessional mood recently and very worried about small things... Eg. months ago she "picked a skittle off the playground floor, brushed it clean and ate it"... Very concerned about germs suddenly and has she done the right thing. Part of me blames myself for this thinking maybe we have stressed her out telling her to wash her hands etc? (Of course hands have to be washed before meals etc.. I don't think we are over the top, but I don't understand why she is suddenly so worried about "bad things happening". I do remember going through a similar phase but think that I was older than 10).

Anyway, that's kind of a side issue. Some of her "confessions" concern time spent at a friend's house (also 10). One of these was when the friend gave her two vitamin tablets in water (but without saying they were vitamins, saying they were her Grandad's cancer medicine) and my daughter drank it. 3 months later she told me this story in tears (but did not seem remotely upset before that). So I cleared that one up with her friend's grandma (who is the main carer) who confirmed that they had been vitamins.

Another issue was the same friend asking my dd to drink some of a bath bomb they had just made. Apparently the friend drank some and my dd says she just licked a little bit of it and then rinsed her mouth out. Again this happened a while ago and again my daughter is in tears about it now. So I said that in future if she doesn't want to do something, just to say no etc... She obviously seems to have been easily lead which I would not have thought. Maybe now she will react in a different way to things she does not want to do.

Anyway, all this is fairly trivial I suppose. Now for the bombshell. At the same friend's house, and also a long time ago (my dd says a year, don't know how exact that would be), the friend went on a website called omegle which I had never heard of, to have completely inappropriate chats with strangers at the other end. My daughter in tears again saying it was nasty stuff. I asked her to give me some examples, which she didn't want to at first, but when she did, I agree that it was nasty .

So I told her how inappropriate this was for all the different reasons, and the dangers involved. And that (again) she has to stand up for what she knows is right and go and tell the adult present if something is wrong (friend's grandma was downstairs at the time). She says there were two playdates where her friend was on this website and that it hasn't happened for a long time.

My dilemma is how I broach this subject with the grandma without her feeling defensive and judged? She may well know, but maybe she doesn't? Just having the vitamin conversation with her you could see that she was slightly defensive, how defensive is she going to feel about this?

I think I do have to say something for her grandaughter's sake, but how do I phrase it?

Am also annoyed that my daughter was exposed to this, but that would not be part of my conversation with my friend (the grandma).

You are being apologetic just say dd said x was on this website I had to google what it was, just thoyght id let you know about it, then you havetold grandma armed her with information its up to her after that

I'd put an end to the visits myself. Giving your child medication without your consent and free internet access? NO way.

These chat sites sprout up all the time its dificult to know what s what we have to keep on top of them you telling granny is just passing ir on, and your dd needs to have other friends try and have them at your house ime children dk want us to take charge and say no

I have found that my DDs friends (some at least) have more access unsupervised on the net than she is allowed. I won't let her spend time in homes where it's a free for all. I don't think this is ott...I don't want my child seeing porn or chatting to adults.

I think you are right ionce stopped dd1 going to a house where 15 films were allowed she was 9 ,

As a Mum who often has half a dozen or more extra children at my house playing (because my house appears to be the neighbourhood's most popular house to play at), I can understand the automatic defensive response to your concerns. I've had a mother or two complain abut smaller issues when the children are with me and my immediate internal response is "then why don't you have them playing at your house from time to time then?!"

But that is an aside.

I wanted to give you a less in-your-face aggressive "just tell her straight" reply option. Because the GM is likely to get defensive.

An email is much better then a phonecall. Expect a reply within a few days and if you don't get a reply then you will need to phone. When writing think about what you are trying to gain by writing it. Is it:

• to assign blame? (if not, then take care with any judgemental statements)
• to stop the girls going on that website again?
• to stop the girls going on specific websites again
• to stop the girls going online again?
• to reduce the time the girls spend together?
• to encourage them to spend more time at your house rather than GM?

In your situation I would also put some (not all) responsibility onto my daughter that in future she is not allowed to chat to strangers online at anyone's house, at any time.

I really hope they have not seen any porn. My dd does have other friends who come over and whom she goes to see. This friend also comes over, but it is true that my dd does seem to go to her house a lot. I think she sometimes said yes because she felt obliged to, but am not discounting the good times they have had together putting on mini drama productions etc...

