To be getting fed up with this hatred of schools and teachers.

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In another thread (this is not really a thread about a thread) about schools some posters have made it very clear that they hate schools, see teachers as jumped up nazis and feel that everyone is feeling superior and looking down on them.

Am I alone is feeling upset and insulted by this?

I am a teacher and surely we both want the same thing, the best for your child?
We are not the enemy. We are on the same side.

I know a retired teacher who is still like that. She is very annoying.

Fuse dog - constant striking? FFS. And striking over class sizes or playing fields is illegal so teachers can't do that, however much they would like to.

Both DH and I are level 7's - we both have masters degrees. I bet in terms of degrees we out qualified virtually all the teachers in the school - there are definitely no PHd's although I suppose there could be some masters degrees amongst them.

I realise that this post was supportive of teachers buy why do you think that having a Masters degree means you out qualify 'virtually all the teachers in the school'? I work in as normal a school as you could imagine in a small department of 5. 3 of us have Masters, one has a Phd, the other is working towards a Masters. 4 of us didn't teach straight out of university - 4 of us have work experience which is relevant to the subject we teach and shows students what they could strive towards if they chose to in our subject area. There is at least another Phd within the school (neither of them use the title 'Dr' so you'd never know unless you happpened to speak with them about it).

And the person who assumed all teachers have second rate degrees and scraped out PGCEs? Yeah, well, 2:1 from a redbric for me, rated 'outstanding' on completing my PGCE.

Half the staff when I worked as a teacher had Masters or above. Plus the PGCE. Plus many of us had other professional qualifications.

For the record, I don't have a PhD yet but my MSc was a distinction.

Yes alright Fedup - it has already been pointed out that there are more masters degrees in some schools than perhaps I had thought but , with respect, who cares? Are you all good teachers? Does having a first or a masters make you a better teacher? Should training colleges only let in people with firsts and masters? Not in my opinion. There is more to teaching than that surely? As somebody else down thread said, they knew somebody with a PHd who failed their PGCE - they didn't have the aptitude. Not everybody does but without it 1st class degrees and masters are useless. Your outstanding PGCE result is more important than your 2.1 from a red brick.

I have seen posts from teachers in the past (not on this thread) that suggest that because they have a brilliant degree they should be more respected/better paid etc but it is not really what the job is about. It is just one of those things that rubs non-teachers up the wrong way. It is easy to say things like that on a faceless forum and just as easy for some people to say awful things about schools and teachers. It cuts both ways, doesn't it?

I am not a teacher, but I grew up with parents as teachers.

I am supportive of teachers and dislike all of this teacher-bashing that I see going on on some threads.

I have never had any problems with the teachers who have taught my three daughters. There was on questionable character who was fired by the school for professional misconduct (and rightly so), but other than that the rest have been fine.

Along with many other local parents, I had a few brushes with a rather jumped up school secretary who thought she owned the place and could be very rude and stand-offish to parents when the headteacher's back was turned, but not with the teaching or other support staff. They have been superb generally.

Parents and teachers should be pulling together to achieve the best for the children. It is loco-parentis. They are on the same side. All too often I hear parents talking as if they are opponents, some in real life and some online. That is sad. I generally find most teachers amenable and easy to talk to. Treat people as you would like to be treated yourself is always a good rule of thumb.

It's PhD, not PHd.

I should know

As a rule I find I like teachers. I appciate the contribution they have to our lives and I hope for good ones for my DCs.
I know many teachers in RL. I do find the majority to be very nice, if a tad authoritarian tbh.
I feel for them in regard to them having to cope with the skill mix that they're supposed to be so supportive of, but IMHO, must feel like a dumbing down of their profession when it gets to a certain level. And I mean no disrespect to TAs btw, who do make a valuable contribution to the classroom, I feel. I also think they've a right to be pissed off about the pension worries, given that they've paid in to a pension believing it will be of a certain value and now that's under threat.
But I am becoming tired of the moaning tbh. The justification for being so dissatisfied: "but we've all got postgrad degrees and do loads of marking and 52 million hours extra, bla bla.
I'm really sorry if that sounds rude but it's starting to grate on me now.

Excellent specialist knowledge and aptitude in the classroom are what make for outstanding teachers.

Fusedog;
Constant striking? Do you think that working people, whatever job they do, have no right to stand up for their employment rights? Or, do you think we should be living in an autocratic state, '1984' style?
Are you happy to have pay, pensions etc eroded? Just because some poor folks have no option but to put up with this sort of treatment, does that mean two wrongs make a right? Surely its preferable for everyone to receive fair treatment if at all possible? That is what democracy is about. If you lived in an undemocratic country it would not be so easy to take your rights for granted.

TheRealAmanda I know what you mean. I am v happy in my job. Fab kids (usually) etc. I sometimes find myself wanting to stuff my fingers in my ears though and sing "la la la, not listening" when in the staff room because the moaning gets right on my nerves.

DH decided long ago that the collective noun for teachers is "a whinge".

