To think scouts guides etc

[alicetrefusis]

Are bloody weird. And the adults even more so. The uniforms!I speak as an ex guide ran away- but shit all that weirdly pseudo military stuff.looked at from the outside v disturbing. Also the cannibalistic rites and torture bits of the Christian service awful. Yet look around and church full of daily nail blue rinses and young parents desperate to get em into school, scary,

Monet - what point are you making there?

btw I think the OP is Russell Brand ... nobody else talks like that ..

I find the repeated refrain that if leaders are using Guides religiously they are doing it wrong interesting, I wonder what safeguards are in place to stop such things. Because my daughter was in Rainbows and each time they began and ended with a prayer to 'Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit' about all the things God made, including them, and how they had to be thankful to God. Girls who were not members of the church were repeatedly left out of things, their bullying brushed aside, and only church members were allowed to volunteer. It really crushed DD1's confidence and self image.

Sorry OP, but I think you should be grateful for the leaders who give up their free time to run these groups. It's not just the 2 hours on a Tuesday night or whatever, there is a lot of preparation behind the scenes for camping and badge work. My dad has been a scout leader for years, and despite recent illness still runs a fantastic group. I'd hate to think some silly b*h of a mum was making fun behind his back. Don't you have better things to do than start idiotic threads like this. If you don't like it, don't go.

thespork There is nothing to stop an individual unit using religious wording as part of their regular meetings if the girls want to. When the promise changed, our girls said they were happy with it. Did they want to change the words of the opening song, I asked, to move God out of that too? No, they said, we like it.

I'll ask again when the bulk of that cohort have moved on. Like a lot of children, they love tradition. If your daughter's unhappy, you and she need to say something.

Monet anyone who has a conviction for crimes against children would not be allowed to volunteer. All volunteers need to have been police checked.

If you know that this individual is volunteering in a children's organisation then you MUST call the National Headquarters and ask to speak to the Child Protection Unit, tell them what you know and they will take it from there.

Thanks Jenny. As I've already said, those in authority DO know.

Lottie anyone who has any convictions/cautions related to child protection would not be allowed to volunteer with children.

TheSpork, that sounds just so unlikely and exaggerated. I can believe there were prayers, but the idea that only girls from the church ever got to do anything sounds ridiculous. Children are prone to exaggerate things. I have sometimes found that my daughter says 'everyone is allowed to...' Which on closer inspection, means 2 people. Or she might say 'I am never chosen to....' Which again isn't correct on closer inspection. Parents who unquestioningly accept every word their child says without looking into it more are often the first to complain....and then get egg on their faces.

Of course I do not know about your individual circumstances, but I cannot believe you are suggesting this is what the Scouting and Guiding movements are like. There has been lots of research carried out about the impact of Scouting and Guiding on confidence and later outcomes in life. I knew someone who did a PhD on it. In that study, it was found people involved in Guiding and Scouting into their teens were high achievers at school, had a wide range of interests and were more likely to end up in positions of leadership in the workplace.

I assume you did address your concerns with the Rainbow leaders? Or did you just leave and feel aggrieved?

I went to Brownies and Guides attached to a Catholic church but we went to church about once a year. The nearest DSs' troop get to a church is visits (and they have been to mosques and synagogues too) or the panto in the local church hall.

I am glad DS1 asks to be put down as a vegetarian for camp though, now that I know they're cannibals. He just thought the cheap sausages weren't as tasty as the McCartney ones

Giggling at the Russell Brand comment

Monet how do you know that the national organisation knows?

I don't know. I will have no further involvement due to the risk to myself. But social services were involved with scouts regarding the issue. I won't be posting any more details as it's way too identifiable- in as much as I'll have to name change again.

No, don't talk about it anymore here. If you have any doubts though that the matter is being followed up properly, you really must tell the national organisation or the police. Don't worry about interfering or getting it wrong. If the authorities already know or if all turns out to be nothing, then you will have still done the right thing and the organisations that deal with these kind of concerns know that people don't always know the full story and that many concerns come to nothing.. If you think there is a risk, it really is your duty to voice it.

What I'm saying here applies to any situation where there is a suspicion, not just about Guiding etc. Sadly, concerns will arise in all organisations which deal with large numbers of young people. Fortunately, many concerns turn out to be nothing, but some don't, which is why we must always tell and not wait for someone else to do it.

candy arsed monkey suit

I am so going to use that every day this week. Thank you.

Fine, so you are making light of a strange situation you found yourself in. However, I think your attitude towards those adults who give up their time to work with children pretty grim. I work full time, have DS and DH who want some degree of time and attention, yet I give up around 3 hours a week to run a Beaver pack.
Mind you, I have found the attitude to be sadly representative of the one we encounter in real life too. Those people in "weird" uniforms may not love them the blouses do give you mono-boob but wear them to be identifiable to the children and adults around them, not as a style statement.

Hmmm cannibalistic rites, we've just had a Clay oven made at our district campsite, I was going to treat the Cubs to kleftico, think I'll rejig the menu and see if we can cook up a passing stranger instead.

Scouting now has a promise for atheists, it's had one for different faiths for ages but now is accepting of those of us that worship nothing at all. The only church bits we do is the annual march of respect for Remembrance Day and St George's Day parade, for those of us in England. Pretty sure that would be substituted for St David, St Andrew and St Patrick depending where in the UK you're located. Hardly Christian indoctrination.

Really pleased to be appreciated

Haven't read the whole thread, but wanted to big up our local Cub/Scout leaders, whose patience, tolerance, hard work, fairness, enthusiasm and ability to forgive and forget and move on have helped me to just about, fingers crossed keep my DS on the straight and narrow through some very trying times.

DD's in Brownies. I've just checked with her. She says the only Brownies she's ever eaten are chocolate ones :)

Just a point, but all Guiding volunteers [and I assume Scouts too] are police checked and have to give referees as follows:

"We carry out recruitment checks on all volunteers who work directly with our young members. This includes criminal record disclosure checks, two references and an informal discussion with a local Commissioner – a member of guiding responsible for the management of adults involved in guiding." quoted from girlguiding's web page.

www.girlguiding.org.uk/parents__care/child_safety.aspx for more information.

How much does Brownies cost? DD1 has been asking about going.

Each unit works out how much the subs should be, covering hall rent, cost of activities, badges etc etc....Our local Brownies is £25 per term. Some may be a bit more, some less.

It's the same in Scouting Goldencity. Two referees and a disclosure are mandatory. As is a lot of training. Which is also done in our own time.

There are 35 girls on my waiting list. Eating a few of them would make it more manageable.

We pay £2 per week for Brownies. I think it is amazing value for an hour and half of quality activity. Ours is so cheap as the hall is owned by the Guides, so no rent to pay, although I suppose there are still bills and running costs.
Remember when it was 15p a week when I was a Brownie. It's probably about the same today, in terms of prices and inflation.

Thanks Golden - is that a 6 week school term or a traditional, say "Autumn term" - i.e., September to December?