To think, minimum wage, minimum effort

[angelos02]

If you think all I am worth is the absolute legal minimum you can pay me then you will get the absolute minimum I can get away with. Common sense really.

NoArmani, there are huge differences between practices, practices like yours usually keep there staff long term which is great for everyone. unfortunately not all dentists think like that. any jobs going :)

Part of the problem is that so many NMW jobs don't have the opportunity for progression. The care industry is notorious for shit pay and conditions. I'm a care worker looking to change jobs because there is no career progression. I've been working towards NVQ3, only to be told that once qualified, I will earn no more than an unqualified new starter. I will not see any incremental pay rises for length of service or increased holiday entitlement.

The care industry gets around this by using emotional blackmail - who, but the most callous person would refuse to care for someone because they were too knackered - even after a 13 hour day? So the shit wages continue to be paid, care workers burn out and the staff turnover is horrendous.

I'm getting out before I get to the minimum effort mentality - but I can see it coming all too clearly.

For minimum wage I would do the job expected of me to the best of my ability

Cover or an extra 10 minutes here and there when necessary is fine but I do think that some jobs take the piss and expect you to be on permanent call on your days off and stay late on a regular basis with little notice for no extra money or perks

But as others have said if you don't pull your weight you will lose your job

I am lucky though that my pay (only do 4 hours) is not part of the household budget and so probably colours my view

Op why are you talking in one sentence cliches? I'd put my penneth but right now I'm questioning the motive of the thread.

I find the title 'minimum wage' is offensive in itself and implies for some what the OP has said. It needs changing but guess even then it will never remove the stigma.

Saying that, I agree that some people have a bad work ethic and it wouldn't matter what they were paid.

I'm low paid but love my job and give extra time for my own satisfaction of doing it to my standard. I live within my means - but my parents modelled this to me in my upbringing and I've found as the years go by this is dwindling - some of the younger generations increasingly don't have good work ethic/budgeting modelled and it affects their attitude. I'm lucky that I work with like minded people and it makes a big difference (small family firm)

It's interesting though that when you look at motivational factors, pay is one of the lowest priorities. As new staff join us they have often been better paid but prioritise 'nice' friendly colleagues, working atmosphere, a bit of flexibility when needed, responsibility at their pace etc

I wonder what some people's pay would have been if it hadn't been introduced, so think it's probably been introduced for the better in some sectors.

I also think it's relative too; you take a customer facing job then your 'basics' are smiling, being polite/helpful etc which your wage is paying you for. In something like 'warehouse' the 'basics' are completely different. On the flip side, I think the basics from an employees POV is respect, polite, good working conditions etc

I also think the old philosophy of cut your coat according to your cloth has gotten a little lost and what were considered luxury items of purchase are now considered by some, essential which impacts on wages needed. The last housing boom when prices went crazy is still impacting on people's lives.

There are just so many factors at play in defining the wage.

Don't get me wrong, NMW should be more, but for some small independent/family businesses it's already putting them at breaking point when you add in their rising business rates, utilities etc.

That is a poor attitude. But on the other hand I see your point. I can understand small employers paying minimum wage if that's all they can afford but large companies making a huge profit paying minimum wage then that isn't right.

Not all companies will put forward the employee who does the extra hours/top service/goes the extra mile for advancement and only give standardised references when employees move on.
They are not interested in you/your aspirations. Keeping a good employee in their present position makes sense to them.
They also know there are a queue of applicants for every job..

I work in a shop. When I started I was about 7p above minimum wage.

Not once did I think 'well why should I give 100% when I get bugger all back'. I was grateful to be employed. Because I showed to the company that I was willing to give my all I have my hours increased 3 times and then received a promotion which then doubled my hours again and increased my salary... In the space of 2 years. I have no doubt that if I'd have done minimum effort I would still be on the 8 hours I started on.

It is not, however, the type of shop that gets tidied after hours, or where employees are expected to stay after their shift is done or miss and breaks they have.

I think it would be a terrible attitude to live with, although I think that minimum wage should be a lot higher in the first place.

The other thing is the exploitation rife in mw jobs.

When I insisted on an increase to the statutory minimum holidays (having put up with much less for a long time) and had the audacity to get pregnant and take maternity leave in a previous job, the death knell sounded.

I managed to move on luckily before pushed/ jumped.

I could have taken action, but under the rules, an award from tribunals for mw jobs is tiny, therefore it was best to smile sweetly, acquire my references, and move on.

It's hard not to feel resentment.

YABVU. You go to work to work no matter how low your wages. Giving absolute minimum effort IMHO is immoral and incredibly unfair on your colleagues. Colleagues who incidentally are probably also on NMW.

I'll admit I have the odd moment where I wonder why I bother. That is more to do with being called a lazy idiot no matter how hard I work than the pay rate. However my conscience would never let me stop trying my best. I put in lots of unpaid overtime and push myself constantly. Morale is admittedly low but a manager just saying thank you or well done instead of slagging me off would have a much greater positive effect on my morale than anything else. Attitudes like your's OP make me very angry. It is people like you who allow others to justify the vile things that are said about all low paid people.