Have tried phoning my friend but she is not answering. When she does I will also send my email.

What makes this harder (or maybe not harder I don't know), is that over the past year the grandmother has become a good friend and has been supportive of me in many ways. Agree though that I am passing on information and that in a way I don't have to think of it as any more than that.

Omegle is horrible. It's essentially trolls and perverts on video link asking the other person to get nude and showing themselves masturbating. Not everyone on there does this, but enough that it is 100% not safe for children. I would be very worried about what this child may have seen or be pressurised to do.

The email sounds good, but do not let the site be fobbed off as "just a chat room". Children are abused online too. They don't have to meet anyone in person.

In light of what FuckYou says about Omegle I would be speaking to the school! Definitely. These are primary children!

Thanks for your message waffle. What do you think of my email?

I suppose I would rather they did not go on the internet at all if the grandmother doesn't know what sites they are on, but how do I say that? I do often suggest that they come here instead but I think all three of them are/were happier (grandmother included, or maybe not, I don't know) to have playdates over there. Am going to step back a lot though and will talk to my daughter about her friend coming here instead if she wants.

Yes, was telling dd about the internet this morning and not to talk to strangers (which she already knows) etc..

Aaargh is all I can say!

Given that this happened at home, I don't see how I can tell the school directly without the grandmother feeling victimised. I could however, at the next parent / teacher meeting, bring up the issue of the internet saying that there had been an anonymous incident, and that I thought it would be a good idea for them to do an assembly on it (which they do already do, but still).

With regards to omegle being dangerous and skanky, I am sure/hope that the grandma will look it up and see for herself.

Your email:

Dear my friend

In her current weepy confessional mood, A told me this morning, about a website B and her had been on during playdates at your house, (apparently on two different occasions, both about a year ago A says). It is called "omegle", and seems to be an adult chatroom. A would not tell me what the content of the conversation with strangers was at first but told me it was "nasty stuff". When pressed she told me it was about sex, and said that willy size and undressing were mentioned. She would not tell me more than that and was upset about it.

Again, I don't know why this stuff is coming out now, maybe she understands things more.

I discussed the inappropriateness of it etc. She said it hasn't happened for a long time. You may know about this, but in case you don't I thought I should say.

I wish we did not have to contend with the dangers of the internet.

Love from me

my idea:

Dear my friend

A & B are very good friends and I thank you for having A over to play at your house so often. I would like to offer to have the girls over playing at my house more often, to give you a break too.

(starting with something positive, pleasant and nice)

I've become a bit worried recently about some of the websites A has found. She has started worrying about it too and has confessed to me that she has found some adult, inappropriate content on a website called "omegle".

(absolutely correct, without being judgmental or event suggesting blame)

I want to keep her safe online and so would ask if you could make sure that when A is playing at your house with B, could you keep an eye on the websites they use?

Thank you for understanding

Love from me

For your daughter to look at (with you)

www.thinkuknow.co.uk/

Brilliant help.

Honestly, wasn't it better when the only technology we had to hand was walkmen .

I know the internet is great in lots of ways but its downside is really quite a down one!

It's horrible :(

But education and restrictions all go towards protecting our dcs.

It doesn't get better either. Ds is a teen and has recently been chatting to a 'girl' who he has never met but supposedly is a friend of a friend of a friend. He will not even entertain the idea that she might not be who she says she is. It's infuriating (but he is a lot older).

Thank you waffle and NannyOgg.

Re your email, waffle, your approach is very non judgemental and that is what I was striving for (a bit unsuccessfully). However, how will my friend know that her grandaughter has been on the site and has instigated conversations with strangers and asked these questions? Or that, to open it out a bit, both my daughter's friend and my daughter were on that particular site at my friend's house?

Oh and talking to the school about doing something on internet safety is a great idea.

Schools appreciate knowing this kind of thing is going on. It can prompt them to have internet safety talks with children AND parents. Some people are amazingly naive about it. My sister allows her 10 year old unfettered access and the child is on FB and all kinds of awful "likes" have found their way to her.

