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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To be offended by being asked to explain why I didn't change my name when I got married

115 replies

takingnoprisoners · 20/02/2014 18:44

In order to do some voluntary work!!
I filled in all the forms and took in my passport and driving license to show them and told them then that I chose to keep my name when I got married. It was a part of my identity that I didn't want to change and as it turned out was the right decision as the marriage didn't last. We are not officially divorced so I am technically married. I am quite cross about being asked to explain this again, I really don't see what business it is of theirs.
I didn't realise I was being particularly radical by doing this, I guess I am more of a feminist than I knew!

OP posts:

HazleNutt · 21/02/2014 09:44

While I'm Ms myself and didn't change my name, I think you are reading too much into the question. As I read the email, I don't think they want you to explain the reasons why you chose not to change your name, they just want to confirm that what you wote on the forms is correct and not a mistake. So I would simply reply: "That is correct, I did not change my name when I got married."

TheRealAmandaClarke · 21/02/2014 09:52

The convention is to marry. And to change your name when you do so.
So it's understandable that they would ask.
And it's obviously fine that you didn't change your name.
But it isn't really "odd" or surprising to be asked for a maiden name and totally not the same as changing your name to your DH's first name.
That is not a convention in the uk.
I think YAbu to be offended tbh.

HairyWorm · 21/02/2014 10:00

I agree with previous posters that they are just asking for confirmation that married and maiden names are the same.

I would respond with a short confirmation of the same. If they come back wanting to know why then you have full reason to respond accordingly.

I have also been asked why I would get married if I'm not going to change my name. I even get post addressed to Mr & Mrs (DH's full name) from people who know I haven't name changed!!! After I got married some colleagues asked (more than once) what my married name was, so I looked at them with a puzzled expression and said 'Hairy'.
I really don't understand why it's such a big issue for other people whom it doesn't affect in the slightest.

HoneyandRum · 21/02/2014 10:06

DH and I both changed our name to one on the maternal side of my family.

HazleNutt · 21/02/2014 10:19

People need educating though that no, you don't have to change your name (as many believe it's the law) and that you can call you Miss, Ms or Mrs, whether married or not and whether you changed your name or not. I have heard of some places having forms where, if your title is Mrs, you must have different current and maiden name, otherwise computer says nooooo

Oldraver · 21/02/2014 10:29

I reverted to using my maiden name (with a Ms rather than Miss) after being Mrs Married name for years. If I'm asked on forms any previous names I obviously put my Married name.

People do seem rather socked I'm 'allowed' to do this

VulvaBeaker · 21/02/2014 10:48

RealAmandaClarke - I agree, well put. It is like having a slightly unusual driving license, or spending Scottish money outside Scotland. Once in a while, someone is gonna ask.

Oldraver - just interested, you are saying you retracted the name without divorce?

ComposHat · 21/02/2014 10:54

Vulva you don't have to retract anything. You can call yourself whatever you like so long as you are not attempting fraud (ie. pretending to be David Beckham so that you can get a Lamborghini on credit)

You may have to produce a paper trail to prove who you say you are. I assume that oldraver has her birth certificate, plus exam certificates etc. issued in her old name.

philomenascat · 21/02/2014 10:54

In the UK we can change (or not change) our names any time we want. There are no forms to fill in or permission to be granted by some public body. (That is, as long as the intention in not to commit fraud).

philomenascat · 21/02/2014 10:55

cross post-ComposHat

VulvaBeaker · 21/02/2014 10:57

Compos I'm aware of the legal side of it. If you look, that isn't what I asked. You can subsitute another word for retract if it seems unclear. :)

DebbieOfMaddox · 21/02/2014 11:00

Have just realised... DH has kept his name, and is using the no-indication-of-marital-status title "Mr". That means he's pretending not to be married, doesn't it? The bastard...

I bet it's the CRB thing. Their computer flat out will not accept that you can be Ms and still have your original surname. You just can't save the record that way, even though the fact that this is simply wrong has been pointed out to them for years and years. There will be something it doesn't accept in your combination of features, too, so the group you're volunteering for will be failing to get a CRB check for you/getting the form rejected.

ComposHat · 21/02/2014 11:10

Debbie I agree it is absurd that the CRB computer system can't accept the name 'Ms' and 'Married' but in the op's case it would appear that she'd put her birth surname down and her title as Mrs.

Whilst anyone should be able to use whatever title they want, I can see why that would cause questions to be asked at either the voluntary organisation end or with the CRB. It implies there was a Mr birthname to whom she was once married, in a way that using Ms doesn't.

vulva yes two people in my social circle got married became Mrs Hisname, thought better of it (no problems in the marriage) and then decided that they were happier as Ms Birthname and reverted to that name.

ReadyToPopAndFresh · 21/02/2014 11:33

That's ridiculous yanbu.

