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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Is my dad or my dh? And am I for even asking?

256 replies

inabitofadilemma · 03/02/2014 00:28

I'm in a bit of a dilemma.

Me and DH have been together for 14 years, two kids and one on the the way. We jointly own our house. Originally, we both put in savings of about 30,000 pounds as a down payment. We did well from selling and buying at the right time and renovating a run down house and took advantage of low interest rates and paid down the mortgage. My Dad gave us 40,000 pounds a few years ago to help with mortgage and renovations. Currently our house is worth about 400,000 and we have equity of 200,000.

My Dad is now wrapping up and selling his business so he can retire properly. He's done very very well out of the super high prime London prices because his business had some real estate there. As a result, he's offered to help us pay off the mortgage and upgrade our house because it'll be tight with the third child. Altogether he's offered to give us 350,000 pounds. This is, of course, a huge amount of money and will allow us to buy a bigger house mortgage free. I'm fully aware that this is very generous and we're incredibly lucky to be in this position.

However, he's stipulated a condition. Only my name on the house. He's willing to sign an agreement that DH can have 'his' share plus whatever it's appreciated in the event that we divorce (and if I die that it's in the name of the children as a trust) BUT the house MUST be in my name.

My Dad says that this is to protect me. He does actually really like DH, it's not like they've ever had any issues. They get on really well. But he says that things can change. His biggest fear is that we divorce (or I die), DH gets remarried and half of the money he gave to me ends up with another woman and her children.

DH is incredibly insulted by this especially because he always got on with my Dad. He says he will feel uncomfortable living in a home that's not his and he's very upset. We've never thought on these terms, always had a joint account and apart from the money my Dad gave us a few years ago, it's always been kind of even. DH works less than me and earns less but he's with the kids more so neither of us think of our money other than as joint money. We had a joint account before we even got married.

DH is kind of angry with me for not fighting his corner more. But I feel bad fighting with my Dad when he's about to help us out so much, I feel ungrateful doing so like some kind of spoilt brat. I totally get where DH is coming from but I also understand my Dad's reasoning. It's just how he is (he's lived with his partner for 20 years and in his will, he's very very clear about what she's entitled to and what she's not - and it's not much - in fact, I had to tell him to change it to leave her more!). My Dad is also helping my brother out in a similar way with a similar condition but they don't seem bothered by it.

So who is being unreasonable here? My Dad who is insisting that only my name is on the house? Or DH who feels hurt and insulted and thinks i should be fighting his corner more?

We could, of course, turn down my Dad's offer. We're also happy as we are, can make mortgage repayments and pay our bills just fine and carry on in our house, we'd just be a bit cramped. So it's not like we NEED this to just survive. But then i think that might be unfair to the DC because this is really THEIR money at the end of the day. And it's very hard to turn down the tempatation of a bigger house and being mortgage free.

OP posts:
Notmadeofrib · 03/02/2014 10:35

The trust would also ensure blood line inheritances.

Headagainstwall · 03/02/2014 10:41

Hello

If the house were solely in your name, if you and your DH were both to die, then wouldn't the kids be a bit stuffed because of inheritance tax?

If your assets are split between you I thought that you could sort of halve the inheritance tax.

Altho I haven't completely woken up and DD is talking & talking. Christ someone make her stop.

HamletsSister · 03/02/2014 10:45

I think it is less about divorce and more about death. If you died, he would get the house and could do with it as he wished. Why not put your "share" of the house in a will so that it is left to your children directly, not to DH. That way it is protected by will.

Polyethyl · 03/02/2014 10:45

I will be eternally grateful that my father once financially protected me by taking the long view, recognising that things change and keeping the money in our name.
His pragmatism and protection saved me when a completely unexpected disaster struck.

Your husband needs to be more emotionally tough. Love and respect is one thing, money is another.

43percentburnt · 03/02/2014 10:49

Your dad is being totally reasonable. If you split your husband would potentially get at least 50% maybe more. If you died and he remarried then he died and the will wad invalid your kids could end up with nothing.

Your dad is very sensible. He must read mumsnet!

Many ladies do not fight for their entitlement in a divorce for fear of upsetting/an easy life. Your dad is protecting you and the GC.

If you are not planning on splitting your dh gets to live in a fab house forever mortgage free!!! I would be fine with this.

nauticant · 03/02/2014 10:52

Why not put your "share" of the house in a will so that it is left to your children directly, not to DH. That way it is protected by will.

But in this case, this would trigger the payment of inheritance tax, and this could be a sufficiently large amount of money to force the DH and the kids to sell the house.

nauticant · 03/02/2014 10:54

If you split your husband would potentially get at least 50% maybe more.

What if he would need this to adequately house the kids and be a proper father to them? What if a split is caused wholly by the OP and not by the DH?

EasterHoliday · 03/02/2014 10:55

Your dad is being perfectly reasonable with HIS money. The question is whether you wish to accept it on those terms. If of course he really wants to protect it, he should give it to your children and their names go on the house deeds as tenants in common in whatever share it represents.

Pigsmummy · 03/02/2014 10:57

If I were your DH I wouldn't be looking a gift horse in the mouth and be very grateful for the legacy that your children will get from this.

MimiSunshine · 03/02/2014 11:05

The thing is from your DH point of view he is probably thinking "i've been with DW for 14years, we have 2 DC and 1 on the way, but her dad clearly doesn't see me as family after all this time, AIBU to think her dad is doing this on purpose?" And really who would suddenly agree to come off the deeds of a property after all this time, for all he knows you could leg it 5 mins after signing and leave him with nothing.

I cant believe any woman would be advised to go along with this plan if it was reversed.