I think you're DD is upset and struggling with what she has seen. The minor confessions has ben leading up to telling you about Omegle. It has either been festering or, as you said, she has realised the inappropriatiness(sp?) as time has gone on. Or maybe it has been more recent than she let's on.
She may have seen or heard more than she has told you.

Your

I agree coco. I am going to try and find out more. In the meantime I have revised my email to (sorry, I realise this is getting boring):

Dear my friend

Thank you for being such a good friend, and also for having A over to play so often. I would like to reciprocate more often so that you too can have a rest if you need one.

In her current weepy confessional mood, A told me this morning, about a website B and her had been on during playdates at your house, (apparently on two different occasions, both about a year ago A says). It is called "omegle", and seems to be an adult chatroom. A would not tell me what the content of the conversation with strangers was at first but told me it was "nasty stuff". When pressed she told me it was about sex that the conversation was inappropriate. She would not tell me more than that and was upset about it.

I discussed the inappropriateness of it etc. She said it hasn't happened for a long time.

I don't know why this stuff is coming out now, maybe she understands things more.

This is a difficult thing to talk about, and I have been taken aback by what A has told me, but if we are all in the know, we are better equipped to protect and educate our girls.

Love from me.

__

I suppose it's the "at your house" which still sounds judgemental.

Just to offer a wee bit of reassurance: I think it's normal for girls of this age to find out about sex and to start to gain an interest in boys as part of puberty. Boundary-pushing behaviour of the type you describe is part and parcel of that. I suspect that the 'risk-taking' eating is linked to the 'risk-taking' online, as is the new sense of peer pressure. Your DD is on the cusp between girlhood and more teenage behaviour, and is making that difficult transition into a world of more social criticism and pressure.

I'm absolutely not saying that you shouldn't be concerned about the website. The innocent commencement of puberty is too easily exploited by people online these days, and it's important that there is more supervision. However, it's still more crucial that the girls themselves understand the risk and can exercise some common sense for themselves - and that your DD learns the ability to say 'No' when she is uncomfortable with things, rather than feeling pressured to go along with it. I guess my point is that there are wider issues of self-esteem and self-confidence here that are really common - and that you can play a vital role as a parent in helping her through.

PS I really liked the way you ended your email with 'I wish we did not have to contend with the dangers of the internet' because it made it clear that you thought of the grandma as a partner and help in dealing with this, and were not making accusations. I would put it back in!

Sorry, just read through and thought I'd add to your last post:
'On B's computer' rather than 'at your house'

This thread is really, really freaking me out, and believe me I don't freak easily!

I am not familiar with the website, although some posters have described it a little and, quite frankly, the descriptions are terrifying "It's essentially trolls and perverts on video link asking the other person to get nude and showing themselves masturbating"

I so hope that this all turns out to be a storm in a teacup ... an upset child ... two friends pushing boundaries ... a matter for adult friends to sort out ...

BUT

CHILD SEX ABUSE HAPPENS ONLINE

and you, tisraining, have a little girl who is "weepy"; in a "confessional mood"; is "very worried about small things"; is "worried about bad things happening"; is in tears about the "nasty stuff" on an online website, etc, etc, etc

a little girl, who you also happen to know for sure has been visiting that website that is "essentially trolls and perverts on video link asking the other person to get nude and showing themselves masturbating"

your daughter who, perhaps over time, brings all these alarming things to you and shows you her distress ... and you hand it right back to her to deal with "So I told her how inappropriate this was for all the different reasons, and the dangers involved. And that (again) she has to stand up for what she knows is right "

AND NOW you are planning a careful email to the the other girls guardian/grandma, your friend, and you are clearly concerned that said email does not hurt or offend!

I'm sorry if I'm being a drama llama, tisraining, in fact I HOPE I'm being a drama llama, and I am not in any way suggesting that you are not putting your daughter first, you are clearly a very caring and very concerned parent ...

I do think that you need 'outside' involvement on this though. Yes, be super careful about your daughters emotional state, and about that of the other child, too. Yes, it's also okay to be concerned and supportive about your friend.
But I think this is beyond a carefully worded email, and two friends tightening up the boundaries of two children.
I think you should call the police family unit for advice.

Good luck.