LurcioLovesFrankie · 21/02/2014 11:34

Actually, just done a similar CRB form on line (to go on school trips with my son)... I am a single parent, never married. I think there was some sort of question (can't quite remember) where it asked how long I'd used my current surname (despite me having already checked boxes saying that I had never been married and had never changed my name). Ignore the rest of this paragraph if you're not interested in why computer based forms often end up throwing up a shitload of really stupid questions: I put it down to crappy use of logicals by whoever had written the underlying computer program in the first place (I write a lot of code for my job). They'd got as far "most married women change their name on marriage, so I'd better make sure the form deals with this" and written an "If married then ask about previous names" question, then simply hadn't followed through the logical possibilities carefully enough in order to avoid repeating the question.

Having said that, the fact that at no point was I asked to explain my lack of name change suggests to me that the charity in question is asking stuff that goes beyond legal requirements and becoming intrusive.

Depending on how arsey you feel, I'd go for one of:

Please tell me why you are asking.
Because I chose not to.
Explanation of your own personal beliefs. (Were I in that situation, mine would read "Because I have had this name for nearly 50 years, my whole identity, professional papers I have published and my professional standing are connected with this name, and I don't want to lose that history; and also I can't separate the idea of changing one's name from an outmoded patriarchal view of marriage which sees a woman as becoming a man's property on marriage. Other women may not be bothered by this: that is their choice. I am bothered by this: therefore this is my choice. Live with it or find someone else to volunteer their services, free of charge, for your benefit."

ReadyToPopAndFresh · 21/02/2014 11:35

BUt yes, go with Ms.

Your marital status has fuck all to do with anyone besides you your husband!

Been a Ms since I was a teenager, am a married one now

DebbieOfMaddox · 21/02/2014 11:39

Mmm, but historically with the CRB just clarifying that, yes, what you have put is correct and that you are indeed Ms but not divorced, or that you are Mrs but haven't changed your name, makes no difference - they can't accept that that's what you've done even if you swear a stack of affidavits in front of a High Court judge and the Archbishop of Canterbury while strapped to a polygraph.

Effectively some numpty has programmed their computer system with a bunch of hard-core and inflexible rules for marital status / title / surname combinations even though the UK has no such legal rules.

I think the OP is BU if she is offended to be asked (because Mrs Originalname is an unusual combination to go for). But I also suspect that if this is a CRB issue then she hasn't heard the last of it by a long shot and is NBU to be passed off by that (and if she switches to Ms, as she says she is going to do, it still won't accept that she's never changed her surname).

DebbieOfMaddox · 21/02/2014 11:45

Lurcio, are you a Ms? Because if you are then they've relaxed their data verification rules (hurrah! And not before time...)

If you're not, then you'd probably have found it a lot more tricky getting the CRB to accept the form if you had been.

whatever5 · 21/02/2014 11:47

The whole title system is outdated and absurd full stop though. I have friends from the States who think it is ridiculous that we have to use a title or computers say "no". They apparently don't have to do that.

I never use a title if I can help it.

jellybaby25 · 21/02/2014 12:06

LurcioLovesFrankie YES!!

jellybaby25 · 21/02/2014 12:11

I hate having to give a title. Men do not have to do this. Ergo this is sexist practice.

If people ask, "is that Miss, Ms or Mrs?", they are effectively asking if I am married and making a judgment, whether that be a conscious judgment or not. (XX years old? Unmarried? What's wrong with her??)

Even choosing to use 'Ms' is not a solution. It implies either divorced or never married/choosing not to be a Miss. Again, effectively forcing the user to reveal their marital status.

I always refuse to answer the title question. Or ask the man asking me if he is married or not.

LurcioLovesFrankie · 21/02/2014 12:14

I can't remember exactly what I put - I suspect either "Dr" - I try to use this as often as possible because it's not gender or marital status specific, but I have to admit I may well have used "Miss" precisely because I know how crap the computer coding of these systems is (and because much as it pisses me off to use this, I also tend to go for the "pick your battles" approach, and in this instance, just getting a form to keep DS happy seemed more important than insisting on "Ms" - I'd probably have insisted had it been something important like a bank account or insurance or mortgage). Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa, I confess to you my sisters, that I have been a bad feminist .

whatever5 · 21/02/2014 13:03

The system won't change until married women start using "ms" instead of "mrs." I find it a bit ironic that the OP herself changed her title to "mrs" because she "wanted to be seen as more of an adult". If women didn't have that attitude the whole ridiculous title system would probably have disappeared long ago.

whatever5 · 21/02/2014 13:05

Even choosing to use 'Ms' is not a solution. It implies either divorced or never married/choosing not to be a Miss. Again, effectively forcing the user to reveal their marital status.

Ms doesn't force you to reveal your marital status though. I am married and I use "ms".

ComposHat · 21/02/2014 13:11

I agree whatever I assumed the misconception that Ms was a title for divorcees went out with the ark.

I would assume that the woman in question had decided that her marital status is absolutely no one else's business.

For this reason, my wife was Ms Hername before she married and has remained Ms Hername after we got married.

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