To wonder why women continue to bash each other over the SAHM/WOHP thing

[happyyonisleepyyoni]

I'm sick of hearing women justify their own life choices by bitching about others. It's nasty and low.

Can't we give each other the benefit of the doubt and accept that in the vast majority of cases, people do what they think is best for their families-whether that means staying at home or working. There is no moral right or wrong here.

The End!

[Abstractingplay]

I'm breast feed ds (18 months). I am also working p/t .

[Abstractingplay]

*Feeding

[encyclogirl]

wordfactory God knows. She has no clue what our lives entail, but for some bizarre reason she has a major issue with the concept of me not working.

I think she thinks I'm Sheryl Sandberg material because I've always worked in the corporate world. Also she has no faith in her own sons abilities, (he's a great earner but in a blue collar type role).

She's an oddbird for sure.

[Joysmum]

I can hand in heart say I've never critisised or questioned the parenting or work ethic of another mum.

I find it enough to explain my situation and how things work for us, as well as highlighting the downsides. I really do struggle to see a need to wonder about anyone else or comment on them. I don't have a lot of respect for anyone that does this, be they in paid work or a SAHM.

[Abstractingplay]

Anyway, I'd better get off this thread now as I want to now play with my most favorite people in the world .

[TwittyMcTwitterson]

Boooo to all of you leaving the thread to play with the tiny ones! im at work... one boss left in air ambulance as he had heart attack and the others on holiday! im stressed and hungry! i want cuddles with DD...

im definitely jealous!!!

[Abstractingplay]

Oh, just before I go. I absolutely think all families should be able to organize their family life in a way that suits them. That would be fab and nice. That's also not gonna happen anytime soon.

I just think it is ridiculous and presumptuous to say that sah mothering is superior to a scenario where both parents work. It is not so, obviously.
Anecdotal: many sahms have the tv on a loT or are on MN a lot during the day in order to get stuff done or downtime.

[usuallyright]

I think people need to ignore the opinion of the interweb on this subject. Whenever wohm vs sahm comes up on mumsnet, the same posters pile in with long annoyed posts made over several hours. The only possible reason to devote so much time to disagreeing with others and ramming home your own opinion is that you've got festering doubts about your own life, insecurities about the way you do things, jealousy, worry, anxiety. Years of watching these debates and I'm 1000% convinced this is the reason people do it.

[LadyInDisguise]

What I found surprising is another thread on here for 'high power mums' ie mums who are working with a very high salary.
Advice fur those women were about splitting the work with the dad so that they don't do all the pick ups and dropping off, having the best childcare and not to assume that you have to take the whole year off or return to work within 2 weeks.
Now I have no issue with any of this advice but I was surprised that these women though it was specific to them and their situation. And I think it's telling if what society expects women to do ie children are the Mum's responsibility and if you work you should always put them first, which in turns means lower paid lob, more difficulty on carrying on with a career. It's there everywhere. From the assumption that it's the mum who takes time off when the dc is ill to the way school expect you yo be able to juggle a different pick up time at 2 days notice.

Women are still trying to do both all the caring work (or as much as they can if at work) whilst working which just doesn't work. Even if you are working in childcare and have your child with you, clearly you won't be able to give them as much attention.

So YY to a society that us treating men and women equally re education if the dcs means a society where that sort if dilemma doesn't quite exist. But to do that we, as women, will need to accept that dad can be as good as us to look after young dcs.

Now, where are all these unicorns? I want some too

[LadyInDisguise]

usually does you MN name means that you have to be right though?
Goes grumbling after a long post.

But you are right. The more people shout about these issues, the more insecure they are about it.
Or they have been battling so much with them that now they have found what is working for them they find the need to shout about it.

[usuallyright]

Lady, I'm thinking of changing it to alwaysright!

[handcream]

Just chipping in here. Some people have lower aspirations than others (I dont mean that negatively btw!). My DSIS wants a lower paid admin type role where she shuts her office door at 1700 and comes back in not worrying about working until 0900 the next day. I earn three times what she earns but I pay the cost, long hours, demanding role where your brain is frazzled at the end of the day.

