to think that only people who worship Christ should have a church wedding or baptism

[HollyMiamiFLA]

And that those people who are not Christians but have a church wedding are just doing it because they want to be the centre of attention in a lovely white dress, to walk down the aisle with music playing and that all that stuff the vicar says about God etc is irrelevant because they don't actually believe it but they're going with the flow and it's traditional.

AIBU to think it's a facade - vicars go along with it because it keeps the church going, couples go along with it because it's tradition and they can ignore the religious stuff and true Christians probably get a bit annoyed but accept it?

Well marriage is the most bizarre institution. We couldn't have gay marriage because the religious people were against it. Now we can. Gay people also have civil partnerships. Straight people don't. OK you can get married without mentioning God in a registry office but the people that pull the strings and ultimately make decisions about who should be allowed to marry are religious leaders. None of it makes any sense to me.

I think they should turn marriage into a state legal thing and if people want God involved then they can do that.

Let's face it the Church has a monopoly on the best and biggest venues, with the best acoustics, the best locations in the country. It also has a monopoly on the best MCs. I think they ought to be a bit more mercenary and charge more for non-believers and teach their 'MCs' to do humanist or non-religious ceremonies. It will keep them busy and bring in the revenue to support their rafters or charities.

I agree with you OP that it is wrong to say words you don't mean, especially at a commitment ceremony. Very very wrong and if it was a court of law you would be deemed an unreliable witness or something.

I suspect that removing the requirement for baptism on school places for many state funded schools would have a marked impact on the number of baptisms.

I suspect that removing the requirement for baptism on school places for many state funded schools would have a marked impact on the number of baptisms.

I know someone who got married in Westminster Abbey. They definitely did that for the pictures. I know this because the reception ended with the bride tantruming over her new husbands cocaine use.

I believe that churches and chapels belong to all of us whose ancestors gave their time and skill to build churches, and indeed anyone who is part of the community. I understand the culturally Christian idea, and I love what calloh said.
However, I could never be married in church. I think it is deeply hypocritical to make those beautiful solemn vows in the sight of a god that you don't believe exists. And if DP were to say those vows, as an even more devout atheist than I, I wouldn't believe him and I wouldn't feel married.
I'm actually baptised into the Methodist faith BTW, so should really marry in a chapel. Both my sisters married in our local C of E church and one sister has had her DC christened. I am also a godmother and had to really think hard about it. I eventually decided that I was content to be responsible for his spiritual well-being, whatever that means to him as he grows up.

My parents are very religious, my fiancé and I are atheist. My parents were very disappointed we refused to get married in church but I explained We felt hypocritical if we did. They let it drop but are still disappointed.

DM said she would save some of our wedding cake for first child's christening. Gently explained to her our children would not be Christened into a faith we do not believe in. Cue a massive argument about tradition etc. said not up for discussion and that if we did anything would be a secular naming ceremony.

I got married in a Church because it was a nice building and happened to be close to the reception. Neither my husband or I believe.

The vicar is a close family friend and I suspect (given the time that I have known him) that he doesn't (although he has never come out and said it) believe in God either.

YABU. It is a building up for rent. A straightforward commercial transaction.

The service was 20 minutes, no prayers and no hymns. Job done.

I don't think the mosque analogy works. In Britain it's Christian culture that's ingrained into our society, it's well known that churches will host a wedding to raise funds and even the tiniest villages have churches.

It's rare to find a mosque out of a large city and, at the moment, the Islamic culture is still relatively removed from our own society as that merge just hasn't happened yet: they don't have the influence in British life like the church does.

You could pose the question to atheist sons and daughters of muslims I suppose, as that seems to be a reason atheist brits wed in churches - for family. Maybe in 50 years it'll be different and we will see brits marrying in mosques and synagogues and temples - assuming they are happy to operate in the way that the church does (ie, for cash).

FWIW I am a non practicing Jew - nonreligious sons and daughters of practicing Jews frequently marry in synagogues in my circle and out of it. I wouldn't but I don't care if others do - it's not my marriage.

When I got married in a Catholic chapel, the priest did not ask us for money. The chapel is in a pretty poor area, so I'd imagine he'd have a lot of couples unable to stump up hundreds of pounds just to get married. He said it was our (well 'my,' really, as I'm the Catholic, not DH) church, so he wouldn't ask for cash from us. We gave him £250 anyway, because we could afford that, he is a great person and I know the money would be put to good use in the community. We never had to do a wedding 'course.' The priest just gave DH a book called So I'm Marrying a Catholic (for real ) and told him to read a chapter.

It was all very inclusive, and everyone felt welcome. There was no mention of DH not being Catholic.

I admittedly don't know much about how the CofE and CofS operate. Because they're more linked to the state, is it seen as more acceptable to get married in one of their churches if you're not religious? As I said, DH isn't Catholic and I hardly ever attend chapel (but feel my faith has real meaning in my life), but we never felt any hostility towards us getting married in the chapel. Would non-believers generally think it stranger to marry in a Catholic chapel than a CofE/S church?

I know plenty of (cultural but not religious) Jewish people who get married at temple with the whole traditional ceremony for the sake of tradition rather than have a civil ceremony. I also know quite a few Muslim women who have had Mosque cermonies despite being quite dubious on what was being said.