It's not a reason for some of the vitriol on this thread though

I'd bloody whinge (even more than I do now) if I were a teacher, believe me. I don't think you whinge more than other categories of people. Students whinge. Nurses whinge. Academics whinge. We all whinge. Even MPs tried to justify the expenses scandal by whinging about how badly paid they were for the hours they put in.

Nigellas I think Eviltwin has already explained most of what I meant about respect but, yes, I do think teachers should be given some respect as a starting point. To achieve their level of education requires more than just rich parents and what a ridiculous statement that is if I might say so!

I brought my children up to treat everybody with respect; some people built on that, others diminished it but the starting point was always courtesy and respect. Too many people now claim respect has to be earned and behave as though the start point is zero and they can be as disrespectful as they want unless it suits them

Why would a child pay any attention to a teacher if his parents were constantly rubbishing him/her at home?

Exactly - but sadly some still do it. In all fairness they may sometimes have good reason to complain, in which case it's better to arrange an adult-to-adult discussion with the teacher concerned

I don't think a single poster has suggested that teachers never get it wrong, but encouraging disrespect from children is hardly going to help anyone, least of all the children themselves

Ah. I might have known a PhD who failed, but that doesn't mean I think academics are unimportant. I think they're very important. I want my children to be taught by clever teachers. Good teachers, certainly. But clever too.

Fairenuff - I agree with every word you say.

I don't teach children, only (very occasionally) at University and am frequently shocked by how little they are willing to find out for themselves and expect me to tell them everything and then produce notes for them! But it's not the teachers' faults. The education system has been fiddled with constantly for years and is now just functions to churn out exam-passing robots.

Also, even within the RG University where I work there is a complete and utter lack of respect from the students to their lecturers and the academics who work at the University. Is it really too much to ask for a little bit of respect for the hard work that you put into helping students achieve? I'm talking about parents here too.

Not read the thread but I agree with you OP, fed up with teacher bashing. There's so few of them up around here just now or coming out with their degrees and actually coming into teaching that I see huge staffing shortages soon. I know of a few incidents already. I would be out in a heartbeat for reasons that are nothing to do with my time actually spent with my pupils and everything to do with everything else. I wish some people would walk a mile in my shoes before mouthing off. I'd never tell a hairdresser, a banker, a shop manager or a chef how to do their job, but every single person I meet can tell me how to do MY job.

Hmmm former teacher hear with a big respect of education but over the years a fair bit of justified criticism(and at times praise)of the school my dc go to.

Sorry but I think it's important to be able to criticise and get info when needed.

Reading and posting on threads on here means I don't rant in front of my children which I would never do.Not getting the assumption that using an internet forum automatically means you teach your children not to respect their teachers.All 3 of mine have great respect for their teachers and education.

Retropear I'm not disputing what you're saying but I suspect that isn't the case with some of the posters here who never miss an opportunity to tell us all how much schools and teachers piss them off. In many cases I think that attitude is conveyed to their children and reflected in their behaviour at school.

I think sometimes it's easy to overlook or misinterpret your own actions. I teach a boy in yr 9. He's a bit immature - no SEN just hasn't caught up with some of the others yet - as does happen in Yr 9. He gets into trouble for silly behaviour - for example a few weeks ago another child was leaning on the window sill in my classroom and the boy pulled the other child's legs, causing him to bump his chin. I followed school procedures and gave a detention. Cue mother on the phone insisting that her child "would never" do something like that. Turns out she calls every time her DS gets a detention and always argues that he doesn't deserve it. I'm sure she thinks she's just being a supportive mum to her child but actually she's undermining the school snd giving her DS the message that he doesn't have to follow school sanctions. He has been known to pull out his phone and call her the moment a detention is issued. Students are not allowed to use their phones in school but she will argue that it is justified as he needed to call her.

Totally agree with Bigboobiedbertha

WeareDetective - in an ideal world yes, you would have both academic excellence and aptitude in the classroom but anything up to GCSE and the academic stuff is not that relevant, is it? You only have to look at those who home school their children successfully to know that (another job I couldn't do). Aptitude and ability in the classroom is more important and far more worthy of claims for better pay and conditions than academic qualifications.

Suburban - I knew as I kept typing it that it was wrong. It is one of those things my fingers do wrong every time and my brain just goes 'sheesh' what a bunch of losers even though it is allegedly in charge.

I'm wondering if respect rests upon what someone values ... If parents and children do not value education, why would they respect those who peddle it

I completely agree; for me, you've summed it up in a couple of sentences. So much of this isn't about a particular teacher or a particular rule - it's about an overall attitude, and that is absolutely NOT easy to address

I was a teacher for over 30 years and my dd has been a teacher for 10 years now, my ds taught for a while and my dss and his dw are both teachers. I have 9 dgc. In all my years of being involved with education, as a teacher, a parent and a grandparent I have met only two teachers with whom I would not have trusted my (or any) dc. They were both men, one taught PE and one History both at Secondary level.
Like all relationships you get out what you put in usually.