WIBU to berate the Christians who insisted on giving my ds a pamphlet?

[HarrietSchulenberg]

In Chester this morning. Only nipped in as I had an eyetest but H and dses wanted a quick nosey round town. A large group of middle aged and elderly Christians were singing and leafleting in the middle of town, which is fair enough: live and let live etc. First time we walked past H and I said polite "No thank you"s when offered leaflets, as we are Atheists so really had no want or need of them.

Second time we walked past them they offered leaflets again. We are quite a distinctive family so I'm sure they remembered us from earlier, but thought they'd try again. Firm "No thank you"s from us again but two of them started pushing leaflets at Ds1 (13) and 2 (11). Ds1 ignored them but ds2 took one to be polite. Luckily they didn't try ds3 (6) but mainly because he was on the other side of H so they couldn't reach him.

We started to walk away but then I realised what they'd done. So I went back and told them not to give leaflets to my children, just adults, and us adults didn't want them. First man smiled and said, "It's OK, Jesus loves you": cue curt declaration of my atheism and another request not to target children.

Second man repeats, "Jesus loves you" mantra at which point my politeness vanished and I might have bellowed something about pixies in the sky and not preying on the vulnerable. And walked off while they were telling me again that Jesus would forgive my sin if I would just admit what I already knew ( ) and believed.

Only to be approached by a third man round the corner who also seemed hell-bent on giving us leaflets. He also insisted on telling us that Jesus loved us and also told me that Jesus cured his alcohol addiction, at which point I gave a loud snort, told him to back off and rounded everybody up ready for home.

And the leaflet? Tells us that we are all sinners and in debt for our sins (what sins has an 11 year old committed other than the occasional nocturnal raid on the biscuit tin?). But the debt "must be paid ... to have any hope of heaven". And then a lot more about believing in Jesus and a contact address for a free New Testament on the back.

H and ds2 think I should have just binned the leaflet and walked away, but ds1 agrees with me that such blatant attempts to indoctrinate need to be challenged, even if it does mean a "scene" in the street. So, WIBU or is it OK for people to peddle religious twaddle directly to children in the middle of a busy city on a Saturday morning?

If you want to pray in Church, Mosque, Synagogue, Temple or in front of a Shinto shrine in your spare bedroom go for it. Enjoy it and the comfort it brings you.

If you want to give out leaflets to children telling them they are going to go to hell then you can take a right royal FUCK OFF! from me.

You we not being unreasonable.

OP, YANBU. Once anyone stops carrying out their faith privately and tries to impose it on my family, I would tell them exactly what I think of their medieval superstitions. If I could get a word in edge ways for DS (8) - he's a much more militant atheist than me . I am v proud of him.

As far as I know the main faiths all rely on methods of conversion of others, ie non believers. I'd include atheism there too personally.

They couldn't continue if that wasn't a tenet of faith could they? You can't just rely on popping enough babies out can you.

I'm willing to be educated if I'm wrong by someone knowledgeable. Not just sarky comments.

We are atheists, I'd find this kind of approach annoying but not threatening. Dcs hear about sinners at school, they hear about God at school during assembly...it's funny how my dcs don't believe but they accept the school brain washing at the same time and I think this is the bigger threat, nutters on the street don't get through to them at all.

Actually, I was a terrible door-to-door seller of potatoes (of all things!) as an impoverished student, because when someone said: No, we don't want any thanks, my immediate reaction was fair enough, I'll fuck off then.

I just don't get how you can wave tea-towels/mediaeval superstition at randoms in the street...& not understand that a polite no, followed by a firm NO, means that if you then shove the unwanted whatever-it-is a third time at the person saying no thanks, you are likely to get a robust response & have only yourself to blame.

& that's before we allow for shoving it at children whom we, as a society, want to be polite in their dealings with adults.

It's an utterly twattish thing to do.

Atheism is not a faith - it's the opposite of faith. It has evidence and critical thinking at its core. If there was robust evidence for a supreme deity tomorrow, all the atheists would convert.

And unfortunately I'd have reservations but I wouldn't stop the church of satan any more than bnp. I'd rather educate around it.

Well ok it's the anti faith ;) just everyone I've ever met exhibits strikingly similar traits to those who are deep in religion.

