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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To ask if you think that Knox is guilty?

656 replies

superstarheartbreaker · 31/01/2014 22:08

I have no idea but it seems that her kissing her boyfriend at the time was seen as suspicious whereas I don't think that this is suspicious at all. DNA is...kissing one's lover.no. It's not even that inappropriate to kiss ones lover in the face of tragedy.
Didn't she do cartwheels though?

OP posts:
RonaldMcDonald · 03/02/2014 01:09

Yes, I do.

AchyFox · 03/02/2014 03:16

It will be interesting to see the court's reasoning in the latest decision; I think they've dug themselves a fair-sized hole.

Having seen the interviews with AK, I am more convinced that she is entirely innocent, and thus of RS's innocence.

DrankSangriaInThePark · 03/02/2014 06:22

Tinpotted, there are 1,000s of pages of court transcripts on the internet from the case.

Do UK courts publish court transcripts? Genuine question, because it's not something I've ever looked into. The Italian ones are all out there though, pdf format.

Sorry, can't remember the poster saying that for 4 yrs AK/RS didn't have a voice- I actually can't think of a week went by when their lawyers weren't on various (and many) Italian chat shows/Crimewatch type programmes speaking for them. Ditto the Sollecito family. Seriously, we heard plenty from them during those 4 yrs.

Rudy Guede's sentence IIRC was so short (and the Italians are horrified about that too) because he confessed. I believe that happens in the UK as well? 'fess up and get a reduced tariff?

And, as I said, before, before RS starts mudslinging about the authorities, he might want to remember his sister volunteering to contact an important politician she had "helped out" in her role as police officer to resolve RS's problem.....

The Italian system is corrupt. No doubt about it. But the people now whinging about it were happy enough to try and wangle it their way when it suited.

Disclaimer: I don't know if they are innocent or guilty. Because I am just a MN poster with no vested interests one way or the other but have followed the case (perhaps with a slightly smaller bone between my teeth than others Grin) In fact, I veer more towards their innocence than their guilt but sweeping statements from MNers (some of whom I refuse to believe are not heavily involved in the AK is innocent groups (which is fair enough, but I do wish people would be honest about it)) on both sides of the fence that I'm sitting on get a bit daft and make some of you sound, frankly, a bit obsessed.

DrankSangriaInThePark · 03/02/2014 06:24

And as for Maxine Carr. Well, yes, she wasn't in the county when it happened. But she helped him get rid of the bodies and lied for him, did she not?

She has served her sentence and is now living a new life. Justice to Maxine Carr has been served.

But her involvement, whilst not material at the killing stage, was certainly considerable in the aftermath.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch · 03/02/2014 06:37

Sangria, the reduction for a guilty plea is up to one third here. I understand RG was reduced from 30 to 16? But I also understand he may be out on parole next year which is 8 years after the murder.

DrankSangriaInThePark · 03/02/2014 06:46

I guess that's similar to the "life" tariff when it never means life. I'm not certain tbh, if his sentence was so short because he confessed or because he went for what is known as "rito abbreviato". These are one-step trials which are done and dusted v quickly, generally speaking when guilt is beyond all doubt from the go-get and the accused is advised to just get on with it. People usually get a reduced sentence for agreeing to a rito abbreviato. Not sure why.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch · 03/02/2014 06:59

I assume because it saves an awful lot of court time and expense!

DrankSangriaInThePark · 03/02/2014 07:02

Yes, I expect so. A quick google shows me it is all done behind closed doors as well.

Snog · 03/02/2014 07:24

Amanda has told too many lies and there are still too many unanswered questions. I think she is still lying and was involved in Meredith's murder.

Bananagio · 03/02/2014 08:00

[applauds Sangria]
If people are that interested in the case then the logical place to start is the report issued by the court. Rather than the pro and anti sites out there which on both sides can sound a bit deranged in their vehemence...or the press (ditto). There are English translations out there.

prh47bridge · 03/02/2014 09:55

Rudy Guede's sentence IIRC was so short (and the Italians are horrified about that too) because he confessed

Wrong. He has never confessed. He maintained his innocence throughout his trial claiming that he had been in the apartment at the time but the murder was committed by an unidentified third party while he was in the bathroom. In his appeal he implicated Knox but continued to insist that he was in the bathroom when the murder was committed. The appeal court reduced his sentence from 30 years to 16 years. We don't know for sure but, unsurprisingly, some people suspect that he was offered a reduced sentence in return for implicating Knox.

DrankSangriaInThePark · 03/02/2014 10:02

Yes, apologies for that prh. Just said that on the other thread.

I was under the impression he had.

CecilyP · 03/02/2014 11:18

And as for Maxine Carr. Well, yes, she wasn't in the county when it happened. But she helped him get rid of the bodies and lied for him, did she not?

No, she did not help Huntly get rid of the bodies. Yes, she did lie. She said she was in the house when the girls called on the Sunday when she was actually in Grimsby. That was the extent of her involvement. But this does show how things get twisted in the media.

alwaysworryingmum · 03/02/2014 12:45

Yes - She was doing cartwheels. She's admitted it. She didn't care about M -housemates that didn't get on - certainly not friends.

AK was shown to have lied about how the police treated her and what happened when they first interviewed her. I 'believe' some of this was recorded.