I wanted to educate the DC's privately, we wanted nice holidays, I wanted to not be completely dependant on my partner (50% of marriages end in divorce) and the only way we could do it was by both working. Some choose to have the mother stay at home. Well, hopefully it will work out but we have to bear in mind. All these people not working - someone is paying for that and paying the taxes to educate their children and give them access to the NHS. And not necessarily your partner btw as someone told me on another thread.

[Philoslothy]

The thing that I find most concerning is that so many men do not have the chance to be fully involved in the lives of their children.

There is a thought provoking theme in Rebecca Asher's Shattered which highlights how men are often very subtly sidelined from their children's lived even before they are born.

A poster above said that her husband could be at home but he is just not of the right temperament . This is not a direct criticism of that poster but a reflection that if the vast majority of men are not of the right temperament to be at home for extended periods with their own children - we have got something very wrong. I say that as a woman who has spent many years out of the workplace at home with young children whilst my husband worked long hours to support us. I say that as a woman who is planning my next long term break from the workplace . Yes my husband can't breast feed but there have been times when I have expressed milk and gone to work . My husband could have stayed home with our child then - but I don't think we even discussed it.

I have been so lucky to have had magical years at home with my children , how sad my husband never did.

[mummywithsmiles]

the only thing i find annoying is people who think a couple is ok to have a stahm but a lone parent should go to work.

[sadbodyblue]

I can't bloody wait to hand in my notice now. cut my hours after having worked ft for years.

seen my older ones through uni, cost us a fortune, and the dds say they don't want to go to uni as have different ideas.

can't bloody wait. dh more than happy for me to do so.

[MrsMagnificent]

Well I'm a lone parent and I work through both necessity and choice. I don't have a lot of money but working allows myself and DD some luxuries.

I don't think there is anything wrong with a LSAHP but I think it would be quite lonely sometimes...

[MrsMagnificent]

I do also think the LSAHP argument strays more into the 'befits argument' than it does the actual SAHP argument.

[MrsMagnificent]

Benefits*

[ThinkAboutItTomorrow]

Mummywithsmiles I don't suppose they are saying one is 'ok' and the other isn't. Presumably the challenge is about who pays. So if the parents fund a choice it is quite a different thing from expecting the rest of society to fund the choice?

So a single parent staying at home funded by the NRP wouldn't be questioned. But a single parent staying at home and having this choice subsidised by the government is a different matter.

But I'm with you in that if the state subsidy in childcare / tax credits etc was likely to be the same whether a parent stays at home or WOH (because it often would be given childcare costs) then it is of course just as valid a choice for a single parent as one in a couple.

[oliviaoctopus]

dietcoke - No you cant do those in most trades but you can in mine. I was just answering the q of saying that I personally do both roles. There are other tradea you can do it in as well.

I was doing remote telephone lines from home where a person rings the switchboard and it is put through to your house phone and you sort out problems for them. Eg a carpenter needed in bristol, an engineer needed in scotland etc. You cant do it in all trades but there is always a way to find work if you need some with or without childcare.

[oliviaoctopus]

Im very glad things have changed, and continue to change for a more equal society. I am looking forward to seeing the working world and families in 20 years when mine are older.

[oliviaoctopus]

ladyindisguise - I pay attention to them at work but at home I dont. They are dragging themselves up most days as Im on my phone, and cant say bothered about it

[Naicecuppatea]

Not sure if it has been mentioned on here, but what really really gets my back up is when SAHMs live within a shoestring of a budget (when it is not necessary) and view all family money as the father's to do with what he likes as he has earned the money. Staying at home raising children is a full time, unpaid (and hugely important) job equivalent to going out to work and bringing in money and any SAHM should not have to beg for money for this and money for that whatever it is for within reason. I have several friends in this position and I cannot believe it.

[morethanpotatoprints]

Naice

I really don't understand this neither.
Surely, when they decide to have a sahp this is discussed.
We decided from the off set that I would be a sahm because it was what we wanted as parents. It is usually a joint decision and I can't understand why people don't consider it family money.
If you truly love each other your relationship shouldn't be based on who earns the money.
I manage our finances and have a right to the same as my dh, he wouldn't have it any other way.
Perhaps the people who need their own are insecure, selfish, or controlling.

[mummywithsmiles]

i understand that lstahp get funded by the goverment but they still deserve a choice like anyone else im sure being isnt there choice.