to think that people with asthma who smoke are selfish?

[quaginty]

People with bad asthma/copd/other lung conditions who cost NHS hundreds of pounds for treatment then fuck up the treatment by smoking.

Wonder why they feel shit then go have another fag at the hospital door then back up for more meds!

What they could do, mellow, is back right off with the proposed medical regulations for ecigs. If those go through, ecigs will be rendered about as effective as other forms of NRT - which has around a 93% failure rate at 6 months (there's a reason they only publish success rates for the four week mark)

What they could also do of course is ban smoking altogether, but - oh dear! Smokers are such a fantastic source of govt income.

Unless I heard it myself I wouldn't believe any GP would advise that smoking is good for asthma, I know several people who would claim their GP told them it was, 2 different things

having smoked half my teeth out and given myself an early menopause

Does smoking really do that to you as well?

Don't forget that, if the children of smokers are more likely to smoke themselves, there are a helluva lot of smokers caring for elderly smoking relatives.

In my case our parents smoking did an extremely good job of putting both me and my sister off smoking.

Thankfully, smokers are a dying breed. Literally.

Wow happy that people are dying nice. I suppose it is ok to say though because they are evil smokers who bring it on themselves.

Do you want to pop over to the brave babes thread and tell them that thankfully they will die from Cirrhosis so not to worry?

MIL smoked all her life. She'd stop for a couple of months and then get so ill with Bronchitis, pleurisy, pneumonia or similar that she would start again - and sure enough her symptoms would go and she'd feel 'healthy' again.

Finally after a really bad illness that had her hospitalised for over a month, she kicked the habit completely.

Within a year she was diagnosed with Emphysema (sp?) and COPD. 5 years on and she is attached to oxygen for 16 hours a day. She remains convinced that if she had continued to smoke that this wouldn't be the case.

It's hard to debase her of that view, when everything points to her being right. She doesn't leave the house now, sleeps on and off throughout the day. Is hospitalised every few months. Bruises and infects at the drop of a hat (or stub of the toe). Can't even shower without SILs help.

DD remembers the nana that smoked like a chimney but went swimming and climbing with her in Cyprus - only 5 years ago. Such a difference and terrifying that she'll tell people that smoke "Don't you stop, I was OK till I stopped"

Maybe OP your 'friend'/patient/family member/whoever is SCARED to stop because they've heard so many bad things about people who get worse when they do.

Feel very sorry for addicts whose habit it making them I'll but they can't stop.

My BIL has asthma and heart disease. Still smoking. :-(

Feel so sorry for SIL too.

LtEveDallas my mum's last few years of her life were like your MIL's, but she continued to smoke.

It is true that immediately after giving up smoking your lungs want to clear themselves of all that muck, but in your MIL's case too much damage has been done. Her health would be the same if she had continued to smoke.

Oh I'm sure you are right bunbaker, but there is no point telling her that. She seems strangely 'happier' with her view. She knows (knew) lots of people that died of cancer only after stopping smoking and that doesn't help - she caught DH reading the Alan Carr book and immediately jumped on the fact that he died of lung cancer...but she was genuinely terrified for DH, not trying to make a point.

It's horrible.

If you have children and refuse to attempt to give up smoking, that's selfish.

Yes it is an addiction; addictions make people behave selfishly.

YANBU.

I am not sure it's that they can't stop tbh.
I think an awful lot of the illnesses mentioned in this thread are caused by poverty, lack of life opportunities and choices and lack of education.
I spoke to a gp once who called it "shit life syndrome" - patients with long standing depression, mh issues etc for whom smoking or over eating or drinking or substance abuse is their only reason for living.
Desperately sad.
And these people are in need of compassion, not judgement.
My family all smoke, always have done. I am a fanatical anti smoker.
My mother has had several health issues due to her smoking, the last of which was a heart attack and a femoral bypass. My sister is 38 and has just been dx diabetic.
They finally stopped smoking last October...but not until my beloved dad dropped dead of a massive heart attack.
I would beg any of you who smoke and have children to please think of them. Performing CPR on a parent is devastating and I will live with the guilt and heartbreak foe the rest of my life.
Contact the NHS for info on giving up. My mum smoked for over 40 years. If she can do it, anyone can.
Good luck x

"I think an awful lot of the illnesses mentioned in this thread are caused by poverty, lack of life opportunities and choices and lack of education."