Depends on the job. I did minimal effort with mine because I didn't need to put much work in, it was un fulfilling, un challenging and repetitive. I could do it in my sleep. There was no chance of promotion or moving up so I just went through the motions and got paid.
If I was a carer or something I would have worked like a trojan.

You get what you pay for.

Small businesses often struggle even to pay minimum wage!
Wages bills are often the biggest outlay. When my DP had a restaurant he paid the kitchen porters etc minimum wage.
He worked there too and took home more money than they did at the end of the week...he also worked a lot more hours than they did (3x about 90 hrs per week) and if you worked it out he wasn't earning minimum wage. And he had all the responsibility of providing them with jobs, health and safety etc, etc.
His employees went home and forgot about work - he went home and woke up in the middle of the night having a nightmare that the restaurant was empty, he'd given someone food poisoning, infested with rats etc etc ...

He sold up and now works earning just above minimum wage ...comes home and relaxes....
To pay someone on minimum wage £7 an hour instead for a 40 hr week would cost the employer almost £1500 a year. (More if you take into account extra holiday pay, increased employers NI payments etc)
I'm sure for an employee that doesn't seem a great amount more... but if you are a small employer that all mounts up and it comes straight off your profit - which is your wages - for 6 employees that's a £9k pay cut for you...
For a large employer 100 staff £150,000, 1000 staff - 1.5million ...
That is just for a 69p per hour pay rise ....NMW to £7

Looking at the care sector - if you were/are paying for care - childcare for instance staff are usually paid close to nmw.
If your provider turned round to you and said your bill for your under 2 yo (1:3 ratios - so increase split between 3 parents) was going up by £500 a year to cover that 69p per hour rise would you be happy ????

Having said that I do think that employees should be treated well, you may not have the money to pay more but you can try and make the work as pleasant (and rewarding) as possible... valued.

big businesses, however, rub their hands with glee that there is a minimum wage....... to them it is more like "the only wage we will consider paying"

I would say that there are two main factors influencing the 'inadequacy' of minimum wage...
Housing prices -both renting and buying are so out of sync with earnings, should have been brought under control 10-15 yrs ago...

The gap between rich and poor - something that has been getting greater for the last 20 yrs or so. And the fact we are surrounded by 'aspirational' images ... designer homes, gadgets, flash cars, big tvs, designer labels - things we don't actually need and won't make us happier ...we just are forced to believe they will - and if we can't afford to update have the latest this or that we feel we are deprived...
If housing costs were reasonable, less consumerism then NMW would be liveable ...(and I think we'd all be more happy and content!)

I don't think NMW would be liveable even if housing costs were reasonable - my friends on that wage can't afford the dentist, no holidays, no gym membership to get fitter, no nice lipsticks - not consumerism just things that improve your quality of life.

It really depends on who you work for. If an employer treats you with contempt, clients treat you with disrespect, and there are no future prospects -- you shouldn't go and break your neck for it.

unlucky83 you have explained my last paragraph so much better!

angelos02 that's the point and part of the problem though; you really DON'T get what you pay for. Paying an extra £3,4 even £10 per hour more will not improve some people's attitudes or make them work better - been there with old colleagues!

Any job I have had - whether it be minimum wage or higher wage - I have always worked hard and done my best. I always do this so I feel like I'm doing well and making a little difference.

I do see what your saying though - suppose it depends on the individual

unlucky has it spot on. I have a very new and very small business and have just taken on my first employee. he works 2 days a week on NMW. I would love to pay him more, but I simply can't afford it. I pay myself much less than NMW once you take into account the hours I put in. I have only taken him on as I am 20 weeks pregnant and working 7 days a week (as I have been up to now) is not sustainable.

Im with shadowoftheday.
I used to work in sales, the more you sold the more you made. Absolutely worth putting in the effort.
Now, 3dcs later and despite management experience I am just another supermarket worker. Managers and customers speak to staff as though they are below contempt, the company pays peanuts and as there is no interest in your previous experience or skill set there is little opportunity for change.
I know that I will never progress with my employer because I am not afraid to seek out managers and challenge poor decisions. I am a union shop steward with no poltical affiliation, I am just sick of seeing the shitty stunts my management team pull on their staff- particularly the more vulnerable.
I now clock in ontime, expect to leave on time, spend 20% of my time helping colleagues and do what my contract states for the rest.
If you want me to put more in, look at my skill set and pay me accordingly.

big businesses, however, rub their hands with glee that there is a minimum wage....... to them it is more like "the only wage we will consider paying"

Some certainly do, but just as many pay over and above - they got to be big businesses because of the employees and know it....

OPs sarky little comments indicate a lot more minimum wage in their future to me!!!

I know a girl who worked in care and described it as "Wiping arse for minimum wage".
She left and is now still unemployed.

OP, this is soooo true, I love it, and must remember to use that analogy, as I am in minimum wage! haha!

My husband employs people on just over minimum wage,he actually "spotted" some of them with potential and gave them better jobs,i know not all employers are like that but some are and i think its worth trying your best as you never know,it might lead onto something better,and at least you will get a good reference.