You need to find a way through it or don't accept the offer. So look in to putting the £350k part of the house in the DCs names (a trust maybe - not sure if its possible) and the £200k part bought with your equity in both your names.

Or just say thanks dad but no, this has already caused problems in our otherwise equal relationship so we'll carry on as we are thank you.

Primrose123 · 03/02/2014 11:06

Sorry OP I haven't read the whole thread, but something similar happened to me. When my grandmother died, she left everything to my mother, but told her that she wanted to pass on some money to me to help with our mortgage. It was a much smaller amount than you are talking about but the principle is the same.

A sum of money was used to pay off some of our mortgage. DH and I both own the house, but the agreement is that if we split up and sell the house, I get back the sum of money from my grandmother and we split the rest fifty fifty. This has all been done through a solicitor, and DH was fine about it. There is no bad feeling between my DH and my parents, in fact I think they prefer him to me sometimes! It was more to protect our children. Could something like this work for you?

TheZeeTeam · 03/02/2014 11:10

I think this is bonkers! Your Dad wants you to sell the house that you and DH both own and then buy a new one and not have DH on the deeds?! So, DH loses the part ownership of his own home and has his relationship with your Dad shattered to boot.

Personally, I would be pointing out to Dad that you're a fully functioning adult and don't need him protecting you anymore. I'd rather have the vague, hypothetical possibility of getting screwed over for some money in the future than shatter perfectly good relationships.

WholeLottaRosie · 03/02/2014 11:20

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IshouldhavemarriedEwanMcGregor · 03/02/2014 11:23

Don't think it's bonkers at all...I think your father is probably right to do this. His terms are not spiteful but practical and pragmatic.

And as others have said - it's his money and he can insist on terms that obviously mean a lot to him.

I really think you and your dh should think of it like this - whichever way you look at it your husband is better off with you accepting these terms. He gets to live in a bigger house, mortgage free and his children are well looked after in the future. You are married so he is protected and has rights to 50% (as a starting point) of your marital assets whether he is on the deeds or not.

If he (you) turn this down because of hurt feelings or principles, frankly you are insane.

IshouldhavemarriedEwanMcGregor · 03/02/2014 11:27

To the people up in arms about the dad's term...I don't know how old you are or how long you have been married (or not).

But now that I am in my late 40s, I have seen several 'strong, happy' marriages disintegrate.

Half of the married women posting on Mumsnet will end up divorced.

I think the father is being sensible and very caring and loving towards his daughther and grandchildren.

littlemrssleepy · 03/02/2014 11:27

Hmm. I don't think I could do that to my DH. Why should only 1 name be on the house deeds when your DH has also invested savings and presuming contributed to the mortgage on your current house? If you were just moving in together and your DH was not contributing anything then I can sort of see it, but I'm a bit bewildered at your father's suggestion. My understanding is that any assets acquired after marriage are joint.

We own a rental property that is 90% in my name as my DH is a higher rate tax payer. However, solicitor made clear a court would actually split it 50/50 in the event of an (acrimonious!) divorce.

littlemrssleepy · 03/02/2014 11:28

Of yes, tennants in common might be a way round it to deal in the event of your early death (sorry..!).

MakesAMessWhenStressed · 03/02/2014 11:30

hrm. I have to say, if my parents offered us a huge amount of money I think it would be DH pushing to protect it as 'my' money in the future, but that's just how he thinks and is possibly more financially protective of me as I am a much lower earner than him. I think maybe your DH is being a bit touchy here... but it's your relationship. I can sort of see it from everyone's POV

Asheth · 03/02/2014 11:46

If I was in the position of the DH I would not sell my home to live in a house that does not belong to me. Effectively all the pressure would be on me to behave perfectly, while DP could behave as badly as he liked, smug in the knowledge that a divorce would see me lose my home. (I'm not saying you would do this OP! Grin)

I think if your DH wants to make the money yours (and that's fair enough) then he should give it some other way - a trust, a lump sum to be infested, a rental property which can provide an income for you both while the capital remains secure etc. That way the money can be dealt with unemotionally. But when it involves the family home I don't see how you can avoid the emotions creeping in.

Brucietheshark · 03/02/2014 11:56

I can completely understand your Dad, but doubt that having just your name on the deeds will make any real difference.

There are loads of possible scenarios in which your children would end up with less of an inheritance. What if he remarries after your death and then suffers from dementia? I know that sounds daft but it is exactly what happened within our extended family. The new wife got everything after the man died and then her sister (who we barely knew) got everything after her death. A family home dating back to the 1800s gone in the blink of an eye.

cheeseandpineapple · 03/02/2014 12:01

Owning property as tenants in common means the property belongs to you jointly but you also own a specific share of its value. You can give away, sell or mortgage your share. If you die, your share of the property passes to the beneficiary in your will.

www.landregistry.gov.uk/public/guides/public-guide-18

WholeLottaRosie · 03/02/2014 12:12

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Suelford · 03/02/2014 12:34

I have seen women advised here on MN to never, ever, ever agree to move into a new house with their DP without getting their name on the deeds. Apparently that goes out of the window if the genders are reversed.

Bue · 03/02/2014 12:48

There are a lot of very idealistic people on Mumsnet.

I don't think they would be feeling so idealistic if it were they whose ex-DH were to walk away with half of their father's 350K...

Not saying that is going to happen, but statistically, it is a reasonably likely scenario.

pist · 03/02/2014 12:51

Your Dad is being sensible, but it's a difficult one for your dh too.
Definitely contact a solicitor and check your options. As far as I remember there are different ways of jointly owning a property: a sort of "our shared house option" and a "this is my part this is your part" one.
There may also be an option of dh holding a share of the house in a deed of trust and/or include him as joint owner at a later date.

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