To have expected this woman to move seats

[appletarts]

I was on the train back from London, with a first class ticket. In the carriage there was one space available for a buggy with a seat facing it, also described as disabled access. I arrived just as a woman was putting her things on the seat, I said excuse me do you think I could put my buggy here? She goes yes but sits down in the seat opposite it. Uh... I said do you think I could have that seat so I can look after my child during the journey and she starts moaning saying she's booked in advance and wants to sit in her booked seat. I asked her does she have a specific need which means she needs this seat, she says no. I said well I'm sure you don't want to meet the needs of my child for three hours do you? How about you let me have that seat so I can look after my DD and if someone comes on a disputes you being in that free seat we'll deal with it then. She then moans more saying she's booked and why is she being made out to be in the wrong, lots of eye rolling and tutting on her part. I say she can sit in 99% of the seats available and I need this 1%, I need this one seat. Eventually she moves but behaves as if she's been evicted and sits with a cats arse face for most of journey sighing everytime my dd dared utter a gurgle. Seriously? Is this unreasonable of me?

calm down seasicksal, your rant is misplaced. I did not say unless a disabled person is a wheelchair user they are less entitled to a seat than a person with a buggy. Read again. Did you read my links too?

there are other seats on a train specifically for people with additional needs. They are bookable, they are appropriate. and rightly so, because i totally agree with you about the rights of all to travel in comfort and safety regardless of their circumstances.

but the area we're are talking about is the only place on a train where a person who uses a wheelchair can sit with a companion or if it's not needed for that purpose then a mother with a buggy can sit with her child.

i really think all this talk of the woman having a hidden disability is just a massive red herring and a stick to beat a mouthy OP with.

The issue is that public transport should be more accessible to all
Including perfectly ordinary business people who book their tickets and reserve their seats.

OP, you probably don't need to hear this again but I'm afraid YABU!

I think Worra has it right. You were very rude and pretty patronising discussing your rights in that way. I can see why you would've liked to have used that seat and some people in the other woman's shoes might have given you the seat but you went very over the top with her.

I asked her does she have a specific need which means she needs this seat, she says no

I would have replied "Do YOU have a specific need which means you need this seat? Yes? Well you should have fucking booked it then

:)

I apologise for the violent sentiments but this sort of attitude winds me up no end esp OP being entitled, asking woman re her needs, expecting/turfing a paying customer out of her seat and then to be rude and nasty about the paying customer.

And I feel for travelling mothers and would help out mostly by moving etc. there's no way I wouldn't.

This has just wound me up a lot plus lack of sleep last night etc

A mother can sit with her child on any seat on the train assuming she has paid the correct rail fare. The red herring is the idea that a child can't be removed from a buggy.

Fathers, cousins, grandparents, friends and siblings are also able to sit anywhere on a train with a baby or toddler.

Hi there,

Thanks for your reports. We've been through the thread to delete personal attacks, but please report any you think we've missed.

Personal attacks eh on a mum trying to care for her child on public transport, now you should be ashamed of yourselves. I must be a thoroughly decent person because I would ALWAYS give up my seat to a person with a greater need than me, irrespective of whether I had booked it or not, and indeed have sat on teh floor in a corridor in my pre-child days so a woman with children could have a seat. I think the way this thread has turned out is an insight into the mass mind, and it isn't pretty.

I think your problem is that you assume you have a greater need because you have a child. Unfortunately you should've booked the seat.

Oh now you are over-egging it a bit op.

Have you actually read the thread?

Thoroughly decent people book seats on trains. They don't not bother and then expect those who have taken the trouble to book to move for them. Thoroughly decent people don't go on MN crowing about 'victories' over other people and also slagging them off.

Those are just two things that thoroughly decent people definitely don't do.

You're heroic only in your own deluded, oblivious little head. In the real world, you're a self absorbed, entitled, irritating parent who expects the whole world to stop for them, bullies strangers and gives the rest of us a bad name.

A normal person will fold their buggy and sit their baby/toddler on their lap or if there's room the seat beside or in front facing them. That you can't manage that is your problem, it shouldn't be anyone else's.

yabvvvvvvu.

Oh please op don't play the wounded victim come earth mother card, it really doesn't fit with you actions in the incident or your interactions on this thread.

merrymouse, yes ofcourse a child can be removed from the buggy. But that doesn't change the fact that it's easier to leave a buggy unfolded than not. and that it's more comfortable, safer, easier and less stressful to look after your child on a train journey whilst sitting by their buggy than not. Not that the child will be in the buggy the entire time, but they can go in there to sleep, to eat if necessary, to give the mother the opportunity to do something hands free etc.

Yes, it's not impossible to sit with a baby on your knee on a train, and for some it may even be as easy to do this. But if we're assuming some hidden disability on the part of the woman sat in the companion seat, let's assume some onto the struggling mother too. Perhaps some of you find it no big deal to fold a buggy and look after your child on your knee, but perhaps the OP or someone like her has PND, or anxiety, or OCD, or agoraphobia or is just not as good as some of you at being a mum in public and feels she needs the buggy to help her. Why does your compassion and ability to imagine hidden disabilities extend to the stranger but not the mother?

appletarts I sympathise with your predicament (buggy plus child on train). Indeed, I empathise, especially as I have a v young child and v painful joints.
I expect the tone of your post (and your approach to this lady) is what has set people off more than anything.
Personal attacks are unkind of course.

You should have booked, OP. Your actions come across as rude and entitled.

I'm getting on a train in a little over an hour. I have booked seats for myself and my DS. If someone tries to get us to move from our booked seats they will get short shrift because they, like us, could easily have booked seats. If they didn't bother then them's the breaks.

Appletarts, you would never think that someone had a greater need than you though would you? You come across as someone who would always think her own needs were more important that someone else. You can say you'd do it but I think it would be fairly rare you would actually recognize someone with greater needs.

And yours weren't 'needs' they were 'wants'. Big difference.

She
Gave
You
The
Seat

OP, the "insight into the mass mind" that's been revealed in this thread is that the vast majority of posters think you are very unreasonable. But your preening self regard prevents you from seeing it.

The insight is surely, if you want a favour, ask nicely, accept a no, be grateful for a yes.

Well exactly, zombies.

Had OP said, "I asked this woman to do me a big favour, despite the fact that she'd gone to the trouble to book a seat and I couldn't be arsed," she'd have got a whole different reception.

Instead of "AIBU to expect this woman to move" followed by whinging that the woman had dared to object, and complaining that she behaved like she'd been evicted!

Ahhhhhh poor OP, me thinks you thought everyone would agree with you...

And grateful isn't defined by starting a thread complaining about cats-bum-facery.