to have let dd speak her mind to dp?

[MrsHamsterCheeks]

Dd is 7, dp has been around since she was one. Recently she's been really off with him - not wanting him to take her to school, hold her hand,read to her and so on. She'd rather miss out on doing something she enjoys than do it with him. He seems to just grate on her. For example, if her breakfast is ready I'd tell her so, if she didn't go to eat it within a minute I'd check she'd heard then leave her to it - her own fault if it goes cold, though 99% of the time she goes within a couple of minutes.

Dp on the other hand would tell her it's ready, then keeping saying 'come on, breakfast is ready' every twenty seconds until she gets annoyed or even try and lead her to the table. She is very headstrong and likes to do things on her own terms but he just doesn't seem to get her anymore. By his method she usually leaves her breakfast then he'll offer her something else, so it isn't that I'm pandering to her - quite the opposite.

Today dp took our dd (14 months) out for a few hours as I had some work to catch up on. He then collected dd from school and took her to the dentist. When they returned I had cooked tea, I washed up, tidied, sorted out school bags, bathed the kids, did homework with dd, read stories with them both etc. He watched football and/or sat on his phone.

When he heard me telling dd2 that it was the last story I heard him creep upstairs and go and sit on dd1s bed as she'd been playing in her room. When dd2 and I entered dd1 glared at dp and said: 'i don't know why you're pretending you've been playing with me, mummy knows you've been downstairs on your phone you know.' He mumbled something about tidying up and she started ranting about how he hadn't tidied up, or washed up, or anything else because I'd done it as well as everything else while he played on his phone

She then proceeded to tell him that all he'd done that evening was upset dd2 by making her have tummy ache because all he'd fed her today was two lots of chips and a packet of crisps and by turning off the iPad quickly when he heard me coming downstairs so I wouldn't know he'd stuck dd2 in front of igglepiggle 'yet again.' I honestly never rant to or about dp so this tirade hasn't come from me.

Dp looked shocked and had a go at her for being a 'completely disrespectful little madame' and turned to me and said 'are you going to let her speak to me like this?' Dd2 was then sick so I had to sort her out but I could hear her and dp still bickering. I put dd1 to bed and said we'll talk in the morning as dd2 is still being sick and dp gone to work.

Aibu to have let her speak her mind? I feel it might do her good to get it off her chest as the resentment has obviously been building but then feel I'm undermining dp. However, everything she said was true so I can't tell her off for that. Maybe just speak to her about voicing her opinions more respectfully?? What do you think?

Fill me in. I've never been know for my diplomacy, I could do with some help here!

What is the polite way to say "You're lying, I saw you do XYZ, you're not being fair to the others?"

What is the polite way to say "You're lying, I saw you do XYZ, you're not being fair to the others?"

I guess the polite way would have been to say 'mum, has only just come upstairs' or 'mum, that's not true' in a calm manner.

What's more concerning for me is this:

Recently she's been really off with him - not wanting him to take her to school, hold her hand,read to her and so on. She'd rather miss out on doing something she enjoys than do it with him.

That's ringing alarm bells, the reason for the sudden switch needs to be found and dealt with. The DD also needs to learn how to go about expressing herself, if she's tried to raise issues before and not been heard then something needs to change - children need their concerns to be listened to even if the result is that they are gently told that the issue is a matter for the adults to deal with.

Garlic,

Not sure there is a polite way to say it.

I think there are 2 separate issues here, one more important than the other, but both need to be dealt with. The first, and most important, is the issue surrounding family dynamics, and the fact a 7 year old feels that she has to take on a parental role- and her mother is happy about that. A 7 year old shouldn't have to feel that she should berate her father/step-father- her parents should be sorting that out between them.

The second issue, and less worrying than the first, is that the OPs DD has to be shown that losing your temper with people, shouting at them or berating people isn't the best way to handle any situation.

OPs DP sounds like a lazy sod, who needs to take a long, hard look at himself and the way he behaves around and towards his family. Lying in front of your children (especially when the child knows you are lying) is absolutely not on for me. When one parent is lying to the other parent in front of the child, that just makes it even worse. Very confusing and upsetting for a child.

In that context, I think the point about lying (and including her in the lie) was fair enough, as was her comment about being ignored whilst the OPs DP was playing on his phone etc. She was only expressing her anger at being involved in something she thought was wrong.

I think the way the OPs DD said what she said probably does need addressing though- note I said addressing, I don't think she should be punished. But she does not be helped to understand why berating her step-father in the way she did wasn't the most acceptable way to behave. I can accept that on this occasion the poor girl just lost her temper. She's human, we all do it.

Overall, OP needs to help her daughter by being the parent her DD clearly wants and needs. She also needs to address her issues with her DP- either agree to work on sorting the problems in their relationship and family dynamics, or go their separate ways.

Interesting that OP declared she was going to talk to the partner and has not been back since.

OP, if you're there, when you were spending the 3 hours doing all the housework and childcare while your partner sat around, why didn't you ask him to get on with some of it? Or is that your daughter's responsibility, again?

oh so it's her fault he didn't do anything because she should have asked him to? and her daughter should have directed her criticisms about him at her mother 'mum, he's lying' rather than say to him, 'you're lying'...

so basically mum is responsible for everything then? facilitating everyone's relationship, doing the housework or asking someone else to do it, dealing with a puking baby AND dealing with her dp and dd's relationship issues at the same time and generally jsut everything ergo everything is also her fault.

blimey.

and actually when a grown man is lying and sneaking around and trying to force a little girl to be complicit in his deceit and hide things from her mother shouting is a GOOD thing. it's a damn good survival skill and one many an abused child could have benefited from.

If the girl is utterly refusing to deal with or listen to the OP's dp, then I guess yes, it is mum's responsibility, in this instance, TheHoneyBadger. I don't see who else's responsibility it can be, in these circumstances.