That wasn't the case for my mum. She came from a well educated well to do family, and was very highly educated herself. I think in her case she grew up in an era where everyone smoked. So for anyone of that generation it is more understandable.

What I don't understand is why so many young people start smoking these days when everyone knows how bad it is for you, and has known for a number of years.

Apparently smoking is at a 20 year low...let's hope the downward trend continues!

I think asthmatics who smoke are insane. MY DD has asthma and the thought of her smoking makes my blood run cold. When she is bad, just walking past the crowds of smokers who congregate doorways makes her chest tighten.

My sister's FIL smoked even though he had emphysema and continued smoking when reliant on oxygen canisters. Hell for his poor wife.

Yes, it is an addiction. Which means, sadly, only the addict can actually do anything about it. If they take the 'I'm an addict, so it is not my fault' approach they never well. The first step to be beating an addiction is owning the responsibility for it. No, it is not easy, but it is possible.

Pointless to ask a simple question on this site - full of sarcastic smart arses.

Does that statement include you the chocolate?

YANBU OP.

So smoking is an addiction ? So what ? Deal withbit and stop inflicting misery and despair on those around you who are watching you kill yourself. But of course, the horrific, lingering deaths won't happen to anyone screeching on this thread

Anyone can give up smoking it's just hard. I managed after 20 years, even kept it up whilst sectionned on a psych ward where smoking and doing jigsaw were the main OT activities . People always find an excuse: mental health, poverty etc but at the end f the day you can do it.

My main motivations were watching my dad lose 2/3rds of his teeth and my MIL have a horrific stroke at 52, both down to smoking.

I find it very hard to believe that anyone on this thread could read PlentyofPubeGardens post and still be a complete and utter wanker towards people with an addiction.

Still plenty of new names for the 'unlikely to ever post anything even vaguely interesting' spreadsheet I suppose.

Roll on 'hide poster'

Bunbaker - What I don't understand is why so many young people start smoking these days when everyone knows how bad it is for you, and has known for a number of years.

I think it's the addiction message that isn't getting across. Nobody starts smoking thinking 'I'll smoke 20 a day for the next 40 years', they think they'll just smoke a few to impress their mates and they'll stop when they want, before it does them too much damage. It's not until they actually try to stop they realise just how addicted they are.

This is where I think the 'smokers are just selfish and could stop if they wanted to' argument is incredibly dangerous and destructive. If that were true, what would anyone have to fear from smoking a few fags in their youth?

This is the kind of info we need to be getting across to youngsters (from page 15 of this paper):

ADDICTION IN ADOLESCENCE

Only a few exposures to nicotine are required to produce neuroplastic changes in adolescent rats, and in adolescent humans, only a few cigarettes are required to produce symptoms of tobacco dependence.

In the largest study of adolescent addiction to smoking published so far, 7,482 adolescents interviewed at 14 to 15 years of age, had rapidly become addicted to smoking, as judged by symptoms of loss of control over their smoking.

Addiction is assessed by questions on symptoms of loss of autonomy over smoking (the Hooked on Nicotine Checklist or HONC), validated against brain scans. We found that:

• One quarter lose some control over their smoking after smoking only one to two cigarettes.

• Forty percent lose some control after smoking one to nine cigarettes ever.

• At 10-19 cigarettes ever smoked, half reported some loss of control over their smoking.

• Of those 14- to 15-year-olds who had ever smoked 100 cigarettes or more, half had high scores for loss of autonomy (7 to 10 out of 10 on the HONC scale).

• Most of these 7,482 students had not smoked 100 cigarettes or more in their lifetime, but of those who had, 93 percent had diminished autonomy over their smoking, as measured by the Hooked on Nicotine Checklist (HONC).

Adolescent addiction cannot be dismissed as trivial, something they grow out of. It is intense, and in the majority who become lifelong smokers, it will shorten the lifespan of two-thirds of them, and markedly affect their lifetime health status.

Thank you LtEve.

Thank you Plenty. It sounds like more education is needed.

Thanks funnyfoot - proves my point.

Lighten up chocolate and remove that stick from your bum

Just because we became addicted as children (11 here) dosnt make it impossible to stop. In fact by giving people excuses (for me it is lifelong mental health problems ) why they 'can't ' quit is just enabling them.