In assuming most men going on holiday alone to Thailand, are going to have sex with prostituted women or men?

[Grennie]

It is estimated that about 1% of Thailand's GDP is earned through sexual exploitation tourism.

In 2003 (the last year for which full figures are available) some 545,000 British residents arrived on visits. If you remove the children, and the British citizens visiting for business or reasons other than a holiday, you arrive at about 489,000—314,000 men and 175,000 women. That is 139,000 more British men than women coming to Thailand for a holiday—a gap of 28 per cent.

In no other international holiday destination, is there such a big difference in the number of women and men travelling there. There is no obvious reason for this apart from prostitution.

Pigs while I don't disagree that the Thai govt can and should do a hell of a lot more to sort out this hideous 'industry' I think we all have a responsibility too... look at the number of naysayers on this thread. Thailand has a massive, exploitative sex industry funded in the main by Western men - who must all be coming from somewhere right? So why are so many people keen to suggest that single men of a certain age travelling to Thailand are off to look at the temples. Where do people think these men are coming from?

Greenie, have you ever been to Thailand?

Naysayers? I can't see people saying its not a problem. I can see people saying that its not most men, there is a difference between patterns of travel for men and women and that many men go to Thailand for completely innocent reasons.

My objection to the thread was not that there no problem, but the horrendous sexism displayed by many on the thread and the fact that there perceptions are distorting their view of men.

Yes there is an issue, but you need to get that into perspective too. It does not help the average person in Thailand to polarise perceptions too much, otherwise you end up with a situation where it becomes a destination ONLY for the sex trade. Like I say, women make decisions over holiday destinations too, and less women visiting because there is a fear about how safe they may be/or whether they will witness vile things makes the difference between male and female visitors worse - with inevitable consequences. Equally male visitors may be put off for fear of being incorrectly labelled as a sex tourists.

Normal tourists, help to stop the problem from becoming worse. It creates a certain amount of pressure to improve the situation and it brings in much needed income.

If you want to have an intelligent debate on the subject, then get rid of the prejudices and actually get to the bottom of the problem starting with honest and realistic assessments of the extent of the problem, who is engaging in it and whats making it worse. This also includes positive representations of visitors to Thailand, what attractions other than sex the country has and why they don't indulge in the same things.

I did say earlier that I'm sure Asia is beautiful, but my overriding impression is of sex and sleaze and that's what I think when I think of Asia. Sad but true.

If any of my male relatives went there as single travellers, I'd have a very low opinion of them as I really do think that's what pretty much all male travellers go there for.

Just my opinion and all that...

Define Asia. India,Nepal,China etc

We flew to Bangkok a couple of years ago and the men sitting around us on the plane on the way out told us they went out each year for the women and had bought a holiday place there for that reason.

On the way home we sat next to a 92 year old Yorkshireman who had just been to choose himself a new wife after his wife of 60 years had died.

Truly eye opening. However, there is a big distinction between seedy Bangkok and places like chiang Mai, where the sex trade is frowned upon (as it should be)

"I did say earlier that I'm sure Asia is beautiful, but my overriding impression is of sex and sleaze and that's what I think when I think of Asia. Sad but true.

If any of my male relatives went there as single travellers, I'd have a very low opinion of them as I really do think that's what pretty much all male travellers go there for."

Asia is a continent. A massive continent. If you had a low opinion of a male traveller because he went to Asia alone - well you would have a low opinion of pretty much every lone male traveller.

Red I completely agree wrt Thailand needing 'normal' tourists to redress the balance and of course part of that 'normal' tourism shouldn't involve Ping-Pong shows or whatever - the stuff at the 'tourist' end of the spectrum which funds and contributes to the overall issue.

But it is not sexist to say this is a trade fuelled by Western men, the majority of whom travel there alone or with other men, and it is a large-scale and continuing problem. The numbers are crude, yes. It would be infinitely better if we could link to a firm report with exact numbers (I did try googling but clearly didn't get my key words right and didn't really like the look of anything that came up!).

I suspect that's one of the areas where the Thai govt could actually do some real good - firm research into the numbers of sex tourists and their country of origin. UK courts will prosecute for overseas peadophila iirc.

"But it is not sexist to say this is a trade fuelled by Western men, the majority of whom travel there alone or with other men, and it is a large-scale and continuing problem. "

No - that's true.