This isn't a Christian-only thing, it's a whichever-culture-you-come-from thing, it just so happens that the predominant religious culture in the UK is Christian.

If you want to be married in a C of E church and you either live in the parish or have a qualifying connection to the parish then you can. There is no quiz about where you are on any faith journey you are on although there will be prayers and some mention of God in the talk that the vicar does. Part of my return to Christianity and then ordination came from meeting really kind people at the wedding preparation sessions we went to before our church wedding. We were not regular attenders at the time.

We don't get many weddings in my church as although we have a fine old building people seem to prefer to get married in hotels where all the facilities are onsite. We get loads of baptisms which we don't charge for and as far as I'm aware non of the local schools have baptism or church attendance as a criteria for admissions. Must be cos the local clergy are just so nice

We do charge for funerals but I think we are comparable with the independent celebrants.

I was asked to be a godmother to my friends two children. They weren't religious themselves, not sure whether they believe in god or not, (they probably aren't sure either way, much like myself) but that wasn't the point of the service.

It was to get all the family together and celebrate the children, and have a 'do' afterwards.

I did feel uncomfortable at the service. I did not like saying the words, repenting the devil etc. I do think it very hypocritical to say those types of things about god and Jesus when you don't 'believe'.

However I think YABU. For many reasons already mentioned.

I am atheist (as is my husband) and we never contemplated a church service. I feel it would have made a mockery of both our wedding vows and those of couples with genuine faith/religion. I think it insults people of faith and of none. Christian marriage is a three-way affair, with God at the centre - I can't imagine promising that in my marriage ceremony, I may as well have made promises to Santa. How can I derive meaning from (what I believe to be) meaningless words?

However, I appreciate that there can be particular circumstances that make a church marriage the favourite option for some couples (family church, relatives buried there, etc). I would also not argue against people of undetermined religion but definite faith getting married in any church - basically, in my book, you need to at least believe in god/s.

I don't agree with any kind of ceremony to bring a child into a particular religion.

I think along the same lines as you.

Am an atheist myself and would absolutely hate the religious aspect of a church wedding, so prettier photographs or not, it's a no.

So YANBU.

Fact is a lot of people have church weddings, not because they believe but because the photos are prettier.

I suspect that removing the requirement for baptism on school places for many state funded schools would have a marked impact on the number of baptisms

And don't they know it. A very canny way of keeping the stats on CofE affiliation up.

Went to a christening once where the vicar did a fire and brimstone service basically slamming the hatch match and dispatch brigade. Put me right off ever returning. Seems people have very different views on what makes a Christian, and what is classed as Christian behaviour.

WWJD?

lol custy.

custardo

At school, we had to go to the Cathedral every week. But we could not go when Songs of Praise turned up as it was unusually full.

I don't think you have to attend church to get married in one, plenty of people have faith outside church and some sort of belief.

It's people that have no religious beliefs at all that get married in a church who I don't understand. They do it because it looks pretty on the pictures. I don't understand saying your vows to a God you don't believe in. Makes no sense to me.

There are plenty of beautiful civil ceremony venues to choose from. I loved ours.

The vows I made in church were not to God but to my husband and were declaring my love and devotion to him. If I'd had to make vows which were religious based, not love related then I wouldn't have done it, just like I refused to 'obey' much to the amusement of everyone who suggested that my DH should include the word 'obey' in his vows to me

The service itself was no more than a presentation and service for God and the context of marriage for those who believed. That was for the benefit of my husband, his parents, my grandparents, his grandparents. I like it that it added to the experience of others who are important to me as I can appreciate that we all have differing views and different things are important.

To me, the service aspect meant as little to me as having a fruit layer on the cake! I don't like fruit cake but appreciate that others do so why the hell not? I didn't order a layer of fruit because I liked it, I didn't have make a promise to have fruit cake in my life, I didn't have to make a promise to have God in my life so there was no problem for me in compromising. I'd have preferred everybody to share my views but they don't and I respect that.

I'm an atheist so got married in a register office. I didn't want a ceremony that was important to me to be overlaid with lots of religious mumbo-jumbo I didn't believe in. That was before the legal changes came in which meant you could have legal wedding ceremonies in hotels etc - we might well have done that instead if it had been an option at the time.

However, there are plenty of people who vaguely believe in some kind of god, even if they don't normally attend church, and if they want to get married in church, according to the laws of the country - with the Church of England as an established church - then they are entitled to do that.

Interestingly, huge numbers of people in Japan opt for a 'Christian' wedding ceremony even though only a tiny proportion of the population is actually Christian, just because they like the 'romantic' image of the church, white dresses etc. So to supply that demand, lots of hotels have built 'chapels' which are not consecrated and are only ever used for weddings. The ministers/priests who officiate at the ceremonies are quite often moonlighting English teachers who have no religious qualifications at all - just because having a foreigner to conduct the ceremony is seen as more authentic.

Meanwhile, there is also a growing trend (possibly anime inspired?) for foreign couples to go and get married at Japanese shinto shrines. I'm guessing they don't believe in shintoism either, they just like the image. Each to their own. At least it is a matter of personal choice.

Apparently I would not be able to get married at all in some countries (Israel, Lebanon, much of the middle East) because I am atheist, and they have no provision for civil marriage.