Many faiths (maybe not those you would consider "main") don't go out and try to persuade others that they are wrong, and that your faith is the one "true" one.

Yes of course they (mostly) accept converts, however they don't go out of their way to tell people they are wrong and will "burn in the fires of hell for all time" if they don't change to what they consider to be the only right path. Please don't suggest that wouldn't be said by a Christian, it's been said to me before. And before you ask no, I am not a Satanist despite being told that by definition if I don't worship the Christian god I must be worshipping Satan. This has been told to me a number of times by people who have ruined otherwise perfectly good evenings by spending it trying to convert me and persuade me I am wrong "because God loves me".

A lot of the times that people convert, it's not because they've been shown the "error of their ways" but because they no longer believe in the doctrines they were brought up to believe. So instead they search for something that does fit in with their personal beliefs, and convert to that.

Well I'd argue that there's many branches of Christian too and some I'd definitely see saying that and some would be horrified.

About the only Faith I'd envision not to be too argumentative might be Buddhism. I could be way off the mark tho.

Sikhism makes a point of not actively seeking (excuse the pun!) converts. I think Judaism is the same. Most neo-pagan groups don't seek converts either.

My dh is Buddhist. His lot definitely don't chase converts.

I'm an atheist, & I don't either.

I've got a good friend who does reiki on small pet mammals as a cottage industry. Given that it's not actually harming the gerbils etc, her woo is her business. I'm perfectly woo tolerant right up to the leaflet-shoving stage.

Would the YABU religious folk be happy if I gave their children leaflets stating 'There is no God, it's all a load of rubbish, don't go to church as its full of ignoramuses' . Despite you politely asking me not to?

Interesting. I'll look further. Thank you.

I was a bit suspect about the blooming buses, again, I'd just educate around I guess. Free speech I support....ish

And there you have it: Free speech I support, totally.

It's very rare for these street preachers to be reasonable. I once tried to speak to some and they wouldn't engage at all, which really makes you wonder why they bother. Unless it is viewed as just some duty they need to do. Another time I tried suggesting that saying the homeless are "on the streets due to their sin and will continue to suffer until they repent" etc etc was pretty much the antithesis of what Jesus was saying. I got called the Antichrist in return. It really isn't worth trying to speak to these sort of people. (I'm an evangelical Christian btw).

People who thrust unwanted leaflets at others, people who so easily resort to telling others to 'FUCK OFF', thank god for internet shopping!

I think the reaction to the situation was over the top. Ideally you don't let these situations rattle you to the extent of making a scene.

People with tables on the street pushing their thoughts is intrusive, be it religion, chuggers, political parties etc. the general public should be able to walk by without physically being interrupted.

Leave people be, while going through to town. If someone wants more info - they will stop and ask.

I didn't rant! I support free speech, in fact there is another preacher in the same city that I totally respect as he preaches his beliefs (somewhat loudly) in the presence of people who openly mock him. I've told my children off before now for sniggering at him and explained that he is very brave for standing up, week in week out, to talk about what he believes in.

I usually just smile and walk away when accosted by those with religious fervour in their eyes. I just detest people who prey on the weak and the vulnerable, which is what these people were doing by shoving indoctrinatory leaflets into the hands of minors.

Meh. I don't know. It's in bad taste to give leaflets to children but it's kind of nice of them to spend their free time trying desperately to rescue you and your family from the certainty of eternal hellfire.

I'm an atheist but I love this stuff and always end up talking to these people. The crazier the better.

I think it's important for kids to be exposed to all different viewpoints so I probably wouldn't mind myself. If it had big pictures of aborted foetuses or something I'd be pissed but if it's just pictures of Jesus and some sheep etc then that'd be okay.

Is that the man outside WHSmiths OP? He's always so cheerful, even when he's being heckled.

I've only ever been approached by Christians trying to convert me & telling me my religion was wrong. Yet I have friends who are Christians who would never dream of that. I wonder if it depends on the church they go to?

It's a cult in my opinion if they push leaflets at you, preach in the street or knock on your door trying to convert you. A polite no thank you is all that's needed and if the fail to heed that, well I can be far less polite about it.

YABU. It's just a piece of paper and some people advertising. No different to any other advertising leaflet really, whether it's for mobile phones, pizzas, yoga or anything else they claim you need.