But it is sexist to assume most single men go there for sex.

It is absolutely not true that Thailands sex industry is mainly funded by Western men. In fact the vast majority of sex transactions are between two Thais.

The people equating Asia, with half the world's population, with some sort of gigantic sex supermarket are just staggeringly ignorant.

Why is that assumption sexist? The sex trade in Thailand is geared more towards men. Similarly, I would find it hard to believe that a single woman going on holiday to the Gambia hadn't chosen the destination at least partly with sex in mind.

Bluestocking

Do you assume most men on holiday in Thailand are there for sex?

It's like saying most black men in London are in gangs.

It's not at all like saying most male black Londoners are in gangs. They haven't chosen to be black, male, or in most cases to live in London. I honestly can't think of a single reason why a man would choose to spend time on his own in Thailand except for the cheap, easy availability of very young, compliant girls and boys. And yes, I have been to Thailand.

Travelling maybe?

It's what backpackers do. Like in Nepal, India,China,Malaysia, Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia.

It's called travelling. Seeing new sites, beaches, culture, experiences.

Or are men not into that and it's all about sex?

I mean it's not like there's anything else to do in Thailand.
Apart from magnificent beaches, temples, the Hill villages, the hills, the food, the culture, diving, watersports.

No - nothing to do there.

Ok, let's make a distinction between a lone man who is travelling/backpacking through Thailand as part of an Asian itinerary, and a lone man who has travelled specifically to Thailand as his sole destination. While the first man may well sample the sex trade, the second is almost certainly there primarily for the sex. But how would we ever find out accurately? Very few men would proudly declare to a clipboard-wielding consumer survey person that they were sex tourists.

I'm interested to know why you have such a stake in it. Are you employed by the Tourism Authority of Thailand?

I don't like sexist remarks. Do you like sexist remarks?

Nice to see you've bothered to clarify your statement.

But you can get all those things in other parts of the world. Thailand's USP is its sex industry. I think you're being wilfully naive.

what a stupid comparassion. you do not choose to be born the colour you are but you do choose where you go on holiday

having been to thailand a few times and travelled around i would say the majority of men travelling alone or in groups will be using the sexual services on offer if they are not they will certainly be pestered to in many resorts but of course they can make the decision to do so or not

i meet a few guys out there (travellers) who were quite open about it one guy had fallen for one of the girls she was reluctant to have sex with him at first he soon found out why (his words her smartie tube was odd, he needed to go home could not get his head around it all)

I think that the statement that "most lone men on holiday in Thailand have sex" is wrong. You've made the effort to clarify that.

I made the comparison because it's making a general statement without facts and based on prejudice.

Which some people on here are full of. Judging and prejudice.

It is not sexist to say this is a trade fuelled by Western men.
No, it isn't.

To those repeating "Don't judge if you haven't been there" ... I judged because I went there. I am not the first or last to do so, by a long way. As I've posted, I was very experienced around sex tourism but still Thailand shocked me. And I was not in a 'fleshpot' destination.

I also wrote that I resorted to paying women to sit with me - a middle-aged woman - in the evenings, so as to ward off the constant barrage of propositions. I therefore regretfully contributed to the sex trade, for my own sanity. My presence certainly didn't help to mitigate the problem!

It's strange how this topic always brings out such anger against those who acknowledge the problem for what it is.

To clarify: I am not judging Thai sex workers; I'm judging the nice, normal, Western men who readily exploit them.

"It's not at all like saying most male black Londoners are in gangs."
I made this point up the thread but,
I'm sure we can dig up statistics that show that a lot of immigrants do a lot better on our benefit/prison system than they do in their own country

But we would be told that we are wrong to make assumptions.

I live in an area that mirrors "benefit street", but if I used subjective antidotes, I would be told that I was wrong, because our own experiences are not proof enough.

Yet it's fine to assume anything concerning men on MN.

Yes, Sex Tourism happens, but making assumptions about people is wrong.

It's called bigotry and ignorance.

This thread is provoking a lot of anger!

Is it because the people saying of course a lot of men don't go for the underage prostitutes have a vested interest? Maybe wanted to show this thread to their other half and say...

'See, told you I didn't go there for that!'