Just to be clear, I don't think everything should always be the mum's responsibility.

and her daughter should have directed her criticisms about him at her mother 'mum, he's lying' rather than say to him, 'you're lying'...

I was just responding to a question about the more polite way to state the problem, not that it would necessarily have been the right way under the circumstances. The DD has not been listened to in the past, I don't blame her for exploding this time...but that is not to say that exploding is generally the right way for a child to communicate issues to the adults around them.

The OP's household seems to have a lot of issues in need of urgent resolution!

not saying that it would

Precisely Andro, if dd isn't listening or communicating efficiently with the op's dp, surely there is no-one else to address the situation. There really is no issue of equality in gender!

SDTG: "I have a flexible mind - I can handle the 'contradiction'."

But whether you can handle it is neither here nor there. The fact is that people are criticising the OP for two contradictory reasons - for allowing her DP to behave badly (as if a grown man can't take responsibility for his own actions) and for allowing her daughter to criticise her DP for behaving badly. How is she supposed to square that particular circle?

No, HoneyBadger, I am not saying it's all her responsibility. But I am asking why she stayed silent instead of telling him to pull his weight. That's not because he should have to be told what to do, either, because he should know. But why would you stay silent and by doing so imply a) to him that you are fine with him sitting on his arse and b) to your daughter that you don't feel able to challenge it? I would feel embarrassed that a seven year old was capable of this (however rude etc) when I wasn't. The OP seems to expect her child to take on adult responsibilities. I am asking why she as an adult didn't do so herself.

Well - she could square it by telling her daughter to speak more politely to adults, and by dumping the dp, hackmum. Or by telling her dd that her tone was unpleasant, and not a polite one to use with an adult, but she is glad that her dd has told her the truth, and then talk to her dp about the issues that the dd raised, before deciding whether there is any hope for the relationship.

See - not difficult.

Has the DP really done anything that bad today? He took the children out for four hours!

Are you joking?

God, this thread.

I'm not sure where so many of you have gotten the idea that I'm 'revelling' in dd having told dp off. Frankly I'm upset that it had to come to her losing her temper, which she has never done before. I'm not using her as my spokesperson - I've addressed these issues with him myself and am more than capable of doing so.

Totally agree with everything HoneyBadger has said.

With regard to breakfast - my approach has been the same since dd was small. I wouldn't have strapped her screaming into a highchair and forced her to eat then and I wouldn't manhandle her to the table and force her to eat now. He has seen my approach resulting in food being eaten as dd knows no alternative will be offered yet has decided, without discussing that he may disapprove of my way, to do the complete opposite which results in food not being eaten and him offering alternatives which is undermining both me and himself.

I only got to page 3 but no-one else has spotted this: the DPs reaction to the child's confrontation, which was to turn to the OP and ask her if she was going to let the child "get away with speaking like that?" Nothing to stop him addressing the issue directly with the child - or is there? Just saying that's an odd reaction. To be more concerned that the OP isn't saying something to dd than he is with the content of what dd is saying. To assume this is "rudeness" rather than something that he might address himself. Fits the picture of dp as infantilised, OP as ineffectual.
Has anyone suggested doing a "phone-free Saturday", starting tomorrow! Dp to give his phone for one day - for Lent!

As the step parent forum Will revel in telling you it is nota step pparent's job to parent a step child (I personally don't agree) so it very much depends on the balance of the relationship as to whether the op allows her dp to discipline her dd

So if you are more than capable of raising the issue with him, OP, why didn't you this time, instead of carrying on with all the housework and the story reading and so on? Does he ignore you when you do that?

The 7 year old sounds like she has no respect for your partner and rather bratty. If I'm watching my kids do something I'll often partly read a book or something depending on what the activity is . Adults are allowed free time and don't have to be slaves to the kids. It's unclear how much time to yoursleves you get or whether you expect all activities to centre around the children. Would you be upset if your partner is playing on the phone (although you said he was sitting on his phone which didn't sound very good for it) and not entertaining a child who shouldn't need constantly entertained. Is he ever allowed to say "no" when your daughter wants entertaining? Many biological father say no they're too busy (as do many mothers).
Household tasks should be shared but its up to you and him to negotiate this, the kids shouldn't be dragged into it and told not to get involved.
If you allow your daughter to come between you then the relationship won't last, but it doesn't sound as though you love and respect him and allow him to make his own choices re parenting so it doesn't sound like you'd be too sad if he goes.
Hard to know if he's being lazy or if you never sit down and do stuff for yourself but constantly run round after the kids so resent it if he does.
If you aren't happy with the relationship you need to sort it out, but your daughter shouldn't be criticising. That will only make him feel less like doing stuff with her. You and your daughter v him will just lead to a separation.

I think absolutely spot on rebecca.

rebecca does seem to have nailed it.

Whoever thinks it's OK for a 7 year old to chastise one of her parents needs to have a good long hard think about their own family values.

Sounds like your family is not a team, try and work on that.

rebecca - unparenting is not making a parenting decision it's just neglect and laziness and refusing to deal with your children's needs.

presumably she carried on because shit needed doing.

and oh my goodness we're now congratulating men on having their own children for 4 hrs????

caruthers anyone who has cause to be chastised by an angry neglected 7yo needs to rethink their parenting imo - neglecting and rejecting a small child for long enough that they become fearless and desperate enough to explode is a sad state of affairs. so is lying blatantly to and in front of a child and expecting them to suck it up.

OP - what will you do? it doesn't sound sustainable tbh. does he even acknowledge his lack of engagement and how hurt dd is?

But honeybadger she is not his dd so he may not feel it is his place to discipline and as I say above, the step forum would agree and tell him to disengage and leave it to mum to sort her child out