to think it proves lots of people want change

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That ukip are making such huge gains in the elections.
If mnetters could temper their hysteria of screaming racism, I think it is a clear indication that the fundamental principals of the party of no toEurope and no to continued mass immigration are very important to a lot of people

I don't think it's at all naive. A lot of Ukip appeal is down to the fact that they have no history of office, no track record and no real power.

You might think it's a bargain. I see a self serving hypocrite whose eye is firmly on his pay packet rather than public service.

I agree ilovesooty. I voted lib dem in last election for sole reason that they didn't have a track record of being lying, self serving, corrupt war mongers.

I won't ever vote for them again.

and the messianic, reverential tones in which some in this thread are talking about him. Lol! That's just Claig!

If you believe that leaving the EU is the silver bullet for all Britain's social and economic woes then you may want to read a little more widely.

Of course leaving the EU will not cure all the UK's ills BUT it will give us teh opportunity to strat addressing some of them instead of having our hands bound by Brussels.

There was a guy on R4 today. Said he had a motor cycle repair business and couldn't get a trained mechanic. He eventually hired a Polish mechanic. He was very in favour of immigration and he said he had 'got rich' because of it.

Look at it another way. Years ago employers would provide training. They didn't expect a fully trained worker to pitch up. They used to invest in their workforce. Not now. Employers just import the skills they want. Which is of little consolation to a young school leaver hoping for a job in the motor trade and who cannot get training.
And it's not got for the exporting country either. Some of these former Esatern European countries are having very real problems with the 'brain drain' and have a very real shortage of medical professionals in their own countries now.

It's all a bit ill thought out.

'the messianic, reverential tones in which some in this thread are talking about him'

I am not ashamed about my admiration for Farage, because I am just like millions of other people who turn the TV up when Farage is on and turn the TV off when Gordon Bennett or any of the spinners come on. And the reason for that is that Farage represents hope and change.

I am joking in my admiration for Farage just as Winston McKenzie is joking about the impact of the "UKIP fox", but we are both hoping that it is real and that some change will come from it. We are just like millions of other people. Not everyone. There are people who prefer Gordon Bennett and Tim Dim But Nice, but their numbers are dwindling as every day passes and as the UKIP fox strikes and the feathers are flying absolutely everywhere.

Roll on Sunday night and let's see the spinners talk their way our of that one. There'll be feathers absolutely everywhere.

The whole of the EU will have voted, the peope will have spoken. Democracy is wonderful because it represents hope and is the only way to kick the spinners out.

'You might think it's a bargain. I see a self serving hypocrite whose eye is firmly on his pay packet rather than public service.'

That's fine, because that is democracy. Gordon Bennett probably thinks similar. But Farage is now Britain's most popular politician.

Well here's a piccie of Nige just for you Claig, that I took a few weeks ago at the Bath UKIP meetin - I've finally worked out how to get piccies off my ipad.

Fantastic picture. A statesman.

who is gordon bennett?

A blurred picture of someone giving a speech = statesman

claig, are you ever just "meh, whatever" about anything? You do make me chuckle :o

it's a pity that Sir James Golsmith isn't around as he was a fantastic speaker on the perils of the EU.

Oii! There's nothing blurred about my photo. It's the way MN has reproduced it!

Take back control of our country - that's what it says Wet.

And I so much agree.

Sorry WetAugust :)

I'm sure your photo is just lovely. It's just I can't quite count all of Nige's chins.

I use it as a joke term for Gordon Brown.
I don't know if I am using it exactly right, but Gordon Bennett is said as a sort of "bloody hell" exclamation when stuff goes wrong, I think. Maybe someone has a better explanation of it.

Farage a statesman? That has to be taking the piss.

'claig, are you ever just "meh, whatever" about anything? You do make me chuckle'

I find you have to be, otherwise when you looked at those spinners, liars and bath plug collectors on TV, you'd have to cry.

Wet, I'd just want to hear more of the plan before voting for them. Leaving the EU is a defensible policy (I disagree with it, but democracy, eh?) but not having a worked out plan for what's next (or not being willing to talk about it) doesn't strike me as statesmanlike. It's strikes me as someone peddling snake oil to the desperate.

You do hear people saying 'it'll all be ok if we leave the EU / stop immigration' and UKIP are capitalising on that, but what's behind the curtain? What's next after leaving the EU? What happens in the next 4.5 years if they were to be elected?

I don't buy the 'they didn't have a hope of getting elected so they didn't bother having policies', incidentally. Other small (and smaller!) parties have done just that - come up with policies right across the spectrum. Why don't UKIP? Laziness, or political expediency because some of their other policy plans would dissuade some of the disaffected and desperate people who are attracted to The Message and The Man?

Claig, citation needed for the claim that Farage is Britain's most popular politician, please?

Or is it just more UKIP spin?

'Farage a statesman? That has to be taking the piss.'

Have you forgotten farage's brave statement "the EU has blood on its hands over Ukraine".

The spinners nearly choked when they heard that. They know they are not allowed to say that or to leave the EU. That's why looking at Farage's rocking popularity polls is all they can do.

'Claig, citation needed for the claim that Farage is Britain's most popular politician, please? '

Coming up. Unless the Bullingdon Club and their chums have had it removed from Google in utter panic.

"UKIP leader Nigel Farage "most popular party leader", says poll"

www.londonlovesbusiness.com/business-news/politics/ukip-leader-nigel-farage-most-popular-party-leader-says-poll/5009.article

I just want to say claig that I am nowhere near as eloquent as you.......but I am with you all the way and everything you say.

erm It's MY country too ...I didn't vote UKIP - are you going to 'take it back' from me?

Kids used to get the fox, Basil Brush, in my days, but nowadays they all want to get the ""UKIP fox". They love it that "there are feathers everywhere".