Yes - She tried to blame an innocent person and then blamed the police interrogation for it.

The Italian police know/believe she's a liar; she's repeatedly lied about them and about things that happened whilst she was in prison.

The Italian Police may be unprofessional/corrupt - and evidence may have been tampered with purposely or accidentally.

There were lies about her and her boyfriends whereabouts at the time surrounding the murder. There were inconsistencies in their stories. Other housemates were suspicious of them.

All we know for certain is that she told quite a few lies. We don't know why she told them.

I think they are guilty of something but I don't think they planned a murder.

TheOneWithTheNicestSmile · 03/02/2014 13:09

actually she denied doing cartwheels (I read that the room wasn't big enough anyway). she admitted doing some stretches

Did she lie about how the police treated her initially? we can't tell. I know they all agree that she did - but they would, wouldn't they? Hmm

& all the other stuff - changing her story, blaming Lumumba - follows on from that.

So either she kept lying - differently - for no good reason; or they are lying about how the wording of her eventual statement came about.

Nancy66 · 03/02/2014 13:11

she denied doing cartwheels in the Diane Saywer interview but did admit that she didn't behave in a 'sensitive' way.

Sollecito expressed his anger to his father at the time at how inappropriately AK was behaving at the police station. Sitting on his lap, kissing him, flirting with police etc.

I do wonder if RS was tempted to ditch AK at that stage and go it alone but, if so, I suspect he would have been persuaded that their story is stronger if they stick together.

Brodicea · 03/02/2014 13:19

The DNA evidence was probably cross-contaminated by the police (my source - the of course reliable wikipedia!). I don't think there's any evidence that she was involved in the actual murder - I think Ak has lied, but I'm not sure why: I wonder if she found her and pretended not to, because she couldn't really cope with it or came in when the murder was being committed but evaded the whole thing. She seems to me like she was in a weird state of shock and had something to feel guilty about - probably not the murder.RS could also have been involved / with her.

I do think the Mail's 'Foxy Knoxy' bollocks really reveals how salacious the whole thing has become.

TheOneWithTheNicestSmile · 03/02/2014 13:25

but RG said she wasn't there to begin with

he also changed his story after spending some time with the police

funny, that

undecidedanduncertain · 03/02/2014 13:30

I do wonder if RS was tempted to ditch AK at that stage and go it alone but, if so, I suspect he would have been persuaded that their story is stronger if they stick together.

Or he was telling the truth about his actions then, and is continuing to do so now. I think it's very unlikely that two people who'd only known each other a couple of weeks would maintain the same 'joint story' over years of separation, imprisonment and legal proceedings. If there was dirt either of them could spill, one of them would have done a deal by now to reduce their own punishment by exposing the other one.

BanishedToPadua · 03/02/2014 13:35

AK may be arrogant, uncaring, selfish, insensitive, unfeeling and inappropriate. I don't know, I have never met her. What I do know is that it is highly unlikely or impossible that she took part in that crime without leaving one trace of her DNA at the crime scene.

Everything else, for me, is irrelevant. Being a drug user, promiscuous, a liar or whatever else she has been labelled does not change that fact. How could she have taken part in this violent and brutal crime without one hair, fibre, fingerprint or DNA placing her there? How? It wasn't cleaned up because RG's traces were all over the room and the body.

TheOneWithTheNicestSmile · 03/02/2014 13:40

from \link{http://groundreport.com/the-murder-of-meredith-kercher/\this blog} (the writer is 'a member of Amanda Knox’s Greater Seattle Area community' so not unbiased but I don't think she can have made up everything she's written)

'By November 10th, Guede was “a person of interest” and the manhunt was on. He was tricked into revealing his whereabouts when the police orchestrated a sting using one of his friends. The Nov. 19, 2007 Skype conversation revealed that he was in Germany and shortly afterward he was apprehended trying to board a train.
Guede was extradited back to Italy on December 6, 2007.
In the Skype call, Guede tells Giacomo Benedetti that he was surprised Amanda had been arrested because “she was not in the house.” He doesn’t even mention Raffaele and then he places himself at the scene by commenting about theft of Meredith’s money admitting that the police “don’t even know the money is missing yet.”'

some of the text of this conversation is reproduced elsewhere online, but not this bit, so I don't know where she got it from.

Nancy66 · 03/02/2014 13:59

if the guilty verdict is upheld at the next stage does that mean RS gos straight to prison? Does he have any appeals left?

Nancy66 · 03/02/2014 14:04

I've seen him in real life. He was at a coffee bar in Santa Monica about two years ago with his partner. They had a dog with them and were laughing a lot and taking pics. Seemed very happy - so not very Sheldon-esque in that sense.

Nancy66 · 03/02/2014 14:05

Oh dear - sorry. The second post is meant for another thread about Sheldon Cooper!!!

DrankSangriaInThePark · 03/02/2014 14:08

RS, Nancy?

Dp was in a bar with him (well, not with him as such) a month or so back. Said he was smaller than he looks on TV.

In theory, yes, if the guilty verdict is upheld then RS goes to jail. This is the stage at which Anna Maria Franzoni (in prison for killing her child) went to prison finally. Another very high profile case, with an important politician as her defence lawyer. Everything is political